# Why "gee" and "haw" instead of right and left? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 8, 2008, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561 "2008-09-08T01:57:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![freckafree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/freckafree/32/3050_2.png) [@freckafree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/freckafree)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/1 "2008-09-08T01:57:38Z")
I’m assuming you _could_ train horses, oxen, sled dogs, or any other draft animal to repsond to the commands of “right” and “left.” So why are they commonly trained to respond to “gee” and “haw”? I can find lots of information about the origins of “gee” and “haw,” but I haven’t come across anything that explains why they are still used. Tradition? Are the vowel sounds in gee and haw easier for animals to understand or for the human voice to project than the vowel sounds in left and right? ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/2 "2008-09-08T02:10:18Z")
They seem to be archaic terms that have somehow stuck around while time has passed them by. I think there are many examples of this, especially in jargon (port and starboard for left and right, use of furlongs in horse racing instead of yards or miles.) Also, I read once that “eenie, meenie, miney, moe” are the first four numbers in some otherwise dead pre-Anglo-Saxon British language. I don’t know if this really answers your question, but knowing that there are many other similar examples may persuade you that it’s not all that uncommon. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/3 "2008-09-08T02:38:56Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > …I think there are many examples of this, especially in jargon (port and starboard for left and right… Before I joined the U.S. Navy, I also thought that the terms “port” and “starboard” were useless jargon, until I realized that the terms have a specific meaning on a ship. They mean the left and right sides of a vessel in the direction of motion. In other words, they are references that are independent of which way you are facing. If you face aft (toward the stern), for example, the port side of the ship is on your right. FWIW, the U.S. Navy only uses the terms “port” and “starboard” for location referents. Rudder orders are given using “left” and “right” (e.g. “left full rudder” makes the ship turn left). ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/4 "2008-09-08T04:42:21Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > Also, I read once that “eenie, meenie, miney, moe” are the first four numbers in some otherwise dead pre-Anglo-Saxon British language. For the sake of all humanity, take whatever you read this in and burn it immediately. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/5 "2008-09-08T04:48:42Z")
dog sledding along and your phone rings, how often are you going to have use for the words gee or hah in everyday conversation? but if you say “turn right at the 7-11” your dogs might decide to make that turn that you arent expecting because you are talking on your cell phone while sledding. seriously whatever the original reason was, its a very very legitimate reason to keep them in use. it avoids confusion in an animal who is incapable of telling the difference between conversation and a command. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/6 "2008-09-08T11:10:55Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > They seem to be archaic terms that have somehow stuck around while time has passed them by. I think there are many examples of this, especially in jargon (port and starboard for left and right, … Port is relatively new. It used to be larboard and starboard but they were too similar and confusing. Gee and haw seem to be ideally suited for commanding animals because they sound totally different. One is high and rising while the other is low and falling. The best combination to make sure it is received and understood. It is the vowel sounds which carry most of the information. You could dispose of the initial consonants and the message would still be clear. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/7 "2008-09-08T11:30:16Z")
They are short one syllable commands, that you can give in high noise environments and still get the wanted response from a horse. Think of the noise when herding. Why train an animal to respond to words that people commonly speak? This just leads to more times when the animal may respond to words in conversations around it. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/8 "2008-09-08T14:38:32Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > For the sake of all humanity, take whatever you read this in and burn it immediately. Whereas IIRC “Onetherum, twotherum, cockerum, quitherum, shitherum, shatherum, wineberry, wagtail, taradiddle, den” has impeccable credentials as sheep-counting doggerel. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/9 "2008-09-08T14:59:47Z")
Similarly, many drug/attack/etc dogs used by police are trained using foreign terms (Hungarian in one case I am thinking of). Commands can be given without the presumed criminal understanding or countermanding the order. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/10 "2008-09-08T15:10:18Z")
> [@Harmonious\_Discord](#): > > Why train an animal to respond to words that people commonly speak? This just leads to more times when the animal may respond to words in conversations around it. Amen to this! Years ago, I house-trained my dog to the music of the Who, and now she poops whenever David Caruso is on the TV. (So do I, but still…) ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/11 "2008-09-08T15:16:30Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Whereas IIRC “Onetherum, twotherum, cockerum, quitherum, shitherum, shatherum, wineberry, wagtail, taradiddle, den” has impeccable credentials as sheep-counting doggerel. There are a number of other similar/related counting schemes fromk various regions - the one I came across in Sussex at the Weald and Downland Museum was: Yan, Tan, Tethera, Pethera, Pimp, Sethera, Lethera, Hovera, Covera, Dik Yan-a-dik, Tan-a-dik, Tethera-dik, Pethera-dik, Bumpit, Yan-a-bumpit, Tan-a-bumpit, Tethera-bumpit, Pethera-bumpit, Figgit ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/12 "2008-09-08T15:18:31Z")
