# Why have conservatives left this message board? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [April 14, 2025, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016 "2025-04-14T01:14:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/241 "2025-04-20T22:17:09Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > People keep repeating this, but it really isn’t true. America, and thus the board, is more _libertarian_ than Europe, but the social justice movement that defines the modern left originated in America and spread to Europe. And modern America is about the worship of hatred, cruelty and greed. And the desire to kill and destroy for the sake of killing and destroying. Some nations just want to burn the world, and America is one. “Social justice” is dead; only bigotry and cruelty remains. Trump won _because_ Trump is ignorant, stupid and evil, and those _are_ what America wants and idealizes. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/242 "2025-04-20T22:18:42Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > The social justice movement was almost certainly a significant factor in Trump’s recent election win (not the _most_ significant factor, however). US politics is schizophrenic: America has both more restrictive abortion laws than the majority of European countries, and at the same time has more liberal laws than any. The US has extreme pro-trans and extreme anti-trans laws. The US has both long sentences for common crimes, and elected prosecutors who refuse to prosecute criminals for those crimes. The US had laws requiring private companies to implement affirmative action policies if they wanted to do work for or receive money from the federal government, and now under Trump has laws requiring them not to do so. A handful of US states have “legal gender recognition” laws allowing trans people to have official documentation (drivers licenses, state IDs, et cetera) reflect their gender identity. Fewer states have laws providing at least partial protection for trans children in academics and intramural sports. Some federal agencies have had policies (now reversed) allowing people to identify per their preferred gender. That is about the extent of “extreme-pro trans…laws” in the United States. Compare to much of Western and Northern Europe ([Trans Rights Index Europe & Central Asia 2024](https://transrightsmap.tgeu.org/index) where many nations offer broad protections not only for their own trans citizens but for people seeking asylum due to anti-trans persecution. No US state—not even the very ‘blue’ ones—offers protections to trans people comparable to Belgium, Denmark, or Luxembourg. The United States has relatively few prosecutors and states attorneys general who “refuse to prosecute criminals for those crimes” (largely in California), and despite all of the outcries about it on Fox News and other conservative media, were not letting violent predators and chronic offenders go free as general policy. The United States has affirmative action laws has a response to ‘redlining’ and other means of de facto segregation following the Civil Rights Act because of long standing prejudices that are not as significant in Europe because no European nation imported slaves as human chattel (although they certainly used them in sugar and tobacco plantations in the Caribbean, and gold and silver mining in South and Central American colonies, plus the whole 19th century colonial rush in Africa, British in India and China, et cetera), and they were a significant factor in Southern blacks getting federal civil service jobs and inclusion in to industrial unions, which was a substantial factor in allowing them to rise into the socioeconomic middle class. Contention over this was not a new issue even though conservative media did its best to portray it as unfair and the Black Lives Matters movement as some kind of anarchist vandalistic force that was threatening to burn down entire cities. Again, virtually everything in the ‘culture wars’ debate is essentially manufactured conflict that even if it were true would have little impact upon the average voter but was stoked by Sean Hannity, Laura Ingraham, et cetera, who are ‘conservatives’ in name only despite displaying open fealty to and advocacy for countries which actually oppose US interests. > [@DemonTree](#): > > The board, however, is solidly on the left in all these issues. Show your work. Providing some examples should be easy if the bias is that clear. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/243 "2025-04-20T22:47:29Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > The United States has relatively few prosecutors and states attorneys general who “refuse to prosecute criminals for those crimes” (largely in California), and despite all of the outcries about it on Fox News and other conservative media, were not letting violent predators and chronic offenders go free as general policy. Yeah, that’s been right wing propaganda for decades, but it’s baseless and has led to stupid mandatory sentencing laws that have if anything been what’s _led_ to “predators being let loose”. Both by overfilling prisons and by restricting the ability of judges to keep people likely to re-offend inside by making the sentence longer. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/244 "2025-04-20T22:49:24Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Show your work. Providing some examples should be easy if the bias is that clear. Get in line and don’t hold your breath. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/245 "2025-04-20T22:59:28Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > It’s very hard to judge fairly when you are invested in one side of an argument, and very much easier to see bad arguments on the other side than on your own. Not if you’re honest with yourself. It can be temporarily difficult to stay honest in the heat of debate, but it’s not hard at all to judge after the heat has died down. This is not to say that there are not and have not been dishonest debaters in the mainstream of this board, and similarly folks who are ready to shout down any proposed deviation from the accepted norms. My opinion is that those people don’t get challenged as much as they should. But it is not true that it is difficult to tell the difference between an honest debater and a dishonest one just because of which side you’re on. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/246 "2025-04-20T23:05:20Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > The US has extreme pro-trans and extreme anti-trans laws. Could you give an example of an “extreme pro-trans” law and explain what’s extreme about it? Honestly I can’t really think of any pro-trans laws at all, other than it’s still mostly illegal to hunt them down and kill them (for now). ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/247 "2025-04-20T23:19:44Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Get in line and don’t hold your breath. [![](https://i2.wp.com/afspecialwarfare.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/breath-hold-pool.jpg) ](https://i2.wp.com/afspecialwarfare.