# Why don't we just build more prisons? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 7, 2010, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231 "2010-04-07T02:59:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/1 "2010-04-07T02:59:09Z")
I know it sounds naive and simplistic, but it seems to me to be a good idea. The problems creating more prisons would address are significant, out of control, and (I would hope) a high priority to most thinking persons. The answer, of course, is money. Money to build, money to maintain, money to staff. We pay outrageous taxes for all sorts of shit, much of which we are against, much of which benefits us not at all. I have to believe that most citizens would not revolt against the notion of more tax dollars being earmarked for prisons. Then, of course, we eliminate early parole (who thought that was a good idea, by the way?). We send a message to the criminally minded - career criminals, in particular. We get the trash off the street. What could be more important for our society? ---
**Author:** ![DxZero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@DxZero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DxZero)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/2 "2010-04-07T03:04:52Z")
And where would we put these prisons? ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/3 "2010-04-07T03:07:15Z")
We already have one of the highest incarceration rates in the world. ([Cite](http://www.publiceye.org/defendingjustice/pdfs/factsheets/9-Fact%20Sheet%20-%20US%20vs%20World.pdf)) and you’re proposing putting _more_ people in jail? And what evidence do you have that longer sentences reduce crime? (re: your comment about “sending a message to criminals”) As far as I know, they don’t. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/4 "2010-04-07T03:08:07Z")
The U.S.A. already has the highest incarceration rate in the world. Are you under the impression that this is a good thing? I have an alternative proposal that I think is much better. Why don’t we build fewer prisons, tear down (or repurpose) many of those that we have, and spend all the money we save on policing, social programs, education, and other measures that will prevent crime, instead of shutting the jailhouse door after the horse has bolted? ETA: This one surely belongs in Great Debates. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/5 "2010-04-07T03:10:55Z")
This subject is more appropriate for Great Debates than GQ. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/6 "2010-04-07T03:12:51Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > We get the trash off the street. This is the problem right there, this attitude - we define too many behaviors as criminal (drug addiction) - then we define the individual as a “criminal” (trash) who must be disposed of. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/7 "2010-04-07T03:19:15Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > This is the problem right there, this attitude - we define too many behaviors as criminal (drug addiction) - then we define the individual as a “criminal” (trash) who must be disposed of. Then there are also those with mental illness. They don’t get support and medication, so they end up on the streets. They must be “trash” too. Just incarcerate them at a tremendous cost (more than it would cost to help them) This makes sense right? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/8 "2010-04-07T03:35:16Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > What could be more important for our society? Tax cuts? ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/9 "2010-04-07T03:42:26Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > What could be more important for our society? Education? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/10 "2010-04-07T03:45:46Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > What could be more important for our society? Caring for, and about, each other? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/11 "2010-04-07T03:46:27Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > What could be more important for our society? Conquering other countries? ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/12 "2010-04-07T03:47:29Z")
More prisons? One new prison opens in America [every week](http://www.nybooks.com/articles/23382). ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/13 "2010-04-07T03:52:39Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > We pay outrageous taxes for all sorts of shit, much of which we are against, much of which benefits us not at all. What? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/14 "2010-04-07T03:54:10Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Caring for, and about, each other? That’s great. I’m touched. Now, define how this is going to happen. Not that I don’t appreciate the sentiment, but platitudes like that are for celebrities lying in bed for the cameras or groups of people with all the money in the world that have no qualms about asking you to donate yours. I agree with the general sentiment that we need to build fewer prisons, not more, and that some things are not worthy of jail time. Unfortunately for us, we are not in the position to make those judgments, It is much more expedient for us to put people away than it is to deal with the problems that put them away. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/15 "2010-04-07T04:08:16Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > I agree with the general sentiment that we need to build fewer prisons, not more, and that some things are not worthy of jail time. Unfortunately for us, we are not in the position to make those judgments, It is much more expedient for us to put people away than it is to deal with the problems that put them away. How can this be? You are the wealthiest nation on the planet. There are other less wealthy countries with less crime, less of the relevant problems and less prisons. It’s a feature of your particular social attitudes (see the OP) not expediency or inability. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/16 "2010-04-07T04:17:35Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > That’s great. I’m touched. Yeah, I can tell. For the record, though,I don’t do cheap platitudes. > [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Now, define how this is going to happen. Spend some off time donating time at a soup kitchen or food bank. Become a Scoutmaster or Girl Scout leader. Know your neighbors. Volunteer at a local hospital. Donate books and/or time and/or money to afterschool programs. Rather than bitch about how local politicians aren’t doing enough for your community, become a local politician and do something for your community. Become involved in your Neighborhood Watch program. _Start_ your Neighborhood Watch program. Volunteer at the local Y. Do one of these things, or all of these things, but get off your ass and do _something_. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/17 "2010-04-07T04:31:05Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > That’s great. I’m touched. > > Now, define how this is going to happen. Not that I don’t appreciate the sentiment, but platitudes like that are for celebrities lying in bed for the cameras or groups of people with all the money in the world that have no qualms about asking you to donate yours. > I agree with the general sentiment that we need to build fewer prisons, not more, and that some things are not worthy of jail time. Unfortunately for us, we are not in the position to make those judgments, It is much more expedient for us to put people away than it is to deal with the problems that put them away. And maybe it shouldn’t be. There was a time when our Congressmen and state legislators represented us, giving intelligent voice to the views of their constituents – or what those views would likely be if the constituents had all the facts that the elected person has. When it’s easier to adopt an image of “tough on crime” than to say, “Let’s get rid of laws that over 50% of the people violate the majority of the time, and then focus on the things that are really causing problems in our communities,” you get the result we have. When it’s easier to give equal time to people bemoaning “able bodied welfare mothers” than to look at the problems causing poverty, what we get is sound bites and resentment. Identify the problems, identify the ways to best fix them, then implement those steps. True, there will be some unforeseen consequences, but intelligent planning should foresee many of those consequences, and modify the plans to take them into account. Get legislators who are less interested in perpetuating their poloitical power than in being the representatives of their constituents, and half the problem is solved. One way to do this is a public groundswell of support for non-partisan redistricting boards sensitive to local differences but not interested in perpetuating a district from which Congressman Phogbound can be reliably re-elected. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/18 "2010-04-07T04:37:36Z")
You attack your own idea as naive and simplistic before even addressing it. Take it seriously for a moment: you’ve made a positive decision to intentionally and unilaterally increase your nation’s prison population for all crimes across the board without stating the goal you’re seeking to accomplish. Most governments that do this do so by incremental increases in punishments for particular crimes that society views as particularly harmful at any given moment, but the proposal on the table is to simply build more prisons and put more people in them for all crimes across the board. What is the problem you’re looking to solve? Drugs? Violence? Sexual violence? Property crime? Homicide? Are you increasing punishments for any of these offenses? All of them? ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/19 "2010-04-07T04:41:05Z")
Or we could just free all the people arrested for victimless crimes. Presto, plenty of space now. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231/20 "2010-04-07T04:47:28Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > We pay outrageous taxes for all sorts of shit, much of which we are against, much of which benefits us not at all. Like putting people in jail for using drugs. Wait a minute- that gives me an even better idea. Why not let people out of jail if they’re not a threat and stop locking these people up in the future? Then we might not need so many prisons in the first place. I know it sounds naive and simplistic but it would work and it wouldn’t be stupid. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-we-just-build-more-prisons/535231.md?page=2)