# Why haven't 24 hour diners taken off in Australia the way they have in the US **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 5, 2010, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735 "2010-01-05T09:47:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/21 "2010-01-05T15:47:40Z")
> [@Queen\_Tonya](#): > > They aren’t normal everywhere here, either. I live in a factory town, and since the factories run round the clock, there are restaurants open to serve them. Other places I’ve visited, not so much. Truck stops generally are 24 hour, but always in areas with heavy truck traffic and/or by freeways. > > What do people do after closing the bars if there’s no greasy spoon to go to for bacon and eggs at 2 in the morning? 😉 You’ve got one not too far from you in Wayne. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/22 "2010-01-05T16:23:25Z")
Could it be unionization? I worked at two hotels as overnight manager and when we tried to start overnight room service, it never worked out and strong unions were a major problem with. You need union cooks and union servers and they get a premium and minimum guarantee. It just never was worth it for the five or six orders per week you’d get. Since our bar (which served food till 1:30am) and the resturant which opened at 5:30am. The coverage was only 4 hours and the minimum shift was 6 hours and since they’re union they’re job specific. Then try to find someone reliable for overnight work? Then if one of them calls off you got to call in another union member or cancel room service, and it’s a mess. (Remember it’s union so you can’t have a non-union member doing it). ---
**Author:** ![araminty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b5e925/32.png) [@araminty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/araminty)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/23 "2010-01-05T17:30:50Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > In some places yes, but they’re bloody expensive and generally only for tourists or people who are too drunk to know better. Actually, in several places I’ve lived in Australia, 24 hour supermarkets are the norm. The Coles and Woolies stores in Darwin, for example, don’t close. We used to do our grocery shopping at 11PM, much less crowded, and quite soothing, compared with the usual 5:30PM rush. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/24 "2010-01-05T17:36:51Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > Do they not have the majestic House of Waffle where you are? There are very few Awful Houses north of the Mason-Dixon Line. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/25 "2010-01-05T17:40:45Z")
If I may ask: what is a CBD? ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/26 "2010-01-05T17:56:13Z")
Central Business District? ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/27 "2010-01-05T18:01:41Z")
Central Business District. Term that Aussies often use where others would say “downtown” or “city centre”. In Britain, I’ve only ever encountered it in Geography lessons. They’re also fond of “EFTPOS” (debit card usage, basically), I notice. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/28 "2010-01-05T18:03:11Z")
Got it. Learned something new today! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BigNik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/73ab20/32.png) [@BigNik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigNik)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/29 "2010-01-05T23:24:42Z")
Actually “the city” is more common than “the CBD”. If you’re in a regional centre, you’re usually going into “town”. And there’s a 24-hour supermarket about a kilometre from my place, with a midnight-closer a couple of hundred metres away. Interestingly, there are probably ten “convenience stores” that are within six blocks of my house, only one of which is open longer hours than either of the two supermarkets in the same radius. There are a number of places that will do you food until pretty late (say, 3 a.m.), but none of them are 24-hour joints. The large-scale chain restaurant that’s a small step up from McDonald’s doesn’t have a good history in Australia, mostly because they do low-grade food at restaurant prices. A large number of fast food places failed out of this country, too (KFC did the first time, I remember that there used to be Taco Bell and Boston Market around). Starbucks has almost gone under because they charge $6 for a coffee that’s considered to be completely undrinkable when compared to the coffee shops that are all over the city in the big towns. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/30 "2010-01-06T00:31:22Z")
Don’t some Australian states still have laws restricting trading hours for shops and mandating Sunday closing? ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/31 "2010-01-06T00:52:44Z")
I came here to post something similar to **BigNik**. All the standard Denny’s and Boston Markets etc have tried and failed. More than once in the case of Denny’s. You only had to go to one to see why. Aussies don’t want a sit down meal at any time of day. If you went outside normal mealtimes the places were deserted. There are an array of places I can eat until 10 or 11 most nights of the week. Nearly every Hog’s Breath Cafe is open most of the time and anywhere near a cinema complex like Blacktown, Castle Hill or Penrith will have places open until after the movies end. ---
**Author:** ![Southern\_Yankee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/southern_yankee/32/2800_2.png) [@Southern\_Yankee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Southern_Yankee)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/32 "2010-01-06T01:01:49Z")
What’s a Macca? The OP’s dilemma sounds like a potential business opportunity to me. You should open a 24-hour diner! ---
