Why don't they just seal up the Fukushima nuclear leak the same way as chernobyl?

[Chronos]

Quoth si_blakely:

That is true, but it is also the case that the Fukushima incident is nothing like Chernobyl in terms of damage and radiation release, so the responses are totally different.

Oh, certainly. The lesson everyone should be learning from Fukushima is how incredibly safe nuclear power is, when done right (i.e., unlike Chernobyl in every conceivable way).

[Snickers]

Yeah. Chernobyl is pretty much exactly the “what not to do” poster child of nuclear catastrophes. I don’t doubt that Fukushima is dangerous, but at least they seem to be going about it with a) as much transparency as is feasible and b) concern for their workers and employees.

[Learjeff]

Sigh.

My father, who watches too much Fox News, was totally pro-nuke before Fukushima. When that happened, he went anti-Nuke. I asked him what we learned from Fukushima that we didn’t know before. His answer was that they’re not safe!

Sigh.

The real annoying part is that my father is an intelligent guy (top 1%), and well-educated (patent attorney). And yet, no clue.

[john44]

@njtt

And then, without coolant, the rods melt and all the material goes directly into the groundwater. They are not trying to cool them just for fun.

The rods have already melted, that happened in the first week. There is no need to cool them anymore the damage has been done. The rods do not just melt all the way down to the earths core, they stop in the dirt just as they did in Chernobyl. Trying to cool them is just pointless at this point and is actually harmful because of all the radioactive water that is leaking into the groundwater and the sea. Not to mention the radioactive steam and particles drifting all the way to California.

[levdrakon]

@Chronos

Another big difference is that unlike Chernobyl, Fukushima is on one of the most densely-populated islands on the planet. It’s simply not possible to abandon a 100-mile radius around it, or whatever the distance was for Chernobyl.

Abandoning a 100-mile radius zone around nuke power plants is such a warm and fuzzy capitalist nuclear profit plan. And what could go wrong? Oh yeah, the earth’s oceans are teensy bit more than that, and affect a teensy bit more people than that.

Oh hey, we’ve got like 250 of these things all over, and nuke proponents want approximately 10,000 more. Goody!

[XT]

@john44

The rods have already melted, that happened in the first week. There is no need to cool them anymore the damage has been done. The rods do not just melt all the way down to the earths core, they stop in the dirt just as they did in Chernobyl. Trying to cool them is just pointless at this point and is actually harmful because of all the radioactive water that is leaking into the groundwater and the sea. Not to mention the radioactive steam and particles drifting all the way to California.

Maybe you should go and tell all those experts on site dealing with the problem this stunning news! I think they really need your expertise on this and your sage advice, since they seem to be missing all of this obvious stuff!

[levdrakon]

@XT

Maybe you should go and tell all those experts on site dealing with the problem this stunning news! I think they really need your expertise on this and your sage advice, since they seem to be missing all of this obvious stuff!

They’re calling for foreign help, so it’s pretty obvious free-market corporatism really sucks at the not preventing nuclear meltdowns and exposing the entire planet to their profit-driven ineptitude thing.

[Darth_Panda]

@levdrakon

They’re calling for foreign help, so it’s pretty obvious free-market corporatism really sucks at the not preventing nuclear meltdowns and exposing the entire planet to their profit-driven ineptitude thing.

Yes, clearly communism has a much better record with nuclear safety. :smack:

[BrotherCadfael]

@aruvqan

the men assigned to work abatement called themselves ‘bio-robots’. I guess you would call it black humor at it’s best.

Of course, in the original Czech, “robot” means “worker”, so it’s technically not incorrect…

[levdrakon]

@Darth_Panda

Yes, clearly communism has a much better record with nuclear safety. :smack:

Who said communism? Oh yeah. You did. Whatevs.

Next?

[Darth_Panda]

@levdrakon

Who said communism? Oh yeah. You did. Whatevs.

Next?

I can’t have another turn?

[levdrakon]

@Darth_Panda

I can’t have another turn?

Go for it! I think the Navy does a pretty good job of keeping nuke subs from blowing up, for what it’s worth. Is that communist?

