# Why don't you support Bernie Sanders? (if you don't) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 17, 2019, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632 "2019-06-17T02:58:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/381 "2019-09-04T20:18:28Z")
> [@Barack\_Obama](#): > > Conservative studies found M4A saving the US 2-5 trillion dollars. Are you talking about Gerald Friedman? He’s your idea of a conservative? > [@](#): > > We could list off dozens if not hundreds of bills by Bernie that would be good for the economy. Ok, let’s start with 20. I won’t ask for hundreds. > [@](#): > > Yes, just like trump ignored congress and eliminated veteran student debts, if congress is unwilling to do their job then we should immediately eliminate student and medical debt. Great, trade a right wing dictator for a left wing one. > [@](#): > > But considering the house has already been proposing things like H.R.1384, I’m fairly certain within a sanders presidency we can get these bills through congress once the corrupt corporatists on both sides are voted out. I bet you’re one of those people who think that the Squad is responsible for flipping the house from Red to Blue. They aren’t. > [@](#): > > If you think someone can be too old to be president, then you must also concede you can be too old to vote. How about we take everybody who’s over the age of 35’s right to vote away? That sounds pretty good to me. Do you think this is a convincing argument to anyone? I mean, do you sit back and write crap like this and then say, “A-HA! I got them with this one!” I would very seriously like a response to whether you think you nailed anyone with this really, really dumb argument you just posted. > [@](#): > > Obama would have beaten trump, correct? So why did hillary lose? Did you forget that Obama beat Hillary? Call me completely nuts, but it probably boils down to something simple like this: Obama \> Trump \> Hillary ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/382 "2019-09-04T22:30:49Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I bet you’re one of those people who think that the Squad is responsible for flipping the house from Red to Blue. They aren’t. Such an important point that can’t be emphasized enough. > [@Emily\_Litella](#): > > To Septimus’s post #374: Bernie’s Medicare for All bill implements the changes over 4 years by lowering the Medicare eligibility age to 55 in the first year, 45 in the second year, 35 in the third year, then everyone else after that. I have heard him say this, and that might be a great plan if he were going for actual Medicare for all as proposed by presidential candidate Santos in the final season of “The West Wing” (for those who didn’t see it, the entire proposal was to remove the age restrictions from the Medicare legislation). But Bernie’s bill is actually quite different from Medicare other than borrowing the name, so this makes no sense in reality. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2019, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/383 "2019-09-08T23:50:28Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Are you talking about Gerald Friedman? He’s your idea of a conservative? > > Ok, let’s start with 20. I won’t ask for hundreds. > > Great, trade a right wing dictator for a left wing one. > > I bet you’re one of those people who think that the Squad is responsible for flipping the house from Red to Blue. They aren’t. > > Do you think this is a convincing argument to anyone? I mean, do you sit back and write crap like this and then say, “A-HA! I got them with this one!” > > I would very seriously like a response to whether you think you nailed anyone with this really, really dumb argument you just posted. > > Did you forget that Obama beat Hillary? Call me completely nuts, but it probably boils down to something simple like this: > > Obama \> Trump \> Hillary Rebuild America Act Employ Young Americans Now Act Paycheck Fairness Act Corporate Tax Dodging Prevention Act Medicare For All Social Security Expansion Act College for All Act Student Loan Debt Forgiveness (I forgot the actual name of the bill, Warren has a very similar bill) and no I don’t think the “squad” is why the house flipped, I think more people went out and voted because they were tired of the bullshit the republican and democratic party kept giving us. No, if you want to say someone is too old for office, then you must also admit they can be too old to vote. If we’re really going to make this argument, we need to really apply it and try to fix the problem of old people controlling our government. It’s not a “gotchya”, you’re just interpreting it that way because you feel like I “gotchya” with that one, it’s a serious proposal if you want to seriously talk about age and politics. I have no idea what obama beating hillary has to do with it, the point was hillary lost because her “base” or predicted voters decided to vote independent, trump, or not at all. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2019, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/384 "2019-09-08T23:59:29Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe Sanders is electable. You are, and he is considering he’s been in office for longer than I’ve existed. I think what you meant to say is “most electable” or something along those lines. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/385 "2019-09-09T00:04:10Z")
