# Why have Republicans shifted so far to the right? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 27, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040 "2010-03-27T19:12:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/101 "2010-03-30T02:51:41Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I LOVE the way liberals embrace conservatives after they’re dead. > > When Barry Goldwater was alive, liberals portrayed him as a frightening warmonger, an evil maniac who wanted to blow up the world. > > Now that he’s dead, he’s held up by liberals as the very model of a “twue” conservative. I’ve even seen the likes of Leonard Pitts and Frank Rich arguing (with a straight face!) that Ronald Reagan would have been horrified by the Tea Partiers. > > Now THERE’S a hot one! Rich and Pitts loathed Ronald Reagan while he was alive, and never ceased calling him a heartless, jingoistic racist. But now that he’'s dead, they’re happy to embrace him, as if he’d NEVER have sided with the small-government, tax-cutting crowd. > > I wonder who’ll be the NEXT dead conservative to be embraced by the Left. Goldwater made some very substantive changes after he didn’t have to pander for votes: he admitted that he was wrong to oppose government intervention to enforce racial equality before the law. And he voiced his support for gay rights. Conservatives have made similar about-faces on now-popular liberals, like Harry Truman. And, claiming that Republicans were always behind the battle for civil rights (conveniently overlooking the fact that it was the “conservative” wing of both parties that fought their “liberal” counterparts tooth and nail). Things change. And when the world doesn’t come to an end, people realize they were wrong. But no one likes to admit it. **I** wonder how long it will be before “conservatives” claim that they were always the “twue” champions of gay rights. They could use Barry Goldwater’s later stance as “pwoof”. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/102 "2010-03-30T03:06:14Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I LOVE the way liberals embrace conservatives after they’re dead. > > When Barry Goldwater was alive, liberals portrayed him as a frightening warmonger, an evil maniac who wanted to blow up the world. > > Now that he’s dead, he’s held up by liberals as the very model of a “twue” conservative. I’ve even seen the likes of Leonard Pitts and Frank Rich arguing (with a straight face!) that Ronald Reagan would have been horrified by the Tea Partiers. > > Now THERE’S a hot one! Rich and Pitts loathed Ronald Reagan while he was alive, and never ceased calling him a heartless, jingoistic racist. But now that he’'s dead, they’re happy to embrace him, as if he’d NEVER have sided with the small-government, tax-cutting crowd. > > I wonder who’ll be the NEXT dead conservative to be embraced by the Left. Goldwater spoke out against the authoritarian extremists who took over the GOP. BrainGlutton posted an article about how Reagan would fail the purity test the modern GOP is using. [http://www.thenation.com/blogs/thebeat/500305/reagan\_would\_fail\_purity\_test\_proposed\_for\_gop](http://www.thenation.com/blogs/thebeat/500305/reagan_would_fail_purity_test_proposed_for_gop) The GOP keeps moving to the right, the old extremists become moderates. Sadly in 20 years liberals may be doing the same with Palin and Gingrich (pining for the good old days when the GOP was more sane and moderate) if a McVeigh militia type (at least in speech, not in action) becomes the new face of the GOP. ---
**Author:** ![2sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/e47774/32.png) [@2sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2sense)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/103 "2010-03-30T08:31:15Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Again, you presume that they AREN’T the “Cranky White Party”. Where do you think Republicans come from anyway? They aren’t grown in Party owned vats somewhere. The people who have been joining the party for decades, who compose it ARE the “Cranky White Party”. I am referring to the puppetmasters and not their tools. The xenophobic working class whites who supply so many Republican votes aren’t into plutocracy. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/104 "2010-04-02T00:56:10Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > He’s no liberal; he’s a moderate corporatist and a spineless coward, just like almost all of the Democrats. The liberals barely exist in this country. Suppose you got your chance and the Democrats ran a leftist like George McGovern. He’d lose badly in a landslide. If you liberals want “progress” you better support moderate liberals not an European social democrat/hippie/pacifist who will win only Massachusetts and DC. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, you’re not, **Curtis.** I am not a Birther nor believe in a lot of the rubbish that’s been passed around about UHC. I supported a limited stimulus and the bailout of the banks and auto corporations. I also don’t think the UHC bill is the Abomination of Abominations either. > [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > **I** wonder how long it will be before “conservatives” claim that they were always the “twue” champions of gay rights. They could use Barry Goldwater’s later stance as “pwoof”. Or Dick Cheany’s for that matter. