# Why have movies gone away from numbered sequels? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [June 9, 2023, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267 "2023-06-09T23:02:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/21 "2023-06-10T11:35:26Z")
> [@digs](#): > > I just had a flashback to seeing the Heavy Metal movie (animated shorts) in 1981. In “Harry Canyon”, about a cab driver in the far future, he drove past a movie marquee with “Rocky 15” on it. In one of the Airplane movies, there is shown a movie poster with a shirtless, bearded old man wearing boxing gloves: “Rocky XXXVIII”. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/22 "2023-06-10T12:57:54Z")
I’d try to do the X-Men series, but that way lies madness. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/23 "2023-06-10T13:28:48Z")
I once went to a scifi convention, and each day a board was put up telling what movies and videos would be shown that day. On the last day of the convention there was a “schedule” for the day after the convention ended, with goofy titles. One was _“Star Wars 26-The Empire Goes Hawaiian”_ ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/24 "2023-06-10T14:42:50Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > It makes keep tracking of movie order kind of hard if you aren’t too invested in the series. I don’t know whether numbered sequels are less common nowadays than they used to be. But if they are, one WAG is that, nowadays, they’re not as necessary, since anyone who has trouble keeping track of movie order can easily look that information up online. ---
**Author:** ![glowacks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/glowacks/32/5548_2.png) [@glowacks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glowacks)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/25 "2023-06-10T16:29:46Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > [Rocky 5000](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbVBqv4vvq0) would like a word with you, as would [Jaws 19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d68yRIE9OvQ). I was almost going to reference Rocky 5000 myself, but thought better of it. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/26 "2023-06-10T19:37:54Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I think _Final Destination 2_ takes the prize for silliest numbered sequel title. Sillier than _The Neverending Story 2_? ---
**Author:** ![dorvann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df705f/32.png) [@dorvann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dorvann)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/27 "2023-06-10T20:25:53Z")
What really need is _Breakin’ 3: Digital Jubilee_ ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/28 "2023-06-10T20:37:13Z")
[Adrian’s Revenge.](https://youtu.be/QEGwKTQrqmQ) ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2023, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/29 "2023-06-10T20:54:37Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > I think it’s because, to a modern audience, using a number (even a Roman numeral) makes the sequel look derivative, especially considering that probably the majority of movies that get sequels are derivative. Yeah, I would agree with that. Unless it’s a consistently successful franchise like Toy Story or Fast and the Furious, just tacking a number at the end looks like a cash grab. People are much more likely to see the next “Part” (Dune), “Chapter” (John Wick), “Episode” (Star Wars), or “Volume” (Guardians of the Galaxy) of a complete story than some random new tale involving familiar characters. I think numbers work in the case of Iron Man, Iron Man 2, Iron Man 3, as it kind of reflects Tony Starks particular cheesy personality style. Notice how every other Marvel franchise gets full non-numbered titles (Thor: Ragnarok, Captain America: The Winter Soldier, Spider Man: No Way Home, etc). The other exception being the Guardians of the Galaxy films which are “Vol n”, evoking 80s style mix tape labels. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/30 "2023-06-11T19:43:22Z")
**Dropo** beat me to _Quatermass 2_, so I’ll just mention that there were silent movies with ordinal numbers attached to them even before that. As for why movies sometime drop the number, I’d like to suggest – in all seriousness – that the first one to deliberately do this was the _Jaws_ series, and that they named the fourth movie **Jaws – The Revenge** instead of _Jaws IV_ because they didn’t want to dredge up memories of **Jaws-3D** (Even though the \*Friday the 13th \* had no problems continuing on with IV right after their 3D entry. Jaws probably thought they were too classy for that.) James Cameron had already made a non-ordinal sequel title the year before with _Aliens_ instead of _Alien 2_, but they got right back into the swing of things with _Alien 3_ before abandoning the numbers for _Alien: Resurrection_. ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/31 "2023-06-11T19:54:24Z")
_Any Which Way You Can_, the sequel to _Every Which Way But Loose_, came out in 1980. ---
