# Why don't they know what caused the blackout? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 16, 2003, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520 "2003-08-16T02:32:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DaveRaver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daveraver/32/1078_2.png) [@DaveRaver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaveRaver)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/1 "2003-08-16T02:32:17Z")
How come they still don’t know what caused the Blackout of '03? And how can they rule out terrorism if they still don’t know what caused it? Do they know more than they are telling us? ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/2 "2003-08-16T02:47:02Z")
I think what they’re trying to say is: Look people, we know that this isn’t a terrorist act, but will still don’t know what caused it. Basically, they’ve ruled out terrorism and they are still looking for a reason. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/3 "2003-08-16T08:07:01Z")
You must have been watching the CBC news. The Prime Minister or some other important guy said “Since when have you ever known the Americans to admit they caused anything.” (said after it was said the Canadians caused it) ---
**Author:** ![jiHymas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@jiHymas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jiHymas)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/4 "2003-08-16T15:57:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Markxxx \* > \*\*The Prime Minister or some other important guy said “Since when have you ever known the Americans to admit they caused anything.” (said after it was said the Canadians caused it) \*\* That was Mel Lastman, Mayor of Toronto, who is not an important guy. Don’t worry about him - he’s a clown nobody here’s taken seriously for a few years now. He isn’t running in the November election, thank heavens. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/5 "2003-08-16T16:30:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DaveRaver \* > \*\*How come they still don’t know what caused the Blackout of '03? And how can they rule out terrorism if they still don’t know what caused it? Do they know more than they are telling us? \*\* Well, if it was terrorism, they most likely wouldn’t be able to get the power back on quite so quickly. As for why they haven’t been able to figure out what caused it, that’s pretty simple: There’s thousands of miles of wires, circuits, and who knows what else out there that have to be checked before they can say what caused it. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/6 "2003-08-16T17:05:53Z")
The whole cascade of failures seems to have gone down within three minutes from what I read. I assume the events connected to the original cause happened in the first few seconds of that. Now the data needed to reconstruct the sequence are probably logged by diverse control systems run by regional utiilities and/or in more centralized monitoring systems that get their data from local monitoring devices calling in via data or telephone lines (the co. I work at has done both of these kinds of systems). All these logs need to be collated to determine cause and effect. A complicating factor is that for local logs you must make sure that the internal clock of the logging system was synchronized correctly (a few seconds early and late would make a difference here when collating with other logs), and for centralized logs communications/processing delays and possibly polling periods must be taken into account. It’s not as if that there is necessarily any damaged equipment at all, e.g. a smoking transformer somewhere for the media to converge on. I’d guess that is was the lack of any report of a fire or explosion that made the government announce it was not terrorism. Very likely all devices protecting power stations, transformers, switchgear, high voltage lines etc. tripped correctly, leaving the grid like a person with whom there isn’t anything wrong except that he is dead. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Cobweb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7c8e57/32.png) [@Dr.Cobweb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Cobweb)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/7 "2003-08-16T17:31:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jiHymas \* > **he’s a clown nobody here’s taken seriously for a few years now.** So he doesn’t really differ much from Chretien, in other words. ---
**Author:** ![rsa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@rsa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rsa)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/8 "2003-08-16T17:38:47Z")
It appears that the investigating is focusing on a potion of the grid in Ohio. > **[MSNBC News - Breaking News and News Today | Latest News](https://www.msnbc.com/)** > > MSNBC breaking news and the latest news for today. Get daily news from local news reporters and world news updates with live audio & video from our team. > [@](#): > > MICHEHL GENT, PRESIDENT of the North American Electric Reliability Council, or NERC, said in a conference call with reporters that investigators had determined that a section of the power grid known as the Lake Erie loop experienced a “oscillating power phenomenon” that lasted nine or 10 seconds at the outset of Thursday’s outage. > That event — which saw a 300 megawatt eastward flow of electricity quickly reverse into a 500 megawatt flow to the west — caused other transmission lines and power plants on the grid to shut down as protection systems automatically disconnected them to prevent damaging equipment, he said. > Gent cautioned that the investigation is in the early stages and said the team of experts he is assembling may not be able to pinpoint the cause until next week. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/9 "2003-08-16T17:39:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Markxxx \* > \*\*You must have been watching the CBC news. The Prime Minister or some other important guy said “Since when have you ever known the Americans to admit they caused anything.” (said after it was said the Canadians caused it) \*\* Politicians on both sides are ignorant of matters techicnical, they have mandarins to give them a brief synopsis of whats wrong and whos to blame, see senator rodham ,and in this case it was blame america , or blame canada. At one point on Toronto radio , I had heard that mayor smokin bloomberg had said Toronto was to blame , but when I read the new york post later , he actually said something about transmission grid in Quebec, go figure. Declan ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2003, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-they-know-what-caused-the-blackout/195520/10 "2003-08-16T22:03:44Z")
Well, for one thing, I imagine that the people with the expertise needed to figure what went wrong are busy getting the power back on. Also, the blackout started two days ago. Working out what’s wrong with a power grid that stretches from Cleveland to New York to Toronto will take time.