# Why don't police in CA chases use rifles from helicopters? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 25, 2004, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177 "2004-06-25T14:19:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![kennybath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e68b1a/32.png) [@kennybath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kennybath)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/1 "2004-06-25T14:19:16Z")
You always see these long car chases that go on for many miles and endanger peoples lives. Why don’t they have a sniper in the helicopter. Then when he can get off a good shot, put a few rounds through the hood and into the engine block of the car. That would most likely stop it cold. Yes, it’s not without some “danger” but having idiots on freeways at 100mph for a good hour or two while being chased is kind of dangerous too. ---
**Author:** ![Papermache\_Prince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f05b48/32.png) [@Papermache\_Prince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Papermache_Prince)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/2 "2004-06-25T14:32:07Z")
I imagine firing a rifle from a helicopter, with the kind of accuracy required to hit a moving automobile, is virtually impossible. ---
**Author:** ![Unregistered\_Bull](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3da27b/32.png) [@Unregistered\_Bull](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unregistered_Bull)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/3 "2004-06-25T14:39:16Z")
It’s impossible to make an accurate shot from a moving unstable platform at a moving unstable target. Hitting a house or business close to the freeway or fellow officers is quite possible. Chases have been stopped from shotgun shots to tires and even .223 rifle fire. But usually only when in a ‘safe’ location. Sometimes varmit control is done from the air. And when someone shoots coyotes from a small plane, a 12 gauge shotgun firing small buckshot or large birdshot is usually used in order to reliablely hit the animal. It’s also done in the middle of nowhere and at closer distances. ---
**Author:** ![Unregistered\_Bull](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3da27b/32.png) [@Unregistered\_Bull](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unregistered_Bull)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/4 "2004-06-25T14:41:05Z")
I should add from vehicle to vehicle and at roadblocks and not from the air in the case of chases being stopped. ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/5 "2004-06-25T14:54:45Z")
The cameras currently used in helicopters are really good. Auto-stabilization and stuff that makes them way better than a sniper hanging out the window. ---
**Author:** ![P\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a587f6/32.png) [@P\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P_T)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/6 "2004-06-25T15:13:02Z")
> [@SmackFu](#): > > The cameras currently used in helicopters are really good. Auto-stabilization and stuff that makes them way better than a sniper hanging out the window. Could we not use that same technology to affix it to a sniper rifle? I’m all for it. ---
**Author:** ![nocturnal\_tick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/3d9bf3/32.png) [@nocturnal\_tick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nocturnal_tick)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/7 "2004-06-25T15:23:37Z")
> [@kennybath](#): > > Yes, it’s not without some “danger” but having idiots on freeways at 100mph for a good hour or two while being chased is kind of dangerous too. Just to give you an idea of the “danger” you describe. Let’s say that your helicopter is what, 500 feet in the air. Call the helicopter H, the car C, and the ground below the helicopter G. Now lets assume, for simplicity that the angle HCG is 45º, (i.e the sniper is aiming 45º below the horizontal). The sniper is all aimed up and just as he fires a gust of wind throws him off by one degree (in reality it could be several more. At that height the distance between H and C is: A² + B² = C² ==\> 500² + 500² = C² ==\> C = 707(.106…) feet So one degree out means that round is going to be: (sine rule) 707/sin 89º = X/sin 1º ==\> X = 707 sin 1º / sin 89º = **12.34 feet!!** :eek: That’s the difference between hitting that car and hitting a bystander. ---
**Author:** ![keeper0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b19c9b/32.png) [@keeper0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keeper0)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/8 "2004-06-25T15:25:19Z")
> [@SmackFu](#): > > The cameras currently used in helicopters are really good. Auto-stabilization and stuff that makes them way better than a sniper hanging out the window. Now, presumably you could mount a rifle on a stabilization platform. Military helicopters have this technology, I believe. The idea of the police flying around in a gun-ship starts to feel a little bit to much like “Escape from New York” for my tastes. It also doesn’t account for the fact that you have a net crosswind of up to 100 mph at the barrel of the rifle, which makes a precision shot very hard. Heck, winds of 10 to 20 mph make a precision shot very hard. 100 mph would make it impossible. Plus, you have a car moving at 60 mph or 88 ft/sec. A bullet from a high powered rifle travels at about 3000 ft/s. I am not a sharpshooter, but I presume you wouldn’t want to lead your target by more than 5 feet. (Any more than that would seem hard to judge precisely.) The car travels 5 feet in 0.09 seconds. So, you would have to shoot from (3000 \* 0.09) = 272 feet away. Not quite 100 yards. That doesn’t seem like the nice “stand-off” distance that you were envisioning. So, you would need to have the pilot hover the helicopter to minimize wind. Look through a monitor at the target image from the rifle on the steadicam platform. Figure out how far away the car will be when you take your shot, knowing that every error of 30 feet in distance estimation will change your hit location by a foot. None of which deals with the potential explosion from a gun shot into a gasoline powered car, the possible loss of control by the driver after impact. I’ll stick with spike strips that still let the driver steer after disabling the tires. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/9 "2004-06-25T15:40:32Z")