I will support any Democrat whom polls show to be the most likely to defeat Chump next year. If Sanders ever gets to the No. ! spot, he’s got my vote. In the meantime, it’s Biden all the way. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/386 "2019-09-09T00:06:56Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > I _do_ think a Democratic Administration is more likely to succeed (with the public, Congress, other leaders at home and around the world, and yes, even in the pursuit of a liberal agenda) with a _moderate_ leftist in the White House rather than a more extreme leftist. The bounce from one extreme to the complete opposite extreme will rightfully lead people around the world to shake their heads at the collapse of U.S. stability. We have “leftists” calling to reduce government and completely abolish various gov agencies. We have “conservatives” wanting to destroy the environment to get oil. We have “libertarians” who support having a standing army. Sorry but this idea that electing a right winger then a left winger creates a sense of instability for foreigners doesn’t seem to have much merit in my opinion. What does cause foreign heads to not trust the US is when we sign onto deals then pull out once the next President takes office, like we did with the nuclear deal. Further more, the idea of “left or right” is totally skewed depending what time period and where in the world you are. What we would call a leftist in America, is actually a centrist in Europe. What we call a conservative in America, is a fascist in europe. This argument u made is 100% a nothing sandwich. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/387 "2019-09-09T00:09:16Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > I will support any Democrat whom polls show to be the most likely to defeat Chump next year. If Sanders ever gets to the No. ! spot, he’s got my vote. In the meantime, it’s Biden all the way. Hillary destroyed Trump in the polls yet she lost, and actually gave Trump/Independents votes because she was so unlikable. Vote based on merit, not what some poll ran by a billion dollar corporation says. It’s likely your interests, and their interests, do not align on important topics that affect you. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/388 "2019-09-09T00:14:19Z")
> [@Barack\_Obama](#): > > Hillary destroyed Trump in the polls yet she lost, and actually gave Trump/Independents votes because she was so unlikable. > > Vote based on merit, not what some poll ran by a billion dollar corporation says. It’s likely your interests, and their interests, do not align on important topics that affect you. Yadda yadda yadda. Biden shows most likely to beat Chump, so I’m voting Biden. Period. No ifs, ands or buts. Until and if another candidate shows to be most likely. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/389 "2019-09-09T01:01:08Z")
> [@Barack\_Obama](#): > > Rebuild America Act > > Employ Young Americans Now Act > > Paycheck Fairness Act > > Corporate Tax Dodging Prevention Act > > Medicare For All > > Social Security Expansion Act > > College for All Act > > Student Loan Debt Forgiveness (I forgot the actual name of the bill, Warren has a very similar bill) Weak list, there. > [@](#): > > and no I don’t think the “squad” is why the house flipped, I think more people went out and voted because they were tired of the bullshit the republican and democratic party kept giving us. These additional people voted for mainstream Dems. You don’t seem to recognize that. > [@](#): > > No, if you want to say someone is too old for office, then you must also admit they can be too old to vote. If we’re really going to make this argument, we need to really apply it and try to fix the problem of old people controlling our government. It’s not a “gotchya”, you’re just interpreting it that way because you feel like I “gotchya” with that one, it’s a serious proposal if you want to seriously talk about age and politics. Again, do you think this makes a lick of sense? A President can’t be under the age of 35… so maybe voters under 35 can’t vote for president hurr hurr hurr! > [@](#): > > I have no idea what obama beating hillary has to do with it, the point was hillary lost because her “base” or predicted voters decided to vote independent, trump, or not at all. Obama beat Hillary in 2008. Hillary lost to Trump in 2016. Just holler if you want me to review these facts one more time. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/390 "2019-09-09T01:04:22Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Yadda yadda yadda. Biden shows most likely to beat Chump, so I’m voting Biden. Period. No ifs, ands or buts. Until and if another candidate shows to be most likely. How does biden show most likely to beat Trump? Polling? Which polls, and why those polls? And why do you think hes polling higher than other candidates, and what do you think about his actual campaign and proposals? If your only concern is defeating trump, why? What has trump did that has made you sacrifice your own positions and beliefs to in your eyes defeat trump? Looks like Trump really did a number on you, if you’re willing to vote in Hitler to beat him (if hitler was alive, and running as the front runner of Democratic party). ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/391 "2019-09-09T01:05:18Z")
