# Why is Birtherism racist? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 3, 2017, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443 "2017-12-03T12:37:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/21 "2017-12-03T14:31:42Z")
you always have these wild nutty theories when it comes to presidential politics . Last year we had the child sex ring pizza parlor story that was attached to Clinton. It did not get as much attention as birtherism. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/22 "2017-12-03T14:33:39Z")
You don’t always have them, and the 2 that you mentioned came from the same party. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/23 "2017-12-03T14:37:39Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > But I don’t get that really stupid people thinking he was born in Kenya is a part of the racism against him? > > If they said he was born in UK, France or Germany ,etc would that also be racism? Would the birtherists have made such a thing of it if his father had been a white man born in Europe? Or, come to think of it, if it had been his mother who was a black African and his father a white American? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/24 "2017-12-03T14:48:22Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > Would the birtherists have made such a thing of it if his father had been a white man born in Europe? Or, come to think of it, if it had been his mother who was a black African and his father a white American? Obama was also in a rather unusual position wrt to his parents. His mother died before he gained national prominence, so she wasn’t around to be a visible reminder of his Americanness. His father was no help either, as he actually was born in Kenya and had moved back there by the time Obama got into politics. I’m not sure how visible his maternal grandparents were, as they played a big role in raising him, but I don’t recall ever seeing anything of them. And of course the name doesn’t help, either, as already noted. So, I don’t know if a Hillary Clinton had actually been Ekaterian Ivanova Romanov, the daughter of young, American mother (now deceased) and a Russian father, now living in Russia would have had a Birther issue or not, but it’s certainly not inconceivable. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/25 "2017-12-03T15:15:46Z")
Obama’s father died in a car wreck in 1982 while prez Obama was still in college (so way before politics) but he did live in Kenya when he died. ---
**Author:** ![coffeecat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coffeecat/32/3405_2.png) [@coffeecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coffeecat)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/26 "2017-12-03T15:31:56Z")
I dislike calling people racist unless I’m sure, so in fairness, birthers might not be racists. They might just be fools. ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/27 "2017-12-03T15:51:43Z")
There was one unfortunate bit of reality that perhaps was just enough to give the Birtherism crap the legs that it had. In 1991, long before he entered the national political stage, Obama’s literary agent [did in fact](https://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/booklet.asp) release promotional material about a book with a jacket cover bio claiming Obama was born in Kenya. Of course a publisher’s marketing bio should not be given the same weight as an actual birth certificate produced by a state’s vital records office. A birth certificate is one of the primary types of evidence we would expect anyone else to produce to support their claim of US citizenship. Once he released his birth certificate that should have put an end to speculation. The continued Birtherism after that point is hard to chalk up to anything but racist motivations. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/28 "2017-12-03T16:41:28Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Obama’s father died in a car wreck in 1982 while prez Obama was still in college (so way before politics) but he did live in Kenya when he died. Yes, you are correct and my statement was not clear about that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/29 "2017-12-03T16:46:48Z")
> [@Iggy](#): > > There was one unfortunate bit of reality that perhaps was just enough to give the Birtherism crap the legs that it had. In 1991, long before he entered the national political stage, Obama’s literary agent [did in fact](https://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/booklet.asp) release promotional material about a book with a jacket cover bio claiming Obama was born in Kenya. > > Of course a publisher’s marketing bio should not be given the same weight as an actual birth certificate produced by a state’s vital records office. A birth certificate is one of the primary types of evidence we would expect anyone else to produce to support their claim of US citizenship. Once he released his birth certificate that should have put an end to speculation. The continued Birtherism after that point is hard to chalk up to anything but racist motivations. Except that people continue to believe all kinds of conspiracy theories after they are proven false, and most of those CTs have nothing to do with race. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/30 "2017-12-03T16:57:54Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Except that people continue to believe all kinds of conspiracy theories after they are proven false, and most of those CTs have nothing to do with race. The really classic ones are, though, if we count Judaism as a race. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/31 "2017-12-03T16:58:59Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I’m not confusing anything. You,and others, are confusing something that can be caused by racism with something that can only be caused by racism. Who here has said that? I personally don’t believe that it was _only_ caused by racism, but that doesn’t rule out the possibility that it was _largely_ caused by racism. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/32 "2017-12-03T17:01:29Z")
