# why is Howard the Duck so hated? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 14, 2003, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187 "2003-11-14T05:08:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ddgryphon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8c91f0/32.png) [@ddgryphon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ddgryphon)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/21 "2003-11-14T15:11:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CalMeacham \* > \*\*I haven’t seen the film since the original release, but I have to say that: > > 1. It wasn’t as bad as it’s made out to be, but it’s still not good. > > 2. There was a BIG marketing blitz on when it came out, and the heightened expectations might have magnified the film’s deficiencies. (Does anyone remember that Playboy had an article on this – it featured pix from the “PlayDuck” magazine Howard reads in his apartment.) > > 3. the film didn’t feel at allk like the comics. \*\* That’s my opinion in a nutshell: Not really good, not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. The marketing probably had a lot to do with it and the destruction of Howard’s basic personality hurt too. I also, feel that the writer’s et. al. really didn’t have an appreciation for the sarcastic, bitter social commentary that always made HTD: The comic so great to read. ---
**Author:** ![Eats\_Crayons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/278dde/32.png) [@Eats\_Crayons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eats_Crayons)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/22 "2003-11-14T15:15:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RTFirefly \* > \*\*3. Screw all the audioanimatronics wizardry – it still looked like a Guy In A Duck Suit, and unconvincing as hell. Ultimately, unless you have a decent movie underneath all the Industrial Light & Magic, the IL&M isn’t gonna save your ass. \*\* That’s the feeling I mentioned above. Onset, it seemed that the focus was on the fancy-schmancy ILM tech. Like “we can make this work.” (And no, really, you can’t with a suit. Any human in a suit will be too clunky for a spazz like Howard. The puppet was _worse_.) There wasn’t a sense that people appreciated the “big picture.” Everyone was too preoccupied making things work technically, as if it was an exercise. And, the script was a lousy read! I mean an exceptionally lousy read. Like, a did-you-even-touch-a-single-comic, pulled-out-of-a-hungover-screenwriting-student’s-ass lousy read. I thought it was an incomplete version (it wasn’t, that was it). I was really dubious when I read it, but was told “it’ll seem a lot better onscreen.” :rolleyes: You can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/23 "2003-11-14T15:35:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RickJay \* > > 1. The movie is absolutely awful, among the worst major films of its time. I know people really want to like it and apologize for it, but it’s an utterly putrid movie all the same. Can’t argue with you there. Except that the number of people who still want to like it is small, once they’ve actually _seen_ it. > [@](#): > > 1. The byline of the movie was “Trapped In A World He Never Made.” What? From the cover of each issue of the HtD comic. > [@](#): > > The fact that it was different from the comics didn’t have much to do with it, I suspect; few people have ever read the “Howard the Duck” comics and they’d have to bring in a much broader audience to make any money. If it had been a good movie anyway it could have worked even if some comic book guys were bitching about the differences. But the movie sucked big time. Yes and no, I think. Like you say, if they’d made a good movie that had nothing to do with the comic book HtD, it would have done just fine, and the only people disappointed would have been a few of us disgruntled HtD comic fans. But the problem is, that isn’t all that easy. The reason why you want to adapt X to the big screen from some other medium is that in other medium, X contains something worthwhile to make a move _from_, something to give the germ of the idea of a movie some shape and direction. In this case, that potential ‘something’ was the character of Howard the Duck. That’s pretty much it. This gave them a greater degree of freedom than with most adaptations; there was no plot to be followed, and only one essential supporting character. But on the flip side, if you aren’t going to use Howard the Duck’s core personality, you’re starting from scratch. You’ve got really nothing to work with. I think they couldn’t decide which way they were going to go, there - whether they wanted Howard to be Howard, and if not, what they wanted the movie to be instead. A gazillion dollars later, they still hadn’t decided, and the results of that lack of identity and direction were released to the theatres. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/24 "2003-11-14T18:51:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BrotherCadfael \* > \*\*Laura Prepon as Bev…Yeah, that’d work. \*\* With Timothy Busfield as the Galactic Overlord and James Gammon as the voice of Howard? ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/25 "2003-11-14T20:20:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eats\_Crayons \* > \*\*As a friend of the dwarf in question, _do not ever_ called him a “midget.” It’s considered offensive and he personally find it infuriating and I’d quickly pit you n his behalf. **Rjung** that goes for you too. > \*\* With all due respect to Chip Ziem, I’m reminded of an anecdote by Harlan Ellison (whose stuff I haven’t read in 20 years, but suddenly I’m quoting him twice in two days): Back in the 60s, he wrote something that used the term “midget” and got an angry letter about it, to the effect of “Dear Mr. Ellison, I’m 3’8” and take strong offense to the term ‘midget.’ We prefer beong called ‘little people.’ " Ellison immediately replied “At 5’2”, I am a little person. You, sir, are a midget." ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/26 "2003-11-14T21:12:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eats\_Crayons \* > \*\ ***Brother** , actually Lea Thompson is much, _much_ better looking in person. The camera is unkind to her. She didn’t quite have the right voice for Beverly though. Should’ve been scruffier sounding. (In my head, Beverly sounds like Bonnie Tyler.) \*\* Believe me, **Eats\_Crayons** , I have absolutely nothing against Lea Thompson…I was just commenting on **Krokodil’s** casting suggestion. It’s been years since I read the comic book (if I recall correctly, it went under after I had read about four issues), and I never saw the movie. Was Dr. Bong in it? ---
**Author:** ![vandal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/858c86/32.png) [@vandal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vandal)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/27 "2003-11-14T21:20:16Z")
Well, bad movie or not, it was nice to see Lea Thompson in her panties. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/28 "2003-11-14T21:21:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eats\_Crayons \* > And no, really, you can’t with a suit. Any human in a suit will be too clunky for a spazz like Howard. To be fair, the first **Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles** movie did some _damn_ fine work with “folks in suits.” The fact that it was fairly faithful to the original comic was a plus (save for the “eat pizza, dude!” bits). And apologies for the dwarf/midgit mixup. Sooooooooooooo… anyone up for a new **HtD** movie, done right? With today’s computer effects, an accurate portrayal of Howard would be a cakewalk… ---
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/29 "2003-11-14T21:59:28Z")
**Eats\_Crayons** : > [@](#): > > As a friend of the dwarf in question, _do not ever_ called him a “midget.” It’s considered offensive and he personally find it infuriating and I’d quickly pit you n his behalf. **Rjung** that goes for you too. Oh, yeah? Well, I reckon midgets would find it offensive that Mr. Ziem thinks it’s offensive to be referred to as a midget. I know the terms “dwarf” and “midget” are different in their medical meanings, but I’m at a loss as to how it can be offensive to one to be taken for the other. > [@](#): > > Secondly, when hubby and wife Willard and Gloria team up as directors, it ends in disaster (_American Graffitti_ notwithstanding). It doesn’t have to unwithstand, because George Lucas directed _American Graffiti._ ---
**Author:** ![bughunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@bughunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bughunter)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/30 "2003-11-14T22:47:39Z")
Frankly, I thought _My Stepmother is an Alien_ was a much better movie about extraterrestrials knocked off course by lightning-struck radio telescopes. And Kim Basinger is way hotter than some guy in a duck suit. ---
**Author:** ![Eats\_Crayons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/278dde/32.png) [@Eats\_Crayons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eats_Crayons)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/31 "2003-11-14T23:24:11Z")
Clarification: Chip Zien is not a dwarf. He was also not in a duck suit. And I’ve never met him. He provided the voice, since Robin Williams bowed out. There were several “ducks.” **Fiver** – You are mistaken. Back in the day, an adult whose head and limbs were the same proportion to their body (those with achondroplasia have proportionately shorter limbs, and larger heads, compared to their trunk) was referred to as “midget”, but it has _not_ been acceptable for a very long time. One cause of that form of dwarfism is growth hormone defficiency that is knows also known as hypopituitary dwarfism or hypopituitarism, but it has other causes as well. If you like, you can visit the [Little People of America](http://www.lpaonline.org/) for more details. Or look it up on other sources. YMMV outside of North America, but it’s not generally accepted here. It has similar negative connotation that puts it on a par with “retard”. Secondly, the mainstream media is finally paying a bit more attention. Often you’ll see newspapers or magazines, use “midget” and it’s often followed by a retraction the following day. But they are becoming more aware in recent decades. For example, in a recent episode of _CSI_ a character was lambasted for mistakenly using the term “midget”. It’s a matter of educating the public, but it’s a slow process. **Re: _American Grafitti_** I should have said “team up” period. Willard and Gloria co-wrote it with George Lucas (who also directed). They’ve worked together as a “team” for a long time – usually as writers, sometimes as writer/director. Either way, whenver they’ve teamed up the shoot has been rather “chaotic.” I’ve noticed on the IMDB they haven’t done anything since _Radioland Murders_ (another serious money-loser, IIRC) in 1994. Back to the OP: **Rjung** what made TMNT so much fun is the whole joke that _turtles_ could execute graceful ninja maneuvers. They had to be thick looking and clunky. Howard had too much of a human presence and a human feel. He needed to be “lighter” somehow. The earlier version of the costume was much more Howard-like, and made him look a bit trashier, but I could totally understand why they thought it was too unappealing to look at. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/32 "2003-11-15T00:19:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by vandal \* > \*\*Well, bad movie or not, it was nice to see Lea Thompson in her panties. 😛 \*\* True. That much, at least. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/33 "2003-11-15T01:21:48Z")
**Sam Stone, Jeff Olsen** There was no Galactic Overlord in the film. The character in question was a **Dark Overlord Of The Universe**. I kinda like the movie. It was a light, forgettable film. IMHO The huge buildup and George Lucas’ name raised expectations and made it seem much worse than it was. HTD wasn’t really any worse than most of the of the stuff studios churn out. I say the way to really do the comic right is an animated series on HBO. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187/34 "2003-11-15T02:28:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DocCathode \* > **There was no Galactic Overlord in the film. The character in question was a Dark Overlord Of The Universe.** “Sez you!” —The Galactic Overlord [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-howard-the-duck-so-hated/213187.md?page=1)