See first three words of my previous post. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/392 "2019-09-09T01:11:17Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Weak list, there. > > These additional people voted for mainstream Dems. You don’t seem to recognize that. > > Again, do you think this makes a lick of sense? A President can’t be under the age of 35… so maybe voters under 35 can’t vote for president hurr hurr hurr! > > Obama beat Hillary in 2008. Hillary lost to Trump in 2016. Just holler if you want me to review these facts one more time. Didn’t even attempt to explain why a single one of those bills would not be good for the economy. In a district where it’s only a mainstream dem vs a republican of course they vote the mainstream dem not because theyre mainstream but because thats their only choice. Not to say there werent elections with new vs old dems, but in those cases people typically vote for who they know about unless the new person has something better sounding to offer, or if the old person has some problems voters disagree with. This doesn’t invalidate the fact that establishment democrats and republicans have caused a surge of new voters to start voting because they’re feeling the effects of decades long policies on both sides. If we’re arguing the correlation between age and mental capacity is so strong that we shouldnt elect a president over the age of 65, then we must also stop allowing a person over the age of 65 from voting. The minimum age of presidency has less to do with mental capacity and more to do with experience, of which I disagree with. Guess you either conflated those two things, or you honestly don’t understand the point of what I said, in which case perhaps you yourself are getting up in age and your mental capacity is starting to diminish. Edit: and again, your final statement has nothing to do with my original quote. Looks like that age and mental capacity is really effecting you now huh? ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/393 "2019-09-09T01:13:07Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > See first three words of my previous post. See the request for you to use your brain and think how you’re approaching this election through. Edit: Btw, this is why centrists are losing power. More concerned with yourself than you are the country you serve. You’ll vote Bernie in 2020, and you will like it. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/394 "2019-09-09T01:35:02Z")
Barack Obama, that’s enough. You may not insult other posters in Great Debates or Elections. Warning issued. Please don’t do it again. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/395 "2019-09-09T01:39:12Z")
> [@Barack\_Obama](#): > > Guess you either conflated those two things, or you honestly don’t understand the point of what I said, in which case perhaps you yourself are getting up in age and your mental capacity is starting to diminish. > > Edit: and again, your final statement has nothing to do with my original quote. Looks like that age and mental capacity is really effecting you now huh? > [@Barack\_Obama](#): > > See the request for you to use your brain and think how you’re approaching this election through. You have this pattern of resorting to insults towards those that disagree with you. Personal insults are not permitted in this forum, as such this is a warning for personal insults. [/moderating] hmm, ninja’d. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/396 "2019-09-09T01:50:36Z")
Gotcha. For once, I’M the ninja. ---
**Author:** ![Barack\_Obama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dc4da7/32.png) [@Barack\_Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barack_Obama)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/397 "2019-09-09T02:08:44Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > You have this pattern of resorting to insults towards those that disagree with you. Personal insults are not permitted in this forum, as such this is a warning for personal insults. > > [/moderating] > > hmm, ninja’d. “yadda yadda yadda” ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/398 "2019-09-09T02:36:44Z")
> [@Barack\_Obama](#): > > You’ll vote Bernie in 2020, and you will like it. Yes, if Bernie is the candidate in 2020, I will vote for him, and I will like it. That’s never been in doubt. What’s the problem again? ---
**Author:** ![kirkrapine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7ea924/32.png) [@kirkrapine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kirkrapine)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/399 "2019-09-09T02:45:46Z")
Sanders is too old. I’m hesitant to support Biden for the same reason. OTOH, I’d be enthusiastic about a Biden/Warren ticket – such a ticket would sew up the centrist vote, and also the progressive vote, progressives assuming that Biden would either die in office or limit himself to one term, and in either case be succeeded by Warren. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632/400 "2019-09-09T04:51:44Z")
> [@kirkrapine](#): > > Sanders is too old. I’m hesitant to support Biden for the same reason. OTOH, I’d be enthusiastic about a Biden/Warren ticket – such a ticket would sew up the centrist vote, and also the progressive vote, progressives assuming that Biden would either die in office or limit himself to one term, and in either case be succeeded by Warren. That’s not a good reason, but there are many others. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-you-support-bernie-sanders-if-you-dont/835632.md?page=21)