# Why is bittorrent still so hassle-free to use? Where's the RIAA, Hollywood, etc? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 7, 2007, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813 "2007-10-07T02:13:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Windwalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/5e9695/32.png) [@Windwalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Windwalker)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/1 "2007-10-07T02:13:05Z")
I’ve heard that there have been isolated crackdowns on certain bittorrent trackers, but for the most part, it seems torrent downloads are still virtually unimpeded. You can get virtually all the semi-popular movies out there, entire catalogues of musical groups, all recent TV shows, etc. And it’s not like it’s hidden at all; the popular torrent search engines list all of these files by their proper name, and you don’t need any special access codes to get to the search engines or to start downloading via most trackers. Why can’t Big Media just do random torrent searches for their products and then go bust up the trackers that support the files? ::scratches head:: ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/2 "2007-10-07T02:27:38Z")
I believe that the trackers are located in places where it’s difficult for them to get sued. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/3 "2007-10-07T02:31:01Z")
Since a few versions ago, there are also trackerless torrents where each seed acts as its own tracker. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/4 "2007-10-07T02:31:09Z")
shhhh ---
**Author:** ![Dunderman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecb155/32.png) [@Dunderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunderman)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/5 "2007-10-07T02:31:13Z")
As I understand it, the trackers themselves store no illegal material, they merely maintain links to the files. ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/6 "2007-10-07T06:10:00Z")
[QUOTE=Windwalker] I’ve heard that there have been isolated crackdowns on certain bittorrent trackers, but for the most part, it seems torrent downloads are still virtually unimpeded. You can get virtually all the semi-popular movies out there, entire catalogues of musical groups, all recent TV shows, etc. And it’s not like it’s hidden at all; the popular torrent search engines list all of these files by their proper name, and you don’t need any special access codes to get to the search engines or to start downloading via most trackers. Why can’t Big Media just do random torrent searches for their products and then go bust up the trackers that support the files? ::scratches head:: [/QUOTE] I think what Windwalker is asking and please correct me if I’m wrong is Why doesn’t Big Media pretend to be Joe User, visit a tracker site and start downloading their own material. Then log the IP’s that they download from? If I understand the question correctly, Big Media does do that at times but there are ways to somewhat protect yourself which I won’t go into here so as not to violate the rules. ---
**Author:** ![Tyrrell\_McAllister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tyrrell_mcallister/32/16772_2.png) [@Tyrrell\_McAllister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tyrrell_McAllister)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/7 "2007-10-07T09:57:28Z")
[QUOTE=MannyL] I think what Windwalker is asking and please correct me if I’m wrong is Why doesn’t Big Media pretend to be Joe User, visit a tracker site and start downloading their own material. Then log the IP’s that they download from? If I understand the question correctly, Big Media does do that at times but there are ways to somewhat protect yourself which I won’t go into here so as not to violate the rules. [/QUOTE] Indeed, the RIAA just [won a judgment](http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20071004-verdict-is-in.html) in which the evidence against the defendant appears to have been gathered in just such a fashion. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/8 "2007-10-07T13:37:26Z")
[QUOTE=Tyrrell McAllister] Indeed, the RIAA just [won a judgment](http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20071004-verdict-is-in.html) in which the evidence against the defendant appears to have been gathered in just such a fashion. [/QUOTE] Yes, but I believe the defendant in that case used Kazaa or a similar program. I would imagine one of the problems with BitTorrent is that no one person is providing the whole program/file (afaik). ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/9 "2007-10-07T17:19:57Z")
[QUOTE=brickbacon] Yes, but I believe the defendant in that case used Kazaa or a similar program. I would imagine one of the problems with BitTorrent is that no one person is providing the whole program/file (afaik). [/QUOTE] The claim is it doesn’t matter if you are providing the whole file or just parts you are still breaking the law (as it is written) this is not IMHO so I will keep my opinions to myself ---
**Author:** ![Flander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8c91f0/32.png) [@Flander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flander)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/10 "2007-10-07T17:32:55Z")
I believe that part of the issue is that a lot of seeders don’t have the material for all that long. I’ll use a movie as an example. Let’s say I download Transformers via bittorrent. It’s a new movie so there are a ton of people leaching and seeding. Once I download it, watch it/burn it, I may seed it for a while, but I’ll probably just delete the file. Why go after someone who downloaded your movie if he’s deleted it by the time you collect enough evidence? If I’ve got a dedicated file server constantly seeding these movies, that’s another thing. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/11 "2007-10-07T19:04:13Z")