The technique you describe is very difficult but NOT impossible. Mark Bowden in “Blackhawk Down” describes how a Delta Force Sniper disabled a wanted warlords car from a helicopter affecting his arrest. In the book, Bowden describes it as an amazing shot only capable of being performed by a world class marksman. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/10 "2004-06-25T15:45:40Z")
> [@keeper0](#): > > Now, presumably you could mount a rifle on a stabilization platform. Military helicopters have this technology, I believe. Of course, if the fire from a military helicopter is a little off-target, that’s merely “collateral damage.” Would we be willing to accept that in, say, Pasadena. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/11 "2004-06-25T15:57:16Z")
Perhaps more to the point, cops tend not to shoot at people who aren’t shooting at them. They also don’t shoot at people who are just trying to get away, because cops have a lot of other resources to apprehend people than just guns. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/12 "2004-06-25T16:08:41Z")
Besides all the reasons listed above, the Number One reason cops don’t shoot cars is because if they did, it would deprive us Californians of one of our favorite passtimes: watching high-speed chases on TV! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bongmaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Bongmaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bongmaster)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/13 "2004-06-25T16:10:59Z")
It would only take one or two national incidents of bystanders being killed by a cop’s bullet bouncing off the street to end the program. ---
**Author:** ![awldune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c77e96/32.png) [@awldune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/awldune)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/14 "2004-06-25T16:15:46Z")
There was a show on the History channel (_Guts & Bolts_, IIRC) where they showed the method the Coast Guard uses to stop souped-up speedboats. They have a 50-cal sniper rifle with some kind of fancy laser sighting, which they fire from a helicopter. Some important differences in the situation though: Speedboats tend to drive in a straight line No big deal if a shot misses Helicopters in cities have to keep a greater altitude Even so, it seems like similar tech ought to work on cars, especially in combination with a gyro-stabilized gun mount. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/15 "2004-06-25T16:23:20Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Of course, if the fire from a military helicopter is a little off-target, that’s merely “collateral damage.” > > Would we be willing to accept that in, say, Pasadena. I would! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/16 "2004-06-25T17:01:50Z")
I would suspect that if the cop in the chopper missed badly enough, he might just hit a pursuing police vehicle. Or the pursuing police vehicle’s occupants or operator. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/17 "2004-06-25T17:39:53Z")
> [@](#): > > So, you would need to have the pilot hover the helicopter to minimize wind. And there’s another problem. Ever been under a helicopter taking off or landing? Or stick an arm out the window of one in the air? There’s a lot of downdraft. And I’ve never fired a sniper rifle outside of a computer game, but I can’t imagine that’d do wonders for accuracy, either. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/18 "2004-06-25T17:47:16Z")
I just want to remind everyone that virtually any day of the year, we can go to Great Debates and there will be a thread on the first page where Dopers are arguing whether it was even possible for Oswald to hit a target in a car moving at less than 5 mph, from six stories up, while using a nice, stable windowsill to steady the gun. ---
**Author:** ![bughunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@bughunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bughunter)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/19 "2004-06-25T18:00:25Z")
Well, since accuracy is difficult to achieve and maintain with a projectile from a helicopter platform, then what if they eschewed projectiles… …and used EMP to stop a fleeing vehicle? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Controvert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dec6dc/32.png) [@The\_Controvert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Controvert)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2004, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177/20 "2004-06-25T18:10:09Z")
Wouldn’t it be better to have a smaller, romotely piloted helicopter or other vehicle get right up alongside the suspect and shoot them from there? Or easier yet, just have one of the pursuing officers disable the car, either by shooting out the tires or tasering it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-police-in-ca-chases-use-rifles-from-helicopters/252177.md?page=2)