The undertone of the whole thing was that he was not a real American. He was an Other. What could that mean? A lot of people believed an obvious conspiracy theory about him not really being “one of us”. What do you think was the most common factor in motivating such a belief? I’ll give you a hint: a lot of these people made sure to call him Barack HUSSEIN Obama. This isn’t even touching on the whole “secret muslim” thing, which wasn’t exactly an uncommon belief among that group. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/33 "2017-12-03T17:06:05Z")
It’s because Kenya, which is in Africa, is full of black people. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/34 "2017-12-03T17:12:05Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > It’s because Kenya, which is in Africa, is full of black people. I have to admit, it would be difficult for me to find Kenya on an unlabeled map, but I’m fairly confident a lot of birthers would have trouble even finding Africa. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/35 "2017-12-03T17:13:58Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Who here has said that? I personally don’t believe that it was _only_ caused by racism, but that doesn’t rule out the possibility that it was _largely_ caused by racism. I agree, and I have to add that IMHO birtherism was and remains a dog whistle. Easy for Trump and minions to bat their eyes and to plausibly deny it to most Republicans and be accepted by most of them as not being racist (and most may sincerely believe it, but the results means that once again they end up also supporting some people that sincerely are racists), but the significant number of bigots that made the difference in the past and current elections will get it. > **[The Nation: Confronting Trump's Coded Racism](https://www.npr.org/2011/04/27/135777342/the-nation-confronting-trumps-coded-racism)** > > President Obama released his birth certificate today, after Real estate developer and reality TV show host Donald Trump attacked him publicly. Ari Melber of The Nation argues that Trump's calls are racist — and it's time for the media to pay... ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/36 "2017-12-03T17:17:10Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > … > I’ll give you a hint: a lot of these people made sure to call him Barack HUSSEIN Obama. > … Abso-fucking-lutely. The odd thing is that anyone thinks there is something subtle about the racism involved. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/37 "2017-12-03T17:55:20Z")
I don’t think the thread has covered Ted Cruz yet. I would submit that he also provides evidence that “birtherism” is rooted in racism. Ted Cruz was born in Canada to an American mother and a Cuban father. His antecedents are very similar to Obama’s, except that he was actually born in another country. Despite that, it was generally accepted that he was an American citizen at birth through his mother, and therefore eligible to run for President. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/38 "2017-12-03T17:56:25Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Who here has said that? I think it’s a reasonable interpretation of post #2 and the post I was responding two. If either of them wishes to update their posts to clarify that, I’ll be happy to stand corrected. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/39 "2017-12-03T18:05:41Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > I don’t think the thread has covered Ted Cruz yet. I would submit that he also provides evidence that “birtherism” is rooted in racism. Ted Cruz was born in Canada to an American mother and a Cuban father. His antecedents are very similar to Obama’s, except that he was actually born in another country. Despite that, it was generally accepted that he was an American citizen at birth through his mother, and therefore eligible to run for President. [Under Ted Cruz’s own logic, he’s ineligible for the White House](https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2016/01/11/through-ted-cruz-constitutional-looking-glass/zvKE6qpF31q2RsvPO9nGoK/story.html) Written by Cruz’s Constitutional law professor. > [@](#): > > People are entitled to their own opinions about what the definition ought to be. But the kind of judge Cruz says he admires and would appoint to the Supreme Court is an “originalist,” one who claims to be bound by the narrowly historical meaning of the Constitution’s terms at the time of their adoption.To his kind of judge, Cruz ironically wouldn’t be eligible, because the legal principles that prevailed in the 1780s and ’90s required that someone actually be born on US soil to be a “natural born” citizen. Even having two US parents wouldn’t suffice. And having just an American mother, as Cruz did, would have been insufficient at a time that made patrilineal descent decisive. > > On the other hand, the kind of judge I admire and Cruz abhors is a “living constitutionalist,” one who believes that the Constitution’s meaning evolves with the perceived needs of the time and longstanding practice. To that kind of judge, Cruz would be eligible to serve because it no longer makes sense to be bound by the narrow historical definition that would disqualify him. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2017, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443/40 "2017-12-03T18:16:27Z")
THere’s also the whole ‘fellow travellers’ bit, while Trump might be the most famous Birther, proven racist scumbag Sherrif Joe Arpio was one of the biggest and latest promters of the theory. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-birtherism-racist/803443.md?page=3)