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/105 "2010-04-02T01:03:56Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Goldwater spoke out against the authoritarian extremists who took over the GOP. He also had some “words” for the hard religious right. Back then the biggest noise maker was Falwell, but we may as well include all of their ilk (I like the word ilk, it sounds ominous). Barry Goldwater said “every good Christian should kick Falwell’s ass”. Turns out he was right. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/106 "2010-04-02T01:50:19Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > If you liberals want “progress” you better support… This is called “concern trolling”. If you conservatives want “regress”, you’d better nominate Palin come 2012… See how it’s done, **Curtis**? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/107 "2010-04-02T02:48:41Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Suppose you got your chance and the Democrats ran a leftist like George McGovern. He’d lose badly in a landslide. If you liberals want “progress” you better support moderate liberals not an European social democrat/hippie/pacifist who will win only Massachusetts and DC. Obama isn’t a moderate liberal either. He’s not a liberal at all, just a moderate right winger; a corporatist. He’s better than the Republicans mostly because they are so irrational, nasty and incompetent; not because he’s a liberal. And your argument about who I should support is irrelevant; I’ve never voted for someone for any other reason than to oppose the right. There ARE no people with any chance to win running for office from the left to support. The allowed spectrum of political positions for an elected official in America is very narrow, very far to the Right, and getting more that way all the time. Forget progress; I don’t expect progress in America. All I expect my vote to do is slow the slide into theocratic fascism a little. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/108 "2010-04-02T06:22:11Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > … George McGovern … pacifist … Just to be absolutely clear. Are you saying George McGovern was/is a pacifist? :dubious: CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/109 "2010-04-02T06:28:31Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Obama isn’t a moderate liberal either. Actually, I think Obama is actually a liberal in person, but he certainly doesn’t govern as a liberal, and certainly was not a particularly liberal senator. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/110 "2010-04-02T06:35:00Z")
Well, if he doesn’t really believe in this whole bi-partisan thing, he sure tied himself in knots pretending to! ---
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/111 "2010-04-02T10:52:14Z")
BTW George McGovern was a bomber pilot during WW2, B-24s I think. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/112 "2010-04-02T14:36:54Z")
Nor was McGovern a leftist – no more than Barry Goldwater was a John Bircher, even though the Birchers campaigned for him. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/113 "2010-04-03T15:50:20Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Obama isn’t a moderate liberal either. He’s not a liberal at all, just a moderate right winger; a corporatist. He’s better than the Republicans mostly because they are so irrational, nasty and incompetent; not because he’s a liberal. > > And your argument about who I should support is irrelevant; I’ve never voted for someone for any other reason than to oppose the right. There ARE no people with any chance to win running for office from the left to support. The allowed spectrum of political positions for an elected official in America is very narrow, very far to the Right, and getting more that way all the time. Forget progress; I don’t expect progress in America. All I expect my vote to do is slow the slide into theocratic fascism a little. Actually by your yardstick “progress” is happening. A UHC bill has just passed, several states have legalized gay marriage and many more have granted marriage rights, the rising generation is the least religious in American history, the Religious Right has been crippled, almost everything heading your way. > [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Just to be absolutely clear. > > Are you saying George McGovern was/is a pacifist? :dubious: > > CMC fnord! I’m talking about the type of people Der Trihs and others want to run for politicians. > [@Knorf](#): > > Actually, I think Obama is actually a liberal in person, but he certainly doesn’t govern as a liberal, and certainly was not a particularly liberal senator. He opposed a bill banning Partial Birth Abortion which had a wide bipartisan support. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040/114 "2010-04-03T15:54:02Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Nor was McGovern a leftist – no more than Barry Goldwater was a John Bircher, even though the Birchers campaigned for him. Absolutely. McGovern, helped by his own combat experience (that Johnson and Nixon didn’t share) was a \*realist \*about the Vietnam folly, in an era when so many were still insisting that it could somehow be “won”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-have-republicans-shifted-so-far-to-the-right/534040.md?page=5)