# Why is it so damned hard to make a good frozen pizza? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 23, 2006, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869 "2006-04-23T17:30:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/1 "2006-04-23T17:30:36Z")
Some might disagree, but pizza isn’t exactly rocket science. There are good and bad pies depending on your tastes, but I’ve never found a frozen pizza in the supermarket that was even close to the worst fresh pizza. It’s not like the makers of fresh pizza have some secret cabal on how to do it right, so why can’t the food industry get a good pizza on the market? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/2 "2006-04-23T17:37:47Z")
As I understand it, freezing is to cheese what Moscow in the winter was to Napoleon and Hitler. So any frozen pizza starts with such a handicap that it cannot ever fully recover. Or so I’ve heard. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/3 "2006-04-23T17:47:08Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > As I understand it, freezing is to cheese what Moscow in the winter was to Napoleon and Hitler. So any frozen pizza starts with such a handicap that it cannot ever fully recover. > > Or so I’ve heard. I usually add extra fresh cheese to frozen pizzas even though they tell you not to do that. It does make them a little soggier but it’s now covered with gooey melted cheese so how can you go wrong with that? Well, except for eating it while it’s too hot and burning off all the tissue lining in your mouth. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/4 "2006-04-23T17:52:12Z")
Who tells you not to add fresh cheeze? I often do this. However, I was under the impression that the main problem was the base, in that it could only survive freezing intact by being part-baked beforehand, guaranteeing it’ll be cardboard after reheating. I may be wrong about that, though. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/5 "2006-04-23T17:59:04Z")
> [@GorillaMan](#): > > Who tells you not to add fresh cheeze? I often do this. > … THEM! You know, those people who are always telling you not to do things? That’s who! Actually, I’ve seen it on a few cooking instructions. It could just be that adding a lot of extra stuff will change the cooking time. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/6 "2006-04-23T18:03:20Z")
I’ve had some really good frozen pizza–here, in particular, Palermo’s thin crust frozen is quite good. California Pizza Kitchen–if you’re into that sort of thing–can be quite delectable. Even the local Jewel (a Chicago-area supermarket) had a generic brand of frozen pizza that was quite nice. There’s plenty of frozen brands, in my opinion, that beat places like Domino’s, Little Caesar’s, and Papa John’s. That said, all the frozen pizzas I’ve had in Europe sucked (I’m assuming you’re in Europe, based on your location), while most restaurant pizzas have been quite good. One thing I’ve always done to make them taste better is to add a bit of freshly grated cheese, and a sprinkling of thyme and hot pepper flakes. Cook them up in a very, very hot oven. My problem with most frozen pizzas are the instructions ask for a fairly cool oven (I like mine at 225-250 C (approx 450-500F). The cool oven makes the crust all soggy and soft. Yuck. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/7 "2006-04-23T18:11:11Z")
Is pizza a big part of Swedish cuisine? Maybe part of the problem is that it’s alien to the culture so the makers don’t really understand it. I don’t get frozen pizzas topped with anything other than cheese and I usually only eat them when I’m drunk so I don’t spend more than a couple bucks for it and the quality’s about what you’d expect (but that’s OK because, you know, drunk). On those rare instances when I eat them sober I pop for a little bit more expensive one that’s done a little better, and doctor it up with my own toppings. Coincidentally I started a [frozen pizza thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=368515) yesterday. But I put mine in GQ because I just can’t bring myself to think of frozen pizza as cooking. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/8 "2006-04-23T18:11:44Z")
Most homemade pizzas suck, and frozen ones even more so, because our home ovens just don’t get hot enough and heat evenly enough for good pizza. If you have some patio tiles or bricks and an oven with a self-cleaning cylcle, you can approximate a good pizza oven, and even a frozen pizza will be tolerable. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/9 "2006-04-23T18:12:12Z")
Costco and Sam’s Club have some great packaged pizzas that freeze well. Huge and meaty, too. But **pulykamell** makes a good point about temperature. Play around with your oven, then cook at the highest temperature you can get. You’ll really have to watch it, but once you get the adjusted times down, it can make all the difference. ---
**Author:** ![mike1dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@mike1dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mike1dog)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/10 "2006-04-23T18:14:34Z")
There are two frozen pizzas I find okay. One is Stouffers French Bread pizza. The other is Digiornos. Neither is as good as take-out, and they take almost as long to cook as it takes to get a carry-out, but they are cheaper. ---
