# Why is “Are you better off than you were 4 years ago?” supposed to be such a gotcha question? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 26, 2024, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282 "2024-10-26T22:37:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2024, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/21 "2024-10-27T15:08:42Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > > > unlike your personal,(presumably upper middle class) experience for a lot of people their economic security is not better than it was four years ago regardless of what “economic indicators” say, and things like the increasing cost of eggs or a constant threat of losing housing is a pervasive stressor. > > And for an even larger number of people, their own personal economic situation is better than it was four years ago, but they believe the propaganda that says that it isn’t. I believe there are plenty of people whose personal economic situation is noticeably worse now than it was four years ago. Prices on many things have gone up considerably, and that’s a real problem if your income hasn’t also risen proportionally. I, for one, was much better off economically in 2019 (i.e. well into Trump’s term but before Covid hit) than in 2023. Now, I don’t blame Biden for this (if any one thing, I blame Covid), and I don’t believe Trump would make things better if elected in 2024. But I can understand the naive wish to have things back as they were in the (pre-Covid) Trump years. And I can understand hearing “the economy is doing well” and thinking “that means that the big corporations and people who play the stock market are getting richer, but that doesn’t help people like me.” ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2024, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/22 "2024-10-27T20:05:25Z")
I don’t really vote based on whether or not I’m better off. That seems rather selfish. But a lot of people are selfish, so I guess that question appeals to them. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2024, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/23 "2024-10-27T20:15:13Z")
I mean, ultimately, that’s the whole point of democracy. If everyone were selfless, then we wouldn’t need politics at all, and everyone would live in a Utopia. But in the real world, many people are selfish, and so we come up with systems like democracy to ensure that the result of people being selfish is, if not a Utopia, at least pretty decent for most folks. The problem comes when you have people who are not just selfish, but spiteful, and who will act against their own best interest just for the chance to hurt others. It’s a lot harder to design social systems that are robust against that. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/24 "2024-10-28T02:28:52Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > I don’t really vote based on whether or not I’m better off. Note that the “you” in “Are you better off…” could either be interpreted as singular or plural. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/25 "2024-10-28T03:19:13Z")
The maga-oriented media has engaged in a double gaslight these last few years, and the “Are you better off than 4 years ago?” is a quick allusion to both gaslights: 1. Conveniently forgetting all the chaos of the Trump years, as well as the collapse during covid; something a democrat president would never be given a pass for. 2. Misrepresenting the current state of the US; that the economy is in crisis and crime is spiralling etc etc. There’s also a devious use of the feedback loop. A number of Republicans recently have cited polls that say a majority of Americans believe that the US is “on the wrong track”. However, when you look at some of the related questions on such surveys people may answer that they are concerned about hateful rhetoric, rights being taken away or institutional norms being broken. In other words, many of the people saying the US in on the wrong track are complaining about _Republican_ actions and rhetoric. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/26 "2024-10-28T03:35:39Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > as well as the collapse during covid; something a democrat president would never be given a pass for. Just to elaborate a bit on this, one of the common MAGA talking points right now is that the “world is on fire” – that the conflicts in Gaza and Ukraine are somehow Biden’s fault. I like to imagine what the framing would be if the world events were reversed: that covid happened under Biden, and Gaza and Ukraine under Trump: _“Trump projected strength around the world by supporting our allies without needing to put any troops in harm’s way. Meanwhile Biden has been so weak that he has been unable to defend America from this pandemic; businesses are shuttering, unemployment has spiked, a million Americans have died, and people just want this madness to end”_ It’s way easier to write the talking points this way round. ---