**Author:** ![Southern\_Yankee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/southern_yankee/32/2800_2.png) [@Southern\_Yankee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Southern_Yankee)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/33 "2010-01-06T01:02:53Z")
> [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](#): > > You’ve got one not too far from you in Wayne. Wayne, NJ? ---
**Author:** ![GreedySmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a698b9/32.png) [@GreedySmurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreedySmurf)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/34 "2010-01-06T01:23:18Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Don’t some Australian states still have laws restricting trading hours for shops and mandating Sunday closing? On the Sunday trading Yep. Queensland for one. There is an exception made for the capital city Brisbane, and the Gold Coast, (and maybe Cairns?) on the basis of them being tourist destination. Outside of those areas there are restricitions on Sunday trading. My parents live in North Queensland and I give them a hard time about living in the sticks and not being able to shop on Sunday’s whenever they come to the Big Smoke 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Cunctator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/43a26b/32.png) [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/35 "2010-01-06T01:27:59Z")
> [@Southern\_Yankee](#): > > What’s a Macca? Macca’s is the local vernacular for McDonald’s outlets. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/36 "2010-01-06T01:45:36Z")
> [@Cunctator](#): > > Macca’s is the local vernacular for McDonald’s outlets. McDonald’s themselves also use the name too in some of their advertising, interestingly. I’ve honestly thought about opening a 24 hour diner but I don’t have the capital, experience, or backing to make it happen. It really needs someone like a finalist on _MasterChef Australia_ or something to get behind it to give it the “weight” needed to get the funding and market it to the public. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/37 "2010-01-06T01:54:43Z")
> [@Cunctator](#): > > Macca’s is the local vernacular for McDonald’s outlets. What does Paul think of that? The first time I ever heard of “Mickey D’s”, I asked if they served lobster. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![GreedySmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a698b9/32.png) [@GreedySmurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreedySmurf)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/38 "2010-01-06T01:55:12Z")
I know this is a CBD spot, but Brisbane has the Pancake Manor which is open 24 hours. (Not that I’ve ever been to be honest) On a few other things - how much of the Macca’s being able to open 24 hrs is A) it’s IME usually just the drive-through that is 24 hrs, so that would mean you only need two people on - the drive through attendant and a kitchen person, B) Isn’t a large portion of the Macca’s workforce on junior wages - that’s the outsiders impression I get anyway? Both of those would make it much cheaper than a diner style place I would think. My main experience with the States is in tourist type areas, so I’m wondering how many places really have non-CBD 24hrs diners outside of the tourist areas? It’s funny that leaving out the 24hr question entirely, that whole band of ‘diner style’ eateries just doesn’t seem to exist in Australia. You’ve got the fast food places, and then suddenly the next step up is the ‘family-style’ restaurants (Sizzlers/Hogs Breath type) or a cafe, either a trendy city one or a suburban cafe where the extent of food is normally sandwiches or something premade and heated. I remember many moons ago (15+ years) there was a Johnny Rockets in Brisbane which only seemed to last 2-3 years. I wonder if the cafe’s fill that level in Australia? I mean the Coffee Club franchise comes pretty close I think with the meals it serves. Maybe we just need ot convince them that a 24hour store would have enough demand? ---
**Author:** ![Queen\_Tonya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/4491bb/32.png) [@Queen\_Tonya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Queen_Tonya)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/39 "2010-01-06T02:11:21Z")
> [@Southern\_Yankee](#): > > Wayne, NJ? Nah, Wayne MI, a little 'burb twenty minutes outside of Detroit. I do have a 24 hour place less than a half-mile from my house, but what’s kind of interesting to me is that there used to be many more. As I said, it’s a factory town and when you’ve got literally thousands of shift workers round the clock, you can support more options. With the cutbacks in the auto industry in the last ten years, we’ve went from five all-night restaurants within 5 miles to just the one. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735/40 "2010-01-06T02:15:27Z")
> [@GreedySmurf](#): > > My main experience with the States is in tourist type areas, so I’m wondering how many places really have non-CBD 24hrs diners outside of the tourist areas? 24 hour diners are not particularly associated with tourist areas, actually. I associate them more with major highway interchanges (truck stop type) and college towns (basic diner type). (ETA: and places where there is a lot of shift work; factory towns and neighborhoods). I never known a college town to not have one 24 hour eatery actually. There’s about 1500 Denny’s nationwide, most open 24 hrs. There’s 1500 Waffle Houses too. There’s 500 Steak n Shake’s those are mostly also open 24 hrs a day as well. Not counting non franchise restaurants open all nght. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-havent-24-hour-diners-taken-off-in-australia-the-way-they-have-in-the-us/523735.md?page=3)