# Why is it offensive to kneel during the anthem? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 27, 2017, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435 "2017-09-27T16:19:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/41 "2017-09-27T20:54:03Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > You aren’t missing anything. > > The people who are claiming it is disrespectful would sing a different tune if the reason for the protest were different. > Indeed, Kap chose kneeling precisely to avoid the appearence of disrespect. He failed miserably. As far as protesting something, if he had a legitimate beef about something, that would have been a different story. But he didn’t. Tell ya what, Kap. You want to protest something? Go to Chicago and protest the wholesale slaughter of blacks by other blacks. Do something worthwhile with your life. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/42 "2017-09-27T20:59:17Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Anyway, going down on one knee is typically a sign of respect. It what you do before a monarch, if your country has a monarch. So why is it offensive to do during the anthem? If anything, it’s showing greater respect than people who are merely standing. The guy that started it did it to specifically show disrespect, or at least a lack of respect: > [@](#): > > “I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color,” Kaepernick told NFL Media in an exclusive interview after the game [http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000691077/article/colin-kaepernick-explains-why-he-sat-during-national-anthem](http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000691077/article/colin-kaepernick-explains-why-he-sat-during-national-anthem) And people don’t kneel before a monarch to show respect. They do it to show obedience and submission. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/43 "2017-09-27T21:22:58Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > As far as protesting something, if he had a legitimate beef about something, that would have been a different story. But he didn’t. The systematic murder of Americans is not something legitimate to protest? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/44 "2017-09-27T21:24:25Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Well, yeah. Your boss does in fact have the right to control what you say while on the clock, and to an extent off it. . . The [Commissioner](http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000829979/article/roger-goodell-offers-opinion-on-anthem-protests) of the League has said it’s ok. The majority of teams[owners](http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/25/politics/nfl-protests-weekend/index.html) have said its ok. the players [union](http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/352023-nfl-players-union-head-we-will-never-back-down-from-protecting) has said its ok. The league [sponsors](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/27/business/nfl-sponsors-anthem-protests.html?mcubz=3) who have made a statement, have said its ok mc ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/45 "2017-09-27T21:55:13Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > The systematic murder of Americans is not something legitimate to protest? 😕 Apparently not if you’re a white Republican and the Americans being systematically murdered are black. Then the protestors should just shut up and only deal with black-on-black violence. Thanks for whitesplainin’ that for us, Mr. Hump! ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/46 "2017-09-27T23:20:05Z")
I’m not sure anyone answered the OP’s question. Leaving politics out of it, “taking a knee” is something that a football quarterback does to basically bow out of playing the ball (typically to eat up a few seconds at the end of the game when the QB’s team is leading). You can see Tom Brady do this at 16:15 [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i96fPP37RyA) ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/47 "2017-09-27T23:48:43Z")
> [@LC\_Strawhouse](#): > > I’m not sure anyone answered the OP’s question. Leaving politics out of it, “taking a knee” is something that a football quarterback does to basically bow out of playing the ball (typically to eat up a few seconds at the end of the game when the QB’s team is leading). You can see Tom Brady do this at 16:15 [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i96fPP37RyA) Ah. Now it makes sense. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/48 "2017-09-27T23:52:00Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Free speech on your own time IMO in case you were wondering Even if it’s allowed by the employer? For instance, if the Starbucks CEO said “I don’t care what political T-shirts my employees wear” you would still be against it? ---
**Author:** ![mistymage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mistymage/32/459_2.png) [@mistymage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mistymage)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/49 "2017-09-27T23:53:29Z")
> [@LC\_Strawhouse](#): > > I’m not sure anyone answered the OP’s question. Leaving politics out of it, “taking a knee” is something that a football quarterback does to basically bow out of playing the ball (typically to eat up a few seconds at the end of the game when the QB’s team is leading). You can see Tom Brady do this at 16:15 [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i96fPP37RyA) They (both teams) also do it when someone is injured as a sign of respect and concern. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/50 "2017-09-28T01:31:59Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Ah. Now it makes sense. Thanks. I think that is an extremely idiosyncratic interpretation. There is no evidence it is how either the kneelers intend the gesture or how it has been received by either the sympathetic or unsympathetic. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/51 "2017-09-28T01:33:37Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > I am corrected about other countries playing their national anthem before sporting events. > > I still think it’s stupid. It is. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/52 "2017-09-28T01:45:50Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > The systematic murder of Americans is not something legitimate to protest? 😕 Is there a Holocaust going on that I am not aware of? ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/53 "2017-09-28T01:49:01Z")