**Author:** ![GailForce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/dfb087/32.png) [@GailForce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GailForce)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/27 "2024-10-28T16:05:36Z")
It’s a meta-question, in that the answer doesn’t need to be accurate or even to apply—it’s asked, and the answerer knows which answer hurts the libs and which helps Trump. In fact, you might even say that it’s a counter-gotcha question since almost everyone has terrible memoris of their economic (and every other) state four years, when we were in the midst of a horrific pandemic (a horrid memory alone) that seemed insoluble, hoping we could find a roll of toilet paper and survive a trip to the store without contracting the virus, scrubbing our delivered groceries, seeing the economy crater as unemployment rose to record levels, etc. It was the most miserable year on record for most Americans, yet the MAGAts are choosing it as their example of a hopeful and pleasing time? Not because anyone, even a hardcore MAGAnut, can honestly answer it affirmatively, but because they know it makes us nuts that they have the nerve to ask ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/28 "2024-10-28T16:30:10Z")
I believe most people vote for or against the incumbent regardless of the opponent. The question is a way to get the person to stop and say, “No I’m not. So I’ll vote against the incumbent.” Not really sure how that works in this election if you are not convinced by Mr. Trump that Kamala Harris qua Vice-President was the most powerful person on the face of the Earth yet still did nothing to control (insert topic of the day here). ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/29 "2024-10-28T20:04:26Z")
Another factor is [Rosy recollection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosy_retrospection). People in general remember the past as better than it was. I think part of this is that today they have worries and anxieties about what the future will bring. But looking into the past they can see that they for the most part managed to get through what ever it was they were scared of back then. So the anxieties of the past don’t have nearly the force of current anxieties. For example back in 2020 a person might have been worried about dying of Covid, but now that its 2024 and they are still alive they realize that they didn’t need to worry. Today however they may be worried about Russia using nuclear weapons against Ukraine, but they can’t similarly put those aside since it could still happen. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/30 "2024-10-28T23:57:29Z")
Having lost the word “thou,” you’re strictly correct, but I challenge the notion that when a common person hears “are you better off,” that they are thinking in the plural, else we’d ask the less ambiguous “are _we_ better off?” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2024, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/31 "2024-10-29T01:40:13Z")
Four years ago , Americans were dying so fast from Covid they were stacking them up in refrigerator trucks. One Million Americans died. How soon we forget. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2024, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/32 "2024-10-30T22:23:25Z")
Relevant article with facts 'n stuff (note, these facts are not being shared by the Trump campaign). [Trump wants to compare now to four years ago. Here’s what it looks like](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/does-trump-really-want-compare-now-four-years-ago-2024-10-30/) Summary: - In 2020 COVID was deadly and life expectancy fell - Year before pandemic gives a better base for comparison - Economy is 11.5% larger now than at the end of 2019 - Incomes are higher now but voters are still mad about inflation ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/33 "2024-10-31T14:19:29Z")
It’s a great question to ask voters. Most people want to be making more money than they are at a better job in a better career, feel like they pay too much for everything, have no idea how they are going to pay for expensive stuff like houses and college education for their children or retirement, and generally find something to be pissed off or concerned about related to the economy or their personal finances. At the very least, most people are probably either in the same job they had 4 years ago, but everything else is more expensive and they have more stuff they have to pay for because of lifestyle creep. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/34 "2024-10-31T14:24:40Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > most people are probably either in the same job they had 4 years ago, but everything else is more expensive Maybe, but everything is slightly cheaper for “most people” since average real wages are up from 2019, and up the most for hourly workers. ---
**Author:** ![excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e8c25b/32.png) [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/excavating_for_a_mind)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/35 "2024-10-31T15:21:55Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Maybe, but everything is slightly cheaper for “most people” since average real wages are up from 2019, and up the most for hourly workers But, “most people” believe their wages are up only because of their hard work and the great contribution they make to their employer’s bottom line. It has nothing to do with the economy. /s Reality means nothing to these people. They aren’t gong to believe their lyin’ eyes when they have Fox News around to tell them what to believe. These people are the ones who believe there is a likely chance (or better) that the 2020 election was stolen because of voter fraud. They also believe the COVID pandemic was not really that bad, and that it was really bad, launched by China because of Trump’s tariffs. Both at the same time. So, if the world’s response to unilateral tariffs is to release deadly, virulent viruses, then by all means, let’s impose more tariffs! (wait! I thought I turned off that sarcasm switch!) ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/36 "2024-10-31T15:40:16Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > But, “most people” believe their wages are up only because of their hard work and the great contribution they make to their employer’s bottom line. It has nothing to do with the economy. I think this is true across the political spectrum. People think they’ve earned their wage increases but nasty inflation has eaten into it. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/37 "2024-10-31T15:55:25Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > It’s not just that they believe the propaganda (they do), but also that their personal economic situation is due entirely to their own hard work and was achieved despite the bumbling going on in the Oval Office (which makes them an even harder worker, to overcome such adversity). > > You see journalists on TV asking voters if they are better off than 4 years ago all the time. If, after they complained about how ridiculous the high prices are, the journalists would ask them if they were getting paid more than they were 4 years ago, they still wouldn’t make the connection. Inflation is the sole responsibility of the President. The increase of their personal wages has nothing to do with the economy, it is only due to the superior performance they provide their employer. This. The whole “better off” chestnut is connected to inflation. And since there is always _some_ inflation (because any amount of deflation is even worse), prices as a whole are always higher than they were four years ago. Ergo, things always look better four years ago if you only look at the cost of goods and services. It’s like the $1.50 hot dog and drink at Costco. Customers will have a fit if they ever raise the price, even though the price was set at $1.50 back in _1984_, some 40 years ago. Adjusting for CPI since then, the price should be $4.55 today because $1.50 in 1984 had the same purchasing power as $4.55 today. But if Costco ever raises the price, people will scream about a supposed price increase. The same thing applies to McDonald’s prices, gasoline, and eggs. Sometimes it’s market forces (like bird flu affecting the price of eggs, or global conflict affecting the price of oil), but in the absence of that, it’s just simple inflation, which by its nature compounds every year. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/38 "2024-10-31T15:57:57Z")
I also want to point out that for every story the OP can see about people spending $12 on donuts, going to Starbucks, the state fair, iPhones, Costco, etc., that there are always many hidden anecdotes that he and others cannot see. Somewhere, there are also people who are scrimping and saving or have lost their savings or are buried in credit-card debt or who have to resort to this means or that mean to make ends meet on groceries or visit their food pantry. Those people are far less visible, though. To cite my own (meaningless sample size of 1): My savings have approximately halved in the last two years. Groceries at H-E-B are significantly steeper than before. Rental rates are noticeably up. Adjusted for inflation, I’m actually earning a lower salary right now at age 36 than I was at age 23, despite being over a decade into my career. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/39 "2024-10-31T15:59:40Z")
Neve rmind ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2024, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282/40 "2024-11-01T02:41:31Z")
> [@robby](#): > > It’s like the $1.50 hot dog and drink at Costco. Customers will have a fit if they ever raise the price, even though the price was set at $1.50 back in _1984_, some 40 years ago. Adjusting for CPI since then, the price should be $4.55 today because $1.50 in 1984 had the same purchasing power as $4.55 today. But if Costco ever raises the price, people will scream about a supposed price increase. 5c coca cola had become such an established part of the brand that it was sold at this price for some 75 years. One approach to try to make it profitable again was to make vending machines that occasionally dropped an empty bottle out. Unsurprisingly, these machines were not popular. > **[Fixed price of Coca-Cola from 1886 to 1959](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fixed_price_of_Coca-Cola_from_1886_to_1959)** > > Between 1886 and 1959, the price of a 6.5 US fl oz (190 mL) glass or bottle of Coca-Cola was set at five cents, or one nickel, and remained fixed with very little local fluctuation. The Coca-Cola Company was able to maintain this price for several reasons, including bottling contracts the company signed in 1899, advertising, vending machine technology, and a relatively low rate of inflation (with 5 cents in 1886 being worth about 15 cents in 1959, compared to 5 cents in 1959 being worth about 5... [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-are-you-better-off-than-you-were-4-years-ago-supposed-to-be-such-a-gotcha-question/1009282.md?page=3)