Yep, Malicifant, Mulan, Cinderella, Nani, Captian Antilles, Wendy, Cruella de Ville, Perdita, Ariel, Minnie Mouse – no variation on how Disney portrays women.
You know, I must be a bitch because I never get gifts from casual acquaintances of the wanted OR unwanted variety. However, if an acquaintance of mine gave a gift to me that I found offensive, I would still accept it with a smile on my face and thank them for their thoughtfulness. Then I’d write a thank you note expressing a similar sentiment.
Being polite is not selling out your ideals.
And just FYI I have very strong feelings about some things as well. For instance, remember Beanie Babies? I hated the damn things. Still do. More than anything I was pissed that level headed, rational people bought into this stupid trend. People were spending hundreds and, in some cases, thousands of dollars to buy their children stuffed animals*. People would line up at the freaking Hallmark store to scoop up the newest releases. I remember thinking: BeanieBabies: KiddieKocaine. When my children’s school (a parochial school) had a Beanie Baby raffle as part of a fundraiser, I politely voiced my objection to it at the PTO Meeting. I also wrote a note to the principal explaining that it’s hard enough to raise kids in this commercialized world without the Christian community feeding into the greed. And it was greed, because no kid needs 50 stuffed animals, even if it was the oh-so-special PrincessDiana Bear.
In any event, I was voted down and they had the raffle. And I accepted it gracefully because in the grand scheme of things it wasn’t worth making enemies over. But I did stick to my guns and never spent a dime of my money on the things for my own kids. And when the trend was over, as I knew it would be, a lot of my friends were stuck trying to figure out what to do with 50 dirty stuffed animals that were now sitting in the bottom of a toybox. I had no such problems. Idiots. 
BTW, my kids did get a few BeanieBabies as gifts throughout the years. My girls were thrilled, needless to say, because despite my best efforts they weren’t immune to pop culture and marketing-created fads. And I let my kids keep them. Because it was a gift given with kindness. And it is not my goal to alienate well intentioned people with my politics.
L-
*And the trend continues today with the trend du jour being Gugio (sp?) cards, which replaced Pokemon cards, which replaced BeanieBabies. My policy has remained the same. I’m not spending MY money on such nonsense. My girls can cry, scream, cajole, and threaten. I’m not budging. But if someone wants to spend THEIR hard-earned money ($5 for a pack of 6 trading cards – it boggles the mind to think of the profit margin on these suckers), then they are allowed to keep them.
Czarcasm, we haven’t seen Lilo and Stitch yet. Probably won’t. Don’t care that much. The advertisements left me rather flat. Sorry.
I have no problem with adaptions. Just bad ones. Disney’s had more than their fair share.
Slapstick does not mean mean-spirited.
And, yes, I am very selective about movies and television. I have high standards, and not very many movies or TV shows live up to them. I don’t see that many movies, and this doesn’t really bother me. Books are far more to my liking. I don’t see this as a bad thing.
As I mentioned on another thread, I grew up in an almost TV-free household, and also in an almost popular-music-free household.
Our parents did not hold any official “ban” on popular music, but it was barely tolerated and never encouraged. TV was strictly regulated and I missed out on a LOT of popular TV shows and movies that all my school friends talked about.
I got all sorts of flack from schoolmates about my musical tastes. But it was clear to me, (and my sisters as well) who was being the jerk and the villian in the whole thing. Kids got all worked up when they discovered I didn’t listen to pop music. They blared popular music in my ear, denigrated my musical tastes, and so forth. They were complete, obnoxious jerks. And their parents were too, often.
One shining moment came at a Camp Fire Girl meeting—one girl, (whose mother was the local Camp Fire Girl leader) was especially irked by my audacious musical choices. She set up (with the blessing of her mother) a “music day”, where each girl could bring in a recording of their favorite song, to share with the rest of the group and discuss. Except me. The girl (with her mother—the leader—looking on) pointed her finger at me and said, “Except YOU! You can’t bring any of your Classical junk in. Bring in popular music or don’t bother to bring in anything at all!”