**Author:** ![Danger\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6de8d8/32.png) [@Danger\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Danger_Man)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/32 "2023-06-11T19:56:54Z")
Then you have the iPhone: iPhone iPhone 3G iPhone 4 ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/33 "2023-06-11T20:12:38Z")
> [@Wolf333](#): > > _Any Which Way You Can_, the sequel to _Every Which Way But Loose_, came out in 1980. _If You Don’t Stop It . . . You’ll Go Blind!!!_ came out in 1975, followed by _Can I Do It . . 'Til I Need Glasses?_ in 1977. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/34 "2023-06-11T20:24:18Z")
> [@Wolf333](#): > > _Any Which Way You Can_, the sequel to _Every Which Way But Loose_, came out in 1980. Oh, there have been sequels with non-numbered titles for a long time – _The Pink Panthe_r was followed by _A Shot in the Dark._ None of the Bond movies have numbers. _The Robe_ had _Demetrius and the Gladiators_ as a sequel. My point was about _almost_ copying the original title but not have a numeral. Not only _Alien_ and _Aliens,_ but _Predator_ and _Predators_. The _Fast and Furious_ series has been trying to do this kind of thing through a stack of sequels. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/35 "2023-06-11T20:34:35Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Well, I think part of the idea is that the higher the number, the lamer people expect the churned out sequel to be. So they don’t number them, but emphasize a subtitle instead. I think it’s a combination of that, as well as a marketing consideration. If you name them 2, 3, 4, then people are expecting a sequential story or narrative- 2 is a direct sequel of 1, and 3 follows 4 with the same characters, extended narrative, etc… If you go with something like : you give the reader/viewer the knowledge that it’s in the same basic universe, but that it’s not _necessarily_ sequential or a continuation of the same story with the same characters, even though it can be. Sometimes though, it’s an attempt to leech off of a successful series- see the “American Pie” movies- there are 3 direct sequels, then a bunch of unnumbered loosely associated straight-to-video movies. ---
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2023, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/36 "2023-06-11T20:47:51Z")
There are almost as many sequel-namers as there are sequels, so I’m sure the reasons for naming are multifarious. One WAG I’ll add to the discussion is that the _Franchise: Subtitle_ format is more descriptive and allows audiences to know or remember what the story is. For instance which Rocky was the one where he went to Russia? Was that Rocky 3? Or wait… 4? But had that move been called Rocky: The Red Menace (or some such title) it would be much easier to remember which movie that was. In an age of proliferation of films, producers may really value that kind of easy identification. Of course, it doesn’t help a viewer know which order to watch a set of movies in, but here’s a wrinkle: in the case of Iron Man, since this character has key events happening in _The Avengers_, viewing from Iron Man 2 to Iron Man 3 kinda skips a chapter if a viewer wanted to follow Tony’s story. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2023, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/37 "2023-06-12T03:35:05Z")
> [@Danger\_Man](#): > > Then you have the iPhone: > > iPhone > iPhone 3G > iPhone 4 There’s a 3GS in between the 3G and the 4. ---
**Author:** ![Danger\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6de8d8/32.png) [@Danger\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Danger_Man)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2023, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/38 "2023-06-12T08:33:31Z")
There is also a 4s before the 5. I don’t think they are counting the s-editions when numbering. ---
**Author:** ![kferr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71e660/32.png) [@kferr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kferr)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2023, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/39 "2023-06-12T09:30:58Z")
The _Final Fantasy_ game series is up to XVI now. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2023, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267/40 "2023-06-12T11:22:44Z")
Yep, they maintained high quality all the way up to Final Fantasy X, and possibly XII(I liked it less, but it was still impressive), but 13 and 15 have been atrocious. One weird thing Final Fantasy did was even include the online games as part of their numbered series instead of a separate thing. So you have these single-player JRPG games with two of them(11 and 14) being MMORPG and is really weird. I will be stunned if FF16 is any good at all. I found 13 boring and 15…15 was astonishingly dull. And I was a big-time Final Fantasy fan. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-movies-gone-away-from-numbered-sequels/985267.md?page=3)