**Author:** ![Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/11 "2006-04-23T18:18:24Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Even the local Jewel (a Chicago-area supermarket) had a generic brand of frozen pizza that was quite nice. I bet you’re talking about Essencia, right? I think Jewel is owned by the larger supermarket chain Albertson’s (which we have in Florida), and Essencia is their high-end store brand. Their salsas are really good, and they have a few frozen pizzas that have been terrific. There’s a square, thin-crust one I love with barbecue sauce instead of tomato sauce, barbecue chicken, and I think some onions and peppers. Really high-quality for a frozen pizza, especially because it’s the kind of “foo-foo” pizza most restaurants would charge you $8-$13 for. Some of the DiGiorno’s, Freschetta, and California Pizza Kitchen frozen pizzas I’ve had have been very good as well – all better than Little Caesar’s, Pizza Hut, and Domino’s. ---
**Author:** ![Annie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/858c86/32.png) [@Annie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/12 "2006-04-23T18:18:39Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I’ve had some really good frozen pizza–here, in particular, Palermo’s thin crust frozen is quite good… > One thing I’ve always done to make them taste better is to add a bit of freshly grated cheese, and a sprinkling of thyme and hot pepper flakes. Cook them up in a very, very hot oven. My problem with most frozen pizzas are the instructions ask for a fairly cool oven (I like mine at 225-250 C (approx 450-500F). The cool oven makes the crust all soggy and soft. Yuck. I was going to mention Palermo’s as a good one. I get it at Costco. I think the big problem is the dough goes in frozen, and doesn’t get a chance to rise up a bit before hitting the oven. Try to leave it out for an hour or so before shoving into a 500F oven. If you have a pizza stone, put that in before heating the oven and let that heat up for about 20 minutes minimum too. Also, frozen pizzas have too much oversweetened sauce loaded on for my taste. That’s a taste killer too. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/13 "2006-04-23T18:28:01Z")
> [@Otto](#): > > Is pizza a big part of Swedish cuisine? Maybe part of the problem is that it’s alien to the culture so the makers don’t really understand it. I very much doubt there’s a big national Swedish frozen-pizza industry 😉 Most of these kind of things tend to be distributed Europe-wide, so the same pizzas are on the shelves in Sweden, Britain, and Germany, although perhaps not Italy… ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/14 "2006-04-23T18:33:53Z")
Even a fresh pizza cooked and left out for about 30 seconds too long seems to die in the box and rapidly enter a state not unlike rigor mortis. The combination of dough, sauce, cheese, and extras, simply isn’t robust enough to maintain its proper integrity. The separate ingredients must be kept separate until the last possible second. Then they must be combined, cooked immediately, and eaten as close to baking temperature as possible, or the life is sucked out of the pizza by some ravenously ghoulish force of nature. A pizza prepared and frozen is stillborn. It will never grow up into a real pizza, and the carcass can only be animated by subverting the very laws of nature that killed it, creating an undead monster that is flavorless and unholy. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/15 "2006-04-23T18:43:46Z")
> [@GorillaMan](#): > > I very much doubt there’s a big national Swedish frozen-pizza industry 😉 > > Most of these kind of things tend to be distributed Europe-wide, so the same pizzas are on the shelves in Sweden, Britain, and Germany, although perhaps not Italy… Actually, there is. But as you say, it’s all part of Nestlé, or Van Den Bergh or Unilever, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/16 "2006-04-23T18:50:48Z")
I actually rather like frozen pizzas, and in my opinion they’re getting better all the time. When I compare the frozen pizzas of today to the ones of 10-15 years ago, the difference is incredible. While a the best fresh pizza is always better than the best frozen pizza, I’d rather have a delicious DiGiornos or Freschetta pizza than a crappy pizza from Dominos. I think frozen pizzas tend to be a bit more similar to the real Italian thing than the average fresh chain pizza in the US. The frozen pizzas are a bit lighter, with a somewhat thinner, crispier crust compared to the soggy, gloopy stuff you can get from the big chains. I’m guessing that Sweden just doesn’t have the same types of frozen pizzas we have in the US. ---
**Author:** ![myskepticsight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@myskepticsight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/myskepticsight)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/17 "2006-04-23T20:51:30Z")
I agree with the temp thing. I used to work at a pizza joint and our ovens were around 450-475 F. For cracker-thin pizza. Letting the pizza thaw and cooking it hotter should help, because then it’s like you’re cooking a fresh one. But I just get delivery or go out when I want pizza because I am picky and don’t like many kinds of “cheap” pizza (not saying the pizza I eat is expensive, but it’s also not 4-5 bucks for a large). ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/18 "2006-04-23T20:55:05Z")
I’ve never had frozen pizza in the U.S. since I’ve spent most of my time there in Chicago, but I’ve had them in various countries in Europe and they’re basically all the same, the makers trying to say that they’re Italian. Could one reason be that the dough seems to be baked separately? And the topping added on the big pizza assembly line after the crust is made? I improve them with shredded cheese and pepper flakes and they’re ok, for the prize and as emergency food to keep in the freezer. ---
**Author:** ![pinkfreud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pinkfreud/32/17603_2.png) [@pinkfreud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkfreud)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/19 "2006-04-23T20:56:16Z")
My husband likes the frozen pizza from Schwan’s better than my homemade pizza. I put some extra spices and a dab of extra cheese on 'em, but hubby would probably like the Schwan’s pizzas just as much if they were right out of the box. Well, right out of the box and warmed up a little. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2006, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869/20 "2006-04-23T22:10:39Z")
Freschetta is the magic word. I love all of their pizzas. They pile them with extra cheese, and the crust is soft and doughy and chewy. It’s delicious. The key is to bake them for the minimal length of time. If the back says “20 to 25 minutes”, bake it exactly twenty minutes, or maybe even nineteen. The more you cook them, the worst they taste. All other frozen pizzas are, in my opinion, dreadful. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-it-so-damned-hard-to-make-a-good-frozen-pizza/353869.md?page=2)