So I didn’t bring in anything at all. I should have made a big stink, but I was so tired of the pervasive attitude by that point.
Tell me, should my parents have cow-towed to the outside pressures, of ASSHOLES like the Camp Fire Girl group, and most of my schoolmates? Who was the real villian here?
I was not “scarred” because I missed out on a lot of popular music. But I did learn a lot about human nature, early on. My parents didn’t try to prevent me from listening to any popular music (that’s impossible) but it’s amazing how underexposed I was to it. Decades of popular music are almost unknown to me. Some people cluck their tongues and think that I’ve missed out on something wonderful and essential (and they want to “fix” me by foisting all this music on me now) but I tell them not to bother. It’s none of their business, I didn’t lack for musical exposure (just not the kind of music that they thought was important) and there is nothing to “fix”. To assume that I need “fixing” is the epitome of obnoxious and presumptuous.
I see nothing that sacred about Disney. I did see some Disney films when I was growing up, but not every one. I didn’t see a lot of films, period. Or TV. Do you know how my sisters and I survived this loathesome hardship? We read. When we were too young to read ourselves, our mom read aloud to us (she’s a master at it). I wasn’t that deprived, after all.
I don’t believe for a minute that lee’s kid is going to be scarred for life because of lack of Disney. And if other people are jerks about the “no Disney” rule, whose fault is that? Why should we succumb to such sheep-like mentalities and pressures? There is nothing that life-sustaining about Disney (or popular music) no matter what some of you may think.
But you haven’t merely decided not to personally watch the movie-you’ve decided to ban it from your household merely because of the name of the distribution company, something you don’t do for any other company. What type of female example would you like Disney to put forward that might cause you to change your minds, and what other animation studio has come up to these standards?
Czarcasm, to be honest, I don’t think Disney can ever redeem their name with us. Too bad, they lose.
And I already explained to you that it’s not the name, it’s the company behind the name and the general trend of the releases from that company. Even if Lilo and Stitch is completely counter to everything Disney has ever produced, it’s just one movie. Maybe after they release five or six more like it, we’ll give them a second chance.
Why do you care so much?
Heh, I don’t listen to mainstream popular music, very much at all really, but I figure what I listen to, which is generally new stuff would be considered popular music by the standards of one who grew up with classical music, and I think it very much as enriched my life, it’s pretty much a huge part of my life, but I think you’re right, not being exposed to it, is not the end of the world.
Erek
I didn’t start this thread, did I? If you care enough to start multiple threads on the subject, don’t be surprised if people with differing viewpoints and serious questions happen to stop by. I’m just trying to find out if any animation company has come up to the standards that you have seemingly set exclusively for Disney.
Czarcasm, so far the only recent (past decade) animation I’ve really cared for was Shrek. Take what you will from that.
Maybe they will come up with five or six more, but how will you know, having banned them from your household?
I think you’re understanding where I’m coming from, then.
No doubt I have been exposed to music you have zero exposure to. Zero. (Do you know who jean Sibelius is? Jerry Goldsmith? Maybe you do, maybe you don’t. They’re just two names.) Some of this music is integral to me, is wonderful and feeds my soul. But I seriously doubt that if you are not exposed to it that you are not having your “soul fed”. Different things feed different souls. I would never dream of foisting some of my (admittedly oddball) music on everyone. I would not assume that the rest of the world is lacking something integral because they haven’t listened to exactly the same stuff that I’ve listened to.
Czarcasm, I suppose that might be a problem for Walt & Company. Oh well! Not my job to market their product for them!
I don’t like liver either. That doesn’t mean I try it occasionally to find out if I’ve changed my mind.
More violent than other Disney movies I’ve seen, the conflict with the king is resolved by his being eaten, and the female protagonist is willing to marry said king and fulfill her expected duties only because the one she supposedly loves has trouble vocalizing his true feelings. Hey, I loved the movie too, but it certainly doesn’t come close to the ideals you say you want Disney to adhere to.
