# Why good are Coke's trade secrets to Pepsi? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 24, 2007, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312 "2007-05-24T03:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SlickRoenick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@SlickRoenick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlickRoenick)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/1 "2007-05-24T03:16:36Z")
> **[Two ex-Coke workers sentenced in Pepsi plot deal - CNN.com](https://www.cnn.com/2007/LAW/05/23/coca.cola.sentencing/index.html?eref=rss_topstories)** > > Two former Coca-Cola employees were sentenced Wednesday to serve federal prison terms for conspiring to steal and sell trade secrets to rival Pepsi. So a couple people try to sell Coke’s secret to Pepsi. Pepsi alerts the feds about it and prosecution begins. Would Pepsi even have any desire for the trade secrets of a competitor? I could understand Intel/AMD, but drinks i can’t quite grasp. I just don’t understand what either beverage company would actually _DO_ with the information of another in this sort of case. ---
**Author:** ![BrandonR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@BrandonR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrandonR)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/2 "2007-05-24T03:42:27Z")
They wouldn’t be any good IMO. First off, accepting said secrets would be such an incredibly huge liability and potential PR disaster, if it ever got out it could probably destroy the company and I doubt anyone at Pepsi would be dumb enough to go for it. Second, I could only imagine this working back in the old days when companies could be sneakier without all the federal trademark and patent laws; and they could potentially put each other out of business. Nowadays you’d simply be out of business for a really dumb reason. Chalk up another failure to dumb criminals worldwide. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/3 "2007-05-24T04:17:16Z")
Not only that, but I would assume, they already know each other’s recepies. I’m sure their labs already have them all analyzed and figured out. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/4 "2007-05-24T11:27:43Z")
I love the artist’s rendition. Those are some ugly zombie lookin’ people. ---
**Author:** ![Sigene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df788c/32.png) [@Sigene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigene)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/5 "2007-05-24T11:32:46Z")
It was a recipe for a “new coke product” ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/6 "2007-05-24T11:54:06Z")
According to William Poundstone’s **Big Secrets** , some people have bragged of knowing both company’s recipes. The basic formula isn’t much of a secret – Generic “Cola” formulas (which have virtually nothing to do with cola nuts) are available in food recipe books, and you can buy all sorts of cola brands. Poundstone gives a probable formula and recipe for Coke in his book. So does Cunningham, in the book **For God, Country, and Coca Cola**. Cunningham apparently had access to Coke’s archives (although his formula isn’t for domestic Coke). There are food chemists, gas chromatographs, and analytical techniques that allow companies to determine what’s in their competitor’s prooducts. So you wouldn’t think there’d be much need to steal. Heck – how many variations on the formulae ar there? Pepsi and Coke have probably examined pretty much the same paths. I suppose there might be some advantage in knowing what your competitor had before it hit the market, and I’m sure discrete industrial espionage is going on all the time. But screwing up and calling attention to yourself seems pretty dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/7 "2007-05-24T11:56:10Z")
[QUOTE=Sigene] It was a recipe for a “new coke product” [/QUOTE] Ah, now _that’s_ something I can see there being a market for. Like **Joey P** , I imagine that Coke and Pepsi probably have at least a pretty good idea of what the “natural and artificial flavors” in each others products are. Being in the soft drink industry themselves, they can probably guess the recipe with a pretty high degree of accuracy. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/8 "2007-05-24T12:02:37Z")
maybe they were looking to steal CC’s formula for “BLAKCOKE”-so they could lose money, just like CC did! ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/9 "2007-05-24T12:22:17Z")
Pepsi doesn’t need to use Coke’s flavour anyway. Then it wouldn’t be Pepsi anymore. ---
**Author:** ![mazinger\_z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@mazinger\_z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mazinger_z)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/10 "2007-05-24T16:57:11Z")
My mom told me that the top two executives of Coca-Cola were not allowed to travel on the same plane together because they each had 1/2 of the secret formula of coke (this was when I was 3 years old). It sounded like a good story at the time. Then, my 6th grade teacher told me that they broke down Coke in the labs and there was a secret ingredient in it that no one knew what it was. Any truth to these urban legends? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/11 "2007-05-24T17:15:16Z")
