# Why is Prince considered to be a genius? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 23, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896 "2016-04-23T13:39:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Living_Well_Is_Best_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/281 "2016-04-26T20:44:37Z")
For those who have XM/Sirius, channel 50 is all Prince right now. It’s been a lot of fun listening to songs from his entire career. I only knew the hits. One thing that is amazing to me is nearly all of his songs sound current. Even ones from the early 80s have a quality that doesn’t make them sound outdated. If anyone deserves the genius label, it’s Prince. ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/282 "2016-04-26T20:50:05Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > It looks like Prince was worth over $400 million dollars and he left no will. This is going to get ugly and public. Why? Doesn’t Minnesota have clear rules as to who inherits an intestate estate? [This suggests](http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/intestate-succession-minnesota.html)it’ll all go to his surviving sibling(s). ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/283 "2016-04-26T20:58:28Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > I like Delirious for catchiness from Prince. Good call. Straight out the gate, the bottom line is in your ear, then in your head, then encoded in your DNA. Catchy as fire. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/284 "2016-04-26T21:04:42Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Not the Bible, but one of the books. Careless Whispers, Faith, and Father Figure are required “reading” for any self-proclaimed expert of 80’s music, particularly if they are gonna act like a bright line separates the white pop stars from the black ones. I’m still waiting on an explanation for whether Bowie and Talking Heads were white pop. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/285 "2016-04-26T21:08:11Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Someone posted that on my facebook feed earlier - yep, Comfortably Numb had me going headachy and sick feeling. I don’t know if its the frequency or the rhythm or what, but I can tell its Floyd from a consistent physical reaction. And I’ve had it since junior high when The Wall was big. > > But I’m never going to say it isn’t objectively good music. People I respect love it. It just pretty obviously isn’t my cup of tea. I’m not a Pink Floyd fan, either. I don’t quite get the physical reaction you do, though. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/286 "2016-04-26T22:04:17Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Not even Rio? Once, in 1960, for 20 minutes… ---
**Author:** ![stillownedbysetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@stillownedbysetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stillownedbysetters)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2016, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/287 "2016-04-26T22:52:45Z")
I’ll preface this with saying I wasn’t a particular fan of Prince’s hits. I never owned any of his albums or his singles, but I admired his work all the same. Prince was a scientist and researcher of music. Never content with how things sounded, he was constantly experimenting with incremental changes that would allow the music and to grow and change organically. It wasn’t flashy or spectacular but it constantly grew and evolved. He made his commercially-successful hits to make money. He wrote songs for other artists to make money, but his life’s work, if you want to call it that, was tinkering with sound. I suspect if/when his storehouse of tapes or songs or whatever he has squirreled away in Paisley Park is unearthed and examined, some minds are going to be blown. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/288 "2016-04-27T00:40:39Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > And you are talking from experience? I guess you are now. And now you’ve devolved into the ever-successful “I know you are, but what am I?” style of debating. Since it’s inaccurate (hint: I only described your position. If you want to remain ignorant, that’s your choice); I’ll assume this isn’t going anywhere, and the point has been made. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/289 "2016-04-27T01:13:41Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > If you’re referring to me you should cite and explain. Refer to all your condescending uses of “purple.” They are not evidence of an intent to engage in a sincere conversation. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/290 "2016-04-27T01:15:20Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > It looks like Prince was worth over $400 million dollars and he left no will. This is going to get ugly and public. Why? He has unambiguous next-of-kin in his sister. ETA: **lisiate** , above. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/291 "2016-04-27T01:20:17Z")
I wonder if that’s the sister he sang about in Sister. There’s something full circle about that if so. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/292 "2016-04-27T02:59:01Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > [Ragtime - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ragtime) > > [Jazz - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jazz) > > The Black influence on the music industry was there from the early history of recording even before there were charts and when it was sheet music being sold. Now can you say why I’m “the bad guy”? I don’t think I ever called you “the bad guy”, all I did was ask you to cite your claim that ‘black pop’ (or sepia as you were calling it) had it’s own chart 100 years ago. What a wiki link to ragtime and Jazz has to do with that, I don’t know. Either cite your claim or stop claiming it. Oh, and I googled that quote that you wouldn’t cite, I found it, it’s in an obscure book and literally the only place on the internet that I could find sepia even mentioned as a style of music. No one’s denying that black people have influenced music to a very large degree, that’s hardly what this thread is about. We’re (we’ll I’m) just asking you to show me ‘black pop’ on chart from 1916. I wouldn’t mind seeing Sepia as a genre of music as well. All you’ve done so far is skirt the question. ---