> [@sailor](#): > > Port is relatively new. It used to be larboard and starboard but they were too similar and confusing. > > Gee and haw seem to be ideally suited for commanding animals because they sound totally different. One is high and rising while the other is low and falling. The best combination to make sure it is received and understood. It is the vowel sounds which carry most of the information. You could dispose of the initial consonants and the message would still be clear. Also, they carry better across distances and in windy conditions and are more intelligible against background noise. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/13 "2008-09-08T15:23:11Z")
In Andrew Vachss’s Burke series, Burke has trained his mastiff Pansy to do something different to every normal command; i.e. “Attack” gets her to lie down, “Eat” is attack, etc. He did that so nobody could poison her, and nobody would know what he was telling her to do. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/14 "2008-09-08T16:11:05Z")
> [@robby](#): > > Before I joined the U.S. Navy, I also thought that the terms “port” and “starboard” were useless jargon, until I realized that the terms have a specific meaning on a ship. They mean the left and right sides of a vessel in the direction of motion. In other words, they are references that are independent of which way you are facing. If you face aft (toward the stern), for example, the port side of the ship is on your right. > > FWIW, the U.S. Navy only uses the terms “port” and “starboard” for location referents. > > Rudder orders are given using “left” and “right” (e.g. “left full rudder” makes the ship turn left). Umm, are you sure it’s the direction of trvale as opposed to the “normal direction of trvel”? Do port and starboard switch if the ship is going backwards?:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/15 "2008-09-08T16:23:28Z")
> [@Harmonious\_Discord](#): > > They are short one syllable commands, that you can give in high noise environments and still get the wanted response from a horse. Think of the noise when herding. I can see how this would be useful. When we rock climb, you yell “take” if you want someone to take up all the slack because you’re about to fall. You can yell “slack” when you want them to _give_ you slack because you need to pull up some rope to clip in or because you need your sfety line to be looser to maneuver. The problem of course is that when you are 50 feet up on a breezy day and you yell “take” into the rock face to your safety belay down below… the “ake” and “ack” sounds can be remarkably similar. My fiancee and I will use “take” and “give” (for “give me slack”) because the vowell sounds are much more distinct. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/16 "2008-09-08T16:43:06Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > There are a number of other similar/related counting schemes fromk various regions - the one I came across in Sussex at the Weald and Downland Museum was: > Yan, Tan, Tethera, Pethera, Pimp, Sethera, Lethera, Hovera, Covera, Dik > Yan-a-dik, Tan-a-dik, Tethera-dik, Pethera-dik, Bumpit, Yan-a-bumpit, Tan-a-bumpit, Tethera-bumpit, Pethera-bumpit, Figgit Yes, and when I did the BBC Music Workshop on _The Pennine Way_ back in about 1971 I learned “Yain, tain, eddero, peddero, jig” too, which was supposedly from Yorkshire on or around Fountain’s Fell, but I’ve no idea how it went after five, let alone up to twenty. (Obviously not _too_ far removed from the Sussex method.) ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/17 "2008-09-08T17:07:50Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Umm, are you sure it’s the direction of trvale as opposed to the “normal direction of trvel”? It’s the normal direction of travel. > [@DrDeth](#): > > Do port and starboard switch if the ship is going backwards? No. Actually, forget the whole “direction of travel” crap. The front of a ship is the bow, which is the “forward” end of the ship. The back of the ship is the stern, which is the “aft” end of the ship. (The middle is referred as “amidships.”) If you are facing forward, the port side is on your left and the starboard side is on your right. If you are facing aft, the port side is on your right and the starboard side is on your left. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/18 "2008-09-08T17:50:21Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Yes, and when I did the BBC Music Workshop on _The Pennine Way_ back in about 1971 I learned “Yain, tain, eddero, peddero, jig” too, which was supposedly from Yorkshire on or around Fountain’s Fell, but I’ve no idea how it went after five, let alone up to twenty. (Obviously not _too_ far removed from the Sussex method.) The Sussex one appears to have a bit of Welsh in it (five is ‘pimp’ in Welsh) - unless it’s just coincidence. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/19 "2008-09-08T18:09:05Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > The Sussex one appears to have a bit of Welsh in it (five is ‘pimp’ in Welsh) - unless it’s just coincidence. In the likely event it has pre-Roman origins, I suppose there’s no reason why it shouldn’t have linguistic roots in common with Welsh. ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561/20 "2008-09-08T22:44:12Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > For the sake of all humanity, take whatever you read this in and burn it immediately. Would you care to expand on that? Is this the linguistic equivalent of “There were these twins named Lemonjello and Orangejello”? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-gee-and-haw-instead-of-right-and-left/462561.md?page=2)