And that is kind of precisely the issue here. We know yourself and lee to be mostly rational posters. It seems like you have PERSONAL issues with Disney which you are unprepared to reveal to the SDMB community in general.
Maybe Disney can’t redeem their name with your household, but if the Disney Corporation™ has done something totally reprehensible to you and yours, then you couldn’t ask for a more supportive community.
You hate Disney. It’s your right to do so. But if you’re going to post on a public messageboard - and in particular this one - about how awful Disney is, then it would be a good idea to back it up with specific examples.
I am SOOO out of here before I make the post about “double standards” which WILL get me banned.
Let me repeat once again: I am not interesting in debating our taste in movies or whether we should allow Disney into our homes. I’m tired of attempts to steer the debate in that direction, and I will not respond to any more attempts to do so. (Take it to Cafe Society if you want, that’s where debates about the literary and artistic merits of movies belong anyway.) If you want to talk about why Disney is so sacred that we can’t reasonably choose to exclude it from our home, I’ll entertain that debate. That was the OP in this thread. I don’t expect anyone to necessarily agree with our feelings about Disney, I don’t plan to present an argument – at least not to the fractious and nasty lot that is piling onto these threads with gusto.
Czarcasm, you are extending a hijack, and I’m not going to facilitate you further in that regard. Thank you, and have a nice day.
reprise, the long and the short of it is that we don’t like Disney animation. It’s obvious that a lot of y’all find our reasons for that lacking. That’s nice. Disagree with us all you want. I don’t care.
What I don’t understand is the ridiculous level of bile being vented at us for having the temerity to say “we don’t like Disney animation and don’t want it in our house”. You’d think we were terrorists or something for having the temerity to have such a belief, to judge from the response we’ve seen here on the Boards.
What makes Disney so sacred? Can someone explain that to me WITHOUT TRYING TO CONVINCE ME THAT I’M WRONG IN DISLIKING DISNEY?
I can see KellyM’s position, why is this a hijack in tastes? The OP really has nothing to do with their reasons for saying poo to Pooh and the rest of the Disney gang. That doesn’t mean that the OP doesn’t beg the questioning though.
I am asking why Disney, and Disney alone, has been set up in your household as some sort of anti-religious icon. Why you are condemning and excluding Disney is certainly on topic for this discussion, for without this information the topic is almost a non-questionable thread. You made the statement about banning Disney, and I found the answers you gave for the banning to be unclear and inconsistent.
Czarcasm, it is not the case that Disney has been set up as some sort of “anti-religious icon”; we just don’t like their product, for a large number of reasons, some of which I’ve tried to explain, apparently not to your satisfaction. That’s too bad; my taste in movies is no more a Great Debate then your taste in beers.
The point of this thread was to ask why it is so heinous to refuse to make Disney a part of a child’s life, but not to refuse to make God a part of a child’s life. Apparently, nobody wants to discuss that.
My mother is an ultra-political soul. I remember her going through a phase when she wouldn’t let us kids eat white grapes or strawberries because of the bad conditions of the migrant workers. During the height of the anti-South Africa campaign during the late 80s, Coke products were also out of the question. However, when I reached middle school age, I was able to circumvent these crazy rules with my own money. I suppose my mother figured it was my soul–not hers–that was going to burn in hell, and she decided not to impose her beliefs on me.
I admire KellyM’s and lee’s level of resolve and conscientious. I don’t personally believe that Disney is that bad (at least presently…I sorta wince when I watch “Dumbo”). And I also believe that throwing out “good” films along with the “bad” is sorta crazy (unless, that is, KellyM and lee are making a political stand in an effort to give Disney a financial hurtin’. In that case, it would be useful if they rallied for more support rather than making this an isolated vendetta). However, I have to admire people who take control over their children’s environments, even if their efforts are ultimately going to be futile. Regardless of the issue, that takes courage, tenacity, and moral courage.