Actually, the military is pretty commie. I liked that about it when I was in. It’s pretty benevolent, most of the time, but it has oversight.

[Darth_Panda]

@levdrakon

Go for it! I think the Navy does a pretty good job of keeping nuke subs from blowing up, for what it’s worth. Is that communist?

Actually, the military is pretty commie. I liked that about it when I was in. It’s pretty benevolent, most of the time, but it has oversight.

Well, we can definitely agree that oversight is a very good thing. I’m happy to leave it at that.

[Chronos]

Yeah, contaminating the entire planet, or even a 100-mile radius, would be really bad. It’s a good thing that Fukushima was well-enough designed to prevent that from happening.

[Martin_Hyde]

@levdrakon

Go for it! I think the Navy does a pretty good job of keeping nuke subs from blowing up, for what it’s worth. Is that communist?

Actually, the military is pretty commie. I liked that about it when I was in. It’s pretty benevolent, most of the time, but it has oversight.

Let’s actually address your real point, that someone “profit-driven free market” electric utilities are not trustworthy enough to run nuclear power plants.

It’s a very poor argument for a few reasons (as is your reference to the Navy-everything they use is manufactured and designed primarily by profit driven companies):

1. State run nuclear facilities have a bad record as well: see Chernobyl. Also, the overwhelming evidence is that the commercial nuclear power industry has had almost a perfect record when it comes to nuclear safety (like any utility they have variable “normal” safety records covering things like ordinary OSHA style workplace safety and etc.)

2. The electric industry is a very poor one to target if you have a hate-on for free market capitalism. In most of the world (from what I can tell this includes Japan) it is actually explicitly not free market, but instead is dominated by corporations that are guaranteed protection from competition and exclusive operating districts. In exchange they are highly regulated, not just in their operations but even in what rates they can charge to customers. For this reason I think it’s strange to talk of free market economics at all in this matter, TEPCO was spun off from the former State power monopoly along with nine other companies, and by and large its electric operations would be defined as “heavily regulated monopoly.” It is thus unlikely anything would be done differently if it was State run.

3. As for your comment about the Navy, the U.S. military has actually had more partial nuclear meltdowns than the civilian nuclear power industry.

[aruvqan]

@levdrakon

They’re calling for foreign help, so it’s pretty obvious free-market corporatism really sucks at the not preventing nuclear meltdowns and exposing the entire planet to their profit-driven ineptitude thing.

You do realize that working in a nuke plant as something other than a clerical worker or general labor [hey you, carry this over here and go paint that wall then take out the trash] tends to require a fair amount of fairly specialized training?

Hell, just to badge in on my third site for a company I worked for I had to take the same health and safety/CFR training yet again Every single time I had to get a badge to work on a site I had to take the same training. I used to be able to quote the assorted 10CFRs pertaining to the job verbatim.

[XT]

@levdrakon

They’re calling for foreign help, so it’s pretty obvious free-market corporatism really sucks at the not preventing nuclear meltdowns and exposing the entire planet to their profit-driven ineptitude thing.

What’s this got to do with what I said? Are you claiming (in GQ) that ‘free market’ engineers ARE missing the following?

[QUOTE=john44]
The rods have already melted, that happened in the first week. There is no need to cool them anymore the damage has been done. The rods do not just melt all the way down to the earths core, they stop in the dirt just as they did in Chernobyl. Trying to cool them is just pointless at this point and is actually harmful because of all the radioactive water that is leaking into the groundwater and the sea. Not to mention the radioactive steam and particles drifting all the way to California.
[/QUOTE]

If so, then cite? If not then, well, your mini-rant about free market capitalism is pretty irrelevant and pointless.

[johnpost]

5.3-magnitude earthquake hits Japan’s Fukushima

A 5.3-magnitude earthquake has hit the Japanese prefecture that is home to the nuclear power plant crippled in the March 2011 earthquake and tsunami.

…

Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe on Thursday ordered TEPCO to scrap all six reactors at the Fukushima Dai-ichi plant and concentrate on tackling pressing issues like leaks of radioactive water.

…

http://news.yahoo.com/-5-3-magnitude-earthquake-hits-japan-s-fukushima-184440374.html