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/breath-hold-pool.jpg) Stranger ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/248 "2025-04-20T23:41:24Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Some nations just want to burn the world, and America is one. What are the others? > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Show your work. Providing some examples should be easy if the bias is that clear. Are you actually disputing that a majority of people on the board are on the left on these issues? Why? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/249 "2025-04-20T23:49:00Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > Not if you’re honest with yourself. It can be temporarily difficult to stay honest in the heat of debate, but it’s not hard at all to judge after the heat has died down. I guess quite a lot of people aren’t honest with themselves, then. Or they don’t bother to challenge bad arguments that support their side because it wouldn’t benefit them to. I’ve experienced one kind of bias in myself, though: the impulse to fact check only those articles/information that doesn’t fit my priors. That’s one reason it’s valuable to debate people with opposing views: it pushes you to verify things you wouldn’t otherwise bother to. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/250 "2025-04-20T23:52:44Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > The social justice movement was almost certainly a significant factor in Trump’s recent election win (not the _most_ significant factor, however). Not really. > **[2024 Post-Election Survey: The Reasons for Voting for Trump and Harris |...](https://navigatorresearch.org/2024-post-election-survey-the-reasons-for-voting-for-trump-and-harris/)** > > Report on voters' top reasons for supporting Donald Trump or Kamala Harris, including perceptions of how each candidate prioritized issues. > Trump voters said fighting illegal immigration and fixing the economy were the top reasons to support him, while Harris voters were most likely to say that her standing in the way of a national abortion ban and making the wealthy and big corporations pay their fair share in taxes were the top reasons for supporting her. When Trump voters were asked in this survey to rate the top five reasons for supporting him in the election, a majority — 53 percent — said that he “will secure the border and fight illegal immigration” was one of their biggest reasons. This was followed closely behind by the belief he “will fix our economy and get things back to the way they were when he was president last time” (46 percent). What it is interesting is that looking at the transgender issue, **the exit polling showed that 39% supported Harris, 34% declared that the issue was not a factor in their vote** , and 27% supported Trump on that subject. Maybe @DemonTree will verify things she wouldn’t otherwise bother to. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/251 "2025-04-21T00:01:10Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Are you actually disputing that a majority of people on the board are on the left on these issues? Why? Show your work. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/252 "2025-04-21T00:08:53Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > What are the others? Russia is one that comes to mind. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/253 "2025-04-21T00:11:27Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Show your work. The basis for my statement is that whenever I post a more right-wing or even centrist viewpoint on SJ issues, I get lots of people disagreeing with me and few or none agreeing - something that has already happened again in this thread re the issues you brought up. I’ll believe the board isn’t biased in this area when I get to take part in a debate and not be heavily outnumbered. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/254 "2025-04-21T00:13:49Z")
Since anyone who doesn’t want to emulate Hitler is typically labeled “left wing” in the US, most people here and most places outside the US are “left wing”. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/255 "2025-04-21T00:21:05Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > The basis for my statement is that whenever I post a more right-wing or even centrist viewpoint on SJ issues, I get lots of people disagreeing with me and few or none agreeing Show your work. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/256 "2025-04-21T00:32:09Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Show your work. Find someone else here who disagrees with your above take on social justice issues and get back to me. Otherwise, don’t bother. The bias is self-demonstrating at this point. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > And modern America is about the worship of hatred, cruelty and greed. And the desire to kill and destroy for the sake of killing and destroying. You’re American. Do _you_ worship hatred, cruelty and greed? Do you have a desire to kill and destroy for the sake of killing and destroying? How many SDMB posters would you say have that desire? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/257 "2025-04-21T00:40:26Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > The bias is self-demonstrating at this point. Then it should be trivially easy to demonstrate. Show your work. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/258 "2025-04-21T00:42:53Z")
Do what I asked first. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/259 "2025-04-21T00:52:06Z")
You didn’t ask any question. You gave me an order (“Find someone else here who disagrees with your above take on social justice issues and get back to me,”) to deflect from the fact that you haven’t established the basic premise of your argument to be true nor responded to my debunking your claim that “The US has extreme pro-trans and extreme anti-trans laws.” Show your work. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2025, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016/260 "2025-04-21T01:07:16Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > You didn’t ask any question. You gave me an order (“Find someone else here who disagrees with your above take on social justice issues and get back to me,”) to deflect from the fact that you haven’t established the basic premise of your argument to be true nor responded to my debunking your claim that “The US has extreme pro-trans and extreme anti-trans laws.” I refuse to have a debate in which I am heavily outnumbered over whether the other debates in which I have been heavily outnumbered indicate that the average viewpoint on the board is skewed to the left. I also find it extremely hard to believe anyone could genuinely question this, and I have no idea what you expect me to show you or what kind of evidence, if any, would satisfy you. And now I have wasted time on someone who is just being a low-effort dick. _Sigh_ I need to be better about sticking to my resolutions. ☹ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-conservatives-left-this-message-board/1017016.md?page=14)