[QUOTE=Priceguy] As I understand it, the trackers themselves store no illegal material, they merely maintain links to the files. [/QUOTE] Facilitating copyright infringement is prosecutable too. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/12 "2007-10-07T19:11:50Z")
[QUOTE=Walloon] Facilitating copyright infringement is prosecutable too. [/QUOTE] Yup, the largest trackers have all had their legal problems and have had to move hosting to less fussy jurisdictions. ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/13 "2007-10-07T19:15:12Z")
Also there are some non-infringing uses for the Bit torrent protocol so it’s harder to “shut it down” like centralized filing sharing services. The Bit Torrent protocol is used to share many Linux images and some legal movie sites use it as well ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2007, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/14 "2007-10-07T19:19:03Z")
[QUOTE=MannyL] The Bit Torrent protocol is used to share many Linux images and some legal movie sites use it as well [/QUOTE] The BBC iPlayer service (basically you can download DRMed copies of the previous weeks programmes) also uses bit-torrent technology. ---
**Author:** ![Windwalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/5e9695/32.png) [@Windwalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Windwalker)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2007, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/15 "2007-10-08T01:49:57Z")
[QUOTE=MannyL] I think what Windwalker is asking and please correct me if I’m wrong is Why doesn’t Big Media pretend to be Joe User, visit a tracker site and start downloading their own material. Then log the IP’s that they download from? If I understand the question correctly, Big Media does do that at times but there are ways to somewhat protect yourself which I won’t go into here so as not to violate the rules. [/QUOTE] Essentially, yes. All of the evidence they need (in my uninformed eyes) is right there for the taking. I guess your super-secret ways to protect yourself are the key 🙂 Does that mostly involve moving offshore, as someone else said? ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2007, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/16 "2007-10-08T02:24:50Z")
[QUOTE=brickbacon] Yes, but I believe the defendant in that case used Kazaa or a similar program. I would imagine one of the problems with BitTorrent is that no one person is providing the whole program/file (afaik). [/QUOTE] Actually, once you’ve downloaded the file and become a seeder, you are sharing the whole file. I don’t know why more people aren’t getting sued, but I have heard of HBO going after people who share what they feel is too much, whatever that is. Download the latest episode of Rome? They don’t care so much. Download it and then share it for a week, and lots of gigabytes? They’ll start to notice your IP, and you risk becoming their next example of what not to do. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2007, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/17 "2007-10-08T02:38:06Z")
[QUOTE=Struan] The BBC iPlayer service (basically you can download DRMed copies of the previous weeks programmes) also uses bit-torrent technology. [/QUOTE] [hijack]Do you know if it’s possible to use this to watch BBC programmes outside the UK? Because this would be cool.[/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![berff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/43a26b/32.png) [@berff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/berff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2007, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/18 "2007-10-08T03:01:13Z")
I won’t go into much detail about protecting yourself either, but I’ve noticed in my logs that certain media companies such as HBO and Time Warner are often trying to connect to my computer, unsuccessfully (I hope). ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2007, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/19 "2007-10-08T03:34:21Z")
[QUOTE=Windwalker] Essentially, yes. All of the evidence they need (in my uninformed eyes) is right there for the taking. I guess your super-secret ways to protect yourself are the key 🙂 Does that mostly involve moving offshore, as someone else said? [/QUOTE] My ways are not super-secret but this board does not like talking about ways to break or get around the laws. There is no prohibition (that I am aware of) to discuss what was done in the past. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2007, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813/20 "2007-10-08T05:47:29Z")
[QUOTE=levdrakon] Actually, once you’ve downloaded the file and become a seeder, you are sharing the whole file. [/QUOTE] OK, but I don’t think most people end up downloading a whole file from one person. I think it would be kinda hard to sue someone for providing 3 minutes of the new Die Hard movie in files broken up into 37 pieces. I could be wrong, but it seems as though people aren’t getting in trouble for it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-bittorrent-still-so-hassle-free-to-use-wheres-the-riaa-hollywood-etc/421813.md?page=2)