> [@](#): > > My mom told me that the top two executives of Coca-Cola were not allowed to travel on the same plane together because they each had 1/2 of the secret formula of coke (this was when I was 3 years old). It sounded like a good story at the time. Then, my 6th grade teacher told me that they broke down Coke in the labs and there was a secret ingredient in it that no one knew what it was. Any truth to these urban legends? not according to Poundstone and Cunningham. These sound like partially-heard or partially-understood or misunderstood versions of the claims that there was a mysteious ingredient “7X” added to Coke. According to Poundstone, there never was a “7X”, but Asa Candler, who took over from Pemberton, the inventor of Coke 9and who reformulated it himself, so you weren’t really buying the original Pemberton Coca Cola, then or now) ordered the ingredientrs himself and removed the labeling, giving the ingredients numbers so his workers could mix it up without knowing what was in it. I can’t believe that kept it a secret – things slip. People see invoices or packing lists. I’ll bet he had a cadre of people who knew the real ingredients before long. He would’ve had to when the operation reached an appreciable size. As for the thing about the recipe being in halves, with two guys not being able to travel together – one of the people Poundstone cites claims that he knew the formulas of both Coke and Pepsi. Again, it’s hard for me to believe that this knowledge was confined to two heads – Lots of people are involved in making Coke up. For a worldwide operation. Even if they had some key flavoring mix restricted to the Home Office in Atlanta, one guy isn’t going to mix it up for the whole company himself. What if he gets hit by a car, or is home sick? Many people are involved, I have no doubt/. but stories like this build up a miystique. ---
**Author:** ![LateComer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5ac83/32.png) [@LateComer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LateComer)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/12 "2007-05-24T17:15:52Z")
[QUOTE=mazinger\_z] Then, my 6th grade teacher told me that they broke down Coke in the labs and there was a secret ingredient in it that no one knew what it was. [/QUOTE] The secret ingredient is . . . Love. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/13 "2007-05-24T17:24:03Z")
One of the employees sentenced is named _Dimson_. Rather appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/14 "2007-05-24T17:25:59Z")
[QUOTE=LateComer] The secret ingredient is . . . Love. [/QUOTE] At one time the secret ingredient of Coca-Cola was, of course, **cocaine**. Doesn’t Coke still put some kind of coca flavour into their product? ---
**Author:** ![ASAKMOTSD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@ASAKMOTSD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASAKMOTSD)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/15 "2007-05-24T17:32:48Z")
[QUOTE=LateComer] The secret ingredient is . . . Love. [/QUOTE] I am sorry. Now I have this picture of them wringing out the Pillsbury Doughboy into the vat. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/16 "2007-05-24T17:35:33Z")
> [@](#): > > My mom told me that the top two executives of Coca-Cola were not allowed to travel on the same plane together because they each had 1/2 of the secret formula of coke (this was when I was 3 years old). It sounded like a good story at the time. Then, my 6th grade teacher told me that they broke down Coke in the labs and there was a secret ingredient in it that no one knew what it was. Any truth to these urban legends? Those legends, and others like them, are probably deliberately spread by Coke. The Coca-Cola Company’s primary product isn’t a beverage, it’s an image, and the secret formula is part of that image. Coke doesn’t want to mimic Pepsi’s recipe, because if they did, sales would plummet, due to losing some of the mystique (as they discovered back in the 80s when they tried it), and Pepsi doesn’t want to mimic Coke’s recipe, because most cola drinkers don’t like the taste as much as what Pepsi already has. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/17 "2007-05-24T17:45:34Z")
[QUOTE=GuanoLad] Pepsi doesn’t need to use Coke’s flavour anyway. Then it wouldn’t be Pepsi anymore. [/QUOTE] There are other reasons why one manufacturer would want information about a competitor’s product other than copying. Suppose P found out that C used an ingredient whose market P could cause to fluctuate. Devious, but possible. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/18 "2007-05-24T19:57:25Z")
[QUOTE=mazinger\_z] My mom told me that the top two executives of Coca-Cola were not allowed to travel on the same plane together because they each had 1/2 of the secret formula of coke (this was when I was 3 years old). [/QUOTE] Aaaaand if one of the guys snuffs it then we have, what…one guy with half the recipe? How useful would that be? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/19 "2007-05-24T20:02:49Z")
UL tend to fall apart when examined that closely. The recipe is in the safe with the jewelry and insurance papers, just like at home. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312/20 "2007-05-24T20:24:02Z")
[QUOTE=Inigo Montoya] Aaaaand if one of the guys snuffs it then we have, what…one guy with half the recipe? How useful would that be? [/QUOTE] They each know the whole recipe, but even so, it doesn’t matter. > **[Coca-Cola's Secret Formula](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/coca-cola-fomula/)** > > Coca-Cola's formula is not really so much of a secret that only two men each know half of it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-good-are-cokes-trade-secrets-to-pepsi/405312.md?page=2)