# Why I Keep AR-15 Platform Rifles **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 8, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269 "2018-03-08T23:54:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/241 "2018-03-15T21:32:49Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > In this case, I’m the one that used the term (and without feeling any ‘pressure’ to do so). Do you feel it’s accurate to say I’m one of the people that “can’t really handle people challenging them”? Do you imagine that’s why I hang around the SDMB? For the safe spaces and non-confrontational acceptance with which my views are so often met? I’ve spoken about the class of people who generally use the term. Speaking about you, personally, in this forum, probably isn’t much allowed. That said, being a whiny baby who can’t handle attacks on their positions is hardly enough to keep anybody out of a discussion - heck, the term was specifically invented to describe people on the internet who were, against all odds, still on the internet arguing for their minority positions. _Some_ people can be argued into submission and retreat, but hardly all. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/242 "2018-03-16T02:19:35Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Again, I’d like to hear from actual CC advocates as to why they don’t carry openly, and hopefully there’s an answer out there better than I’m a CC advocate that doesn’t open carry. I don’t carry at all. I suppose my better answer is, “because I don’t own a firearm.” Does that mean I can’t be a CC advocate? ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/243 "2018-03-16T18:06:56Z")
I have to say I find it a bit ridiculous that so many people are flippantly dismissive of the “civil unrest” scenario when our country is seemingly closer to complete collapse than it’s ever been, with the current administration, Russian situation, and potentially disastrous economic policy. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/244 "2018-03-16T18:12:31Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#): > > I have to say I find it a bit ridiculous that so many people are flippantly dismissive of the “civil unrest” scenario when our country is seemingly closer to complete collapse than it’s ever been, with the current administration, Russian situation, and potentially disastrous economic policy. It is a scenario the NRA keeps trying to scare people with, so I understand why people would be terrified of the possibility. However, I do feel that if there is any civil unrest in the near future, it will be instigated by those who have already stockpiled their arsenals. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/245 "2018-03-16T18:14:06Z")
Perhaps it’s because most people know that we are nowhere even CLOSE to the “civil unrest” scenario? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/246 "2018-03-16T18:51:34Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > However, I do feel that if there is any civil unrest in the near future, it will be instigated by those who have already stockpiled their arsenals. Maybe they can take over \*another \*bird sanctuary next time. Maybe they can remember to bring enough desserts, too. But if their longed-for and practiced-for fantasy scenario were, somehow, to come to pass anyway: The lawless local bullies aren’t going to be the government they’ll claim to oppose. They’ll be _them_. They won’t be protecting us from the vigilantes. They’ll be the vigilantes. They will BE the insurrection the Constitution establishes means for us to protect ourselves from. But they won’t be well-regulated, just a gang of thugs. The bad guys themselves. ---
**Author:** ![dorvann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df705f/32.png) [@dorvann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dorvann)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/247 "2018-03-16T19:40:03Z")
I think a lot of the pro AR-15 ownership movement is being driven by the prepper/survivalist community. They are of the mindset they need an assault rifle to defend their homes from roving bands of unprepared survivors in event of TEOTWAWKI (The End of the World as we Know It). ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/248 "2018-03-16T19:54:33Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > However, I do feel that if there is any civil unrest in the near future, it will be instigated by those who have already stockpiled their arsenals. Some of it will be, for damn sure. There would certainly be no end of infighting among that group itself, in this scenario. But there will be others who would “improvise and adapt” with whatever was at hand, including sheer numbers. There would be riots over food, there would be riots over access to electrical power and utilities…jesus, man, watch the movie _Threads_ if you haven’t already. It is the ONLY, and I mean the _ONLY_ accurate movie made about the aftermath of a nuclear exchange. But it wouldn’t even need to be a full-blown “exchange” to do it. Minus the long-term environmental consequences, the same scenario could result from three well-coordinated nuclear or bioterrorism attacks in the 3 largest American cities. Rogue states and the influence of ex-Soviet puppet-masters being what it is, that would be in no way an impossibility in the _near_ future. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/249 "2018-03-16T19:59:56Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > But if their longed-for and practiced-for fantasy scenario were, somehow, to come to pass anyway: The lawless local bullies aren’t going to be the government they’ll claim to oppose. They’ll be _them_. They won’t be protecting us from the vigilantes. They’ll be the vigilantes. They will BE the insurrection the Constitution establishes means for us to protect ourselves from. But they won’t be well-regulated, just a gang of thugs. The bad guys themselves. As far as I’m concerned, this is a valid justification for self-admitted hippies like me (and I’m not the only one) to ourselves be armed. I know true “heads”, guys who lived through the 60s, Woodstock, and Vietnam, who fully exercise their 2nd Amendment rights, but very privately. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/250 "2018-03-16T20:17:52Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#): > > Some of it will be, for damn sure. There would certainly be no end of infighting among that group itself, in this scenario. But there will be others who would “improvise and adapt” with whatever was at hand, including sheer numbers. There would be riots over food, there would be riots over access to electrical power and utilities…jesus, man, watch the movie _Threads_ if you haven’t already. It is the ONLY, and I mean the _ONLY_ accurate movie made about the aftermath of a nuclear exchange. But it wouldn’t even need to be a full-blown “exchange” to do it. Minus the long-term environmental consequences, the same scenario could result from three well-coordinated nuclear or bioterrorism attacks in the 3 largest American cities. Rogue states and the influence of ex-Soviet puppet-masters being what it is, that would be in no way an impossibility in the _near_ future. And, to be honest, all the fear mongering about the coming fall of civilization is what makes me think about getting a gun sometimes. But I just need a handgun, something to keep me from being completely naked, until I hooked up with my much better armed friends and we took over the local commissary (little known fact, at least as far as post apocalypse shows are concerned, grocery stores are not where they keep the majority of the food.) I have a gun store and shooting range less than a mile away, and they know me well enough to believe that I am on their side in that situation. What I don’t need come the fall of civilization is a cache of guns that is too big to move. Then you either end up staying in one place, until you either starve or are overwhelmed by greater forces, or you leave them behind for other people to pick up and maybe use against you. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/251 "2018-03-16T21:04:51Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > What I don’t need come the fall of civilization is a cache of guns that is too big to move. Then you either end up staying in one place, until you either starve or are overwhelmed by greater forces, or you leave them behind for other people to pick up and maybe use against you. I think some of the people who truly possess what you’re referring to, are driven more by sheer acquisitionism than true “prepping.” They’re compulsive collectors, usually with a lot of money. The one guy like this that I know, is wealthy enough to hold out on his farm for years if he wanted to, he has the livestock, supplies, and water from an underground well. He could subsist on that property for a really, really long time, and has the connections to get re-supplied with anything he needs (assuming that communications systems would still be up and running in this scenario, which is in no way a given.) They aren’t necessarily cranks, although some of them assuredly lean that way. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/252 "2018-03-16T21:08:28Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#): > > I think some of the people who truly possess what you’re referring to, are driven more by sheer acquisitionism than true “prepping.” They’re compulsive collectors, usually with a lot of money. The one guy like this that I know, is wealthy enough to hold out on his farm for years if he wanted to, he has the livestock, supplies, and water from an underground well. He could subsist on that property for a really, really long time, and has the connections to get re-supplied with anything he needs (assuming that communications systems would still be up and running in this scenario, which is in no way a given.) They aren’t necessarily cranks, although some of them assuredly lean that way. He can hold out until a couple dozen men all armed with ar-15’s invite themselves over. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/253 "2018-03-16T21:17:48Z")
Depends on the circumstances. If he has a few employees and brothers who have military training - which he does - they might be able to hold their own against any combination of un-trained and un-organized people. (Not to mention he’s on very good terms with a number of cops and sherrif’s deputies.) Against _trained_ and _organized_ people, who the fuck knows. Let’s really, really hope it doesn’t come to this. There is no way of really knowing how it would play out, any speculation about it truly is just speculation. It can be interesting to contemplate…if also horrible. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/254 "2018-03-16T21:29:03Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Perhaps it’s because most people know that we are nowhere even CLOSE to the “civil unrest” scenario? Seconded. Civilization is not hovering on the brink of collapse. Making plans to prepare for the collapse of society read to me like exercises in fantasy - speculative fiction. Using such fictions as a justification to own a military weapon are nonsensical and not to be given credence to - despite such frivolous pseudojustifications being a major marketing tactic of the NRA. Presuming that we’re not talking about suckers, it’s much more reasonable to believe the the people in question like their military weapons for other, unrelated reasons (probably something along the lines of ‘they’re awesome!’) and this post-apocalyptic nonsense is just after-the-fact justification. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/255 "2018-03-16T21:38:52Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Seconded. Civilization is not hovering on the brink of collapse. Making plans to prepare for the collapse of society read to me like exercises in fantasy - speculative fiction. Using such fictions as a justification to own a military weapon are nonsensical and not to be given credence to - despite such frivolous pseudojustifications being a major marketing tactic of the NRA. Presuming that we’re not talking about suckers, it’s much more reasonable to believe the the people in question like their military weapons for other, unrelated reasons (probably something along the lines of ‘they’re awesome!’) and this post-apocalyptic nonsense is just after-the-fact justification. Yeah, and I sometimes spend some time thinking about what I would do in the scenario of the fall of civilization. But then, I also spend time thinking of what I would do with my lottery winnings. ---
**Author:** ![charkbite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@charkbite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/charkbite)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/256 "2018-03-16T21:43:13Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Seconded. Civilization is not hovering on the brink of collapse. Making plans to prepare for the collapse of society read to me like exercises in fantasy - speculative fiction. Using such fictions as a justification to own a military weapon are nonsensical and not to be given credence to - despite such frivolous pseudojustifications being a major marketing tactic of the NRA. Presuming that we’re not talking about suckers, it’s much more reasonable to believe the the people in question like their military weapons for other, unrelated reasons (probably something along the lines of ‘they’re awesome!’) and this post-apocalyptic nonsense is just after-the-fact justification. Please name one army on the planet that sends its soldiers into battle armed with AR15s. And yes, they are awesome. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/257 "2018-03-16T21:55:30Z")
> [@charkbite](#): > > Please name one army on the planet that sends its soldiers into battle armed with AR15s. And yes, they are awesome. See, you knew exactly what sort of guns I was talking about. This is what we call successful use of the language. ---
**Author:** ![charkbite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@charkbite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/charkbite)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/258 "2018-03-16T22:05:09Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > See, you knew exactly what sort of guns I was talking about. This is what we call successful use of the language. I would scarcely call mischaracterizing something successful use of the language. I think the title of the post may have had something to do with assuming you were talking about AR15s. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/259 "2018-03-16T22:17:06Z")
> [@charkbite](#): > > I would scarcely call mischaracterizing something successful use of the language. I think the title of the post may have had something to do with assuming you were talking about AR15s. Mischaracterizing my arse. > [@wikipedia](#): > > In 1956, ArmaLite designed a lightweight assault rifle for military use and designated it the ArmaLite Rifle-15, or AR-15. [wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15_style_rifle) ---
**Author:** ![charkbite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@charkbite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/charkbite)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269/260 "2018-03-16T22:30:45Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Mischaracterizing my arse. > > [wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15_style_rifle) You realize your own cite has a section titled “Comparison to military versions”, right? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-i-keep-ar-15-platform-rifles/810269.md?page=14)