A lot of people get outraged when they are told they should be outraged. In an alternative universe, people are told to kneel during the singing of the national anthem, and the people choosing to stand are the ones who are judged as unpatriotic. That universe kinda makes more sense than this one, if you ask me. But it is not as good as the universe where people don’t care what you do. I wish I could go to that place. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/54 "2017-09-28T01:50:29Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Is there a Holocaust going on that I am not aware of? How many unarmed, innocent, compliant Americans need to be killed by government officials before it’s too many? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/55 "2017-09-28T02:08:11Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > :dubious: > > No. > > Personally I think ANY protest during the flag/national anthem thingy is disrespectful. > > For this reason. FIRST, it would be kinda nice if politics could be left outa some shit. Secondly, You can probably come up with a few dozen “major” issues that need protesting…so is EVERY flag/national anthem thingy gonna have somebody protesting about something? Yes, absolutely. Why not? In the United States, unlike some other countries, we have only one flag to represent governmental authority as well as the nation in general. If one has a problem with governmental policy, then it’s absolutely a valid and honorable exercise of free expression to refuse obeisance to the symbol of the state. Also, a mandatory mass display of loyalty during a private commercial entertainment performance is absolutely a political act, especially if one vocal segment of the population claims the right to define what behavior is acceptable during that display. I say screw people who claim to define what patriotism or love of country is. Screw people who demand that everyone around them express their loyalty or love of country in a particular way at any particular place and time. This is cultural bullying, pure and simple. Mandatory displays of national loyalty are inherently anathema to democracy. So far as I am concerned, the First Amendment should be understood to ban the state not only from demanding displays of loyalty, but even from creating symbols of the state or procedures for showing loyalty. In other words, it should be considered unconstitutional for the government to even create or authorize something like the Pledge of Allegiance or the seal of the office of the president, or any titles of office. (One might note the irony that early Christians were persecuted by Roman authorities for the exact reason that they refused to demonstrate their loyalty to the state in a particular manner.) ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/56 "2017-09-28T03:06:40Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > How many unarmed, innocent, compliant Americans need to be killed by government officials before it’s too many? How many police officers need to be killed before it’s too many? If for instance, 45% of the officers murdered were disproportionately killed by 13% of the population should NFL players protest that based on race? The protests are made at an event that has nothing to do with the protest. There is no reason to insult the national Anthem at a football game. The fallout from that illogical venture is a fan base that doesn’t feel like paying for the privilege of having their country insulted. What would make more sense is for Kaepernick to sit on a flag pole in front of his own home until the finial is firmly seated and then rotate on it until his sinuses are cleared. He could then sell tickets to it and reap the benefits of it instead of asking his employer to provide the venue for it. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/57 "2017-09-28T03:17:07Z")
This sounds suspiciously like you telling people how they should protest. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/58 "2017-09-28T03:35:15Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > How many police officers need to be killed before it’s too many? So it’s OK for cops to kill innocent people? > [@Magiver](#): > > If for instance, 45% of the officers murdered were disproportionately killed by 13% of the population should NFL players protest that based on race? Oh, my mistake. It’s OK for cops to kill innocent _Black_ people. > [@Magiver](#): > > The protests are made at an event that has nothing to do with the protest. There is no reason to insult the national Anthem at a football game. They’re not insulting the National Anthem. They’re saying that the country is broken, and that they cannot support the policies of governments that literally get away with murder. ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/59 "2017-09-28T03:47:33Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > How many police officers need to be killed before it’s too many?. . . [Officers Killed in 2017](https://www.odmp.org/search/year/2017) Line of Duty Deaths: 97 9/11 related illness: 3 Aircraft accident: 2 Animal related: 1 Assault: 2 Automobile crash: 22 Boating accident: 2 Drowned: 4 Duty related illness: 2 Exposure to toxins: 1 Gunfire: 33 Heart attack: 9 Motorcycle crash: 4 Stabbed: 1 Struck by vehicle: 3 Vehicle pursuit: 5 Vehicular assault: 3 [730 people](https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/national/police-shootings-2017/) have been shot and killed by police in 2017. you do the math ---
**Author:** ![drewder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@drewder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewder)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2017, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435/60 "2017-09-28T04:01:48Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > How many unarmed, innocent, compliant Americans need to be killed by government officials before it’s too many? [It is unclear that police actually are targeting blacks disproportionately](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/18/upshot/police-killings-of-blacks-what-the-data-says.html) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-offensive-to-kneel-during-the-anthem/797435.md?page=4)