**Author:** ![Smitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Smitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smitty)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/293 "2016-04-27T11:44:19Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Consider this musician as one who is not impressed. Prince? Meh. As a writer (of posts on a message board), I don’t see the big deal about William Shakespeare. I wanted to let this go, I really did. If this would have been just another threadshit that said, “Not my taste”, I could have. But by making a point about being a musician, you are claiming some level of expertise. You are implying your opinion is somehow worthy of extra weight. You are, in a sense, wanting to be considered an “expert witness” So let’s voir dire the witness. Please answer the following, and provide evidence. 1. How many millions of albums have you sold? 2. How many Grammys/Oscars/other industry awards have you won? 3. How many instruments do you play at an expert level? Please provide verifiable links to other universally acknowledged experts on those instruments testifying as to your skill level. 4. What year were you inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame? 5. How many Top 10 hits have you had? 6. How many Top 10 hits have you written for other artists? I think a compare and contrast between your answers and Prince’s answers to these questions will make it obvious which is the “meh” musician. ---
**Author:** ![Implicit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Implicit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Implicit)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/294 "2016-04-27T15:06:26Z")
All this ‘black pop’ discussion is baffling and frustrating and insulting to the man you are discussing. Ffs he didn’t even want to be known by a name or a gender, he obviously transcended racial bullshit. If someone had asked me to describe the man, I wouldn’t have been able to answer, he was just Prince. Until this thread it never occurred to me that there were people who put him in a ‘black musician’ box. On topic, he is in the conversation for GOAT because of all the skills he exhibited over a vast range of disciplines. I think part of the problem people are having is that most geniuses are phenomenal at only one thing and in a weird way excelling at many things somehow waters down Prince’s achievements. If you take away everything but song writing, I’d still have to rank him as a genius for that alone. Since hearing about his death I can’t get _Raspberry Beret_ out of my head. The claim that his music is not catchy is ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/295 "2016-04-27T15:11:53Z")
> [@Implicit](#): > > All this ‘black pop’ discussion is baffling and frustrating and insulting to the man you are discussing. Ffs he didn’t even want to be known by a name or a gender, he obviously transcended racial bullshit. If someone had asked me to describe the man, I wouldn’t have been able to answer, he was just Prince. Until this thread it never occurred to me that there were people who put him in a ‘black musician’ box. > > On topic, he is in the conversation for GOAT because of all the skills he exhibited over a vast range of disciplines. I think part of the problem people are having is that most geniuses are phenomenal at only one thing and in a weird way excelling at many things somehow waters down Prince’s achievements. If you take away everything but song writing, I’d still have to rank him as a genius for that alone. > > Since hearing about his death I can’t get _Raspberry Beret_ out of my head. The claim that his music is not catchy is ridiculous. Great post. Agree 100% As I said somewhere many pages ago, I think if someone had approached Prince and said “I don’t get your music”, based on what I’ve read about him and how he approached music and people, I honestly think he would be cool with that and say to go find some music you do like, and enjoy that. Oh, and my XM Sirius dial has not moved form channel 50 since they made it the all Prince channel. I’m hearing stuff I’ve never heard, and it’s pretty awesome. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/296 "2016-04-27T16:48:32Z")
I went and listened to damn near every song suggested on this thread. Wouldn’t voluntarily queue up any of them again, except, perhaps, Bambi. Might not speak to the genius thing, but I can’t help but notice how many people in the thread, even those supporting the contention that he’s a genius, have said something similar. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/297 "2016-04-27T17:39:19Z")
That people who don’t like him that much are still convinced he’s a genius is pretty telling, yes. Those of us that knew he was a genius, _and_ like him, have been listening to him plenty. ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dread_pirate_jimbo/32/3897_2.png) [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dread_Pirate_Jimbo)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/298 "2016-04-27T17:46:53Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > I went and listened to damn near every song suggested on this thread. Wouldn’t voluntarily queue up any of them again, except, perhaps, Bambi. Might not speak to the genius thing, but I can’t help but notice how many people in the thread, even those supporting the contention that he’s a genius, have said something similar. Like anything artistic in nature, tastes vary. The late Merle Haggard is said to be a genius in country music and I’m happy to concede the point in spite of not “getting” his music and not being able to name a single one of his songs (I recognize the title "Okie From Muskogee only because I’ve seen it several times recently). The fact that Prince offers you nothing musically neither diminishes you nor his genius. Personally, I think it says a great deal about how universally respected Prince was that even people who don’t love his music can see just how talented the guy was. I also personally know people who weren’t into Prince, including my best friend. Prince’s music didn’t have the mass appeal of a Michael Jackson, nor do I think he was aiming for that—he wouldn’t have followed up the Purple Rain album with something as challenging as Around The World In A Day if his sole intention was to sell records to everyone. But, in my opinion, Prince was taking risks musically and pushing the boundaries in ways that most artists wouldn’t. He was an innovator, he danced to the beat of his own drummer (which was frequently himself), and he still managed to find an audience that bought 100 million of his albums. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2016, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/299 "2016-04-27T20:07:03Z")
> [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](#): > > For those who have XM/Sirius, channel 50 is all Prince right now. It’s been a lot of fun listening to songs from his entire career. I only knew the hits. One thing that is amazing to me is nearly all of his songs sound current. Even ones from the early 80s have a quality that doesn’t make them sound outdated. If anyone deserves the genius label, it’s Prince. The line “Prince defied genre” sounds cliche but it really quite true. Prince music isn’t just pop, or rock, or R&B, or electronica. It’s… it’s Prince. I had to laugh at the Wikipedia reference to Prince’s sound being the “Minneapolis sound.” The definition of “Minneapolis sound” is, in fact, Prince, and anyone who tried to copy him. And yeah, his music doesn’t feel dated. Of course truly great music doesn’t. That said, an interesting feature of much of his early work is a combination of synthesizer and extremely proficient conventional instrumentation; “When Doves Cry” is a song that relies on synthesizer and drum machine, but begins with a face-melting guitar solo and uses the guitar heavily in the last half. Similar dual use of both synthesizer and traditional instruments can be found in many of his other 80’s hits; “Little Red Corvette” is another song with heavy use of electronic music but then pierced by awesome guitar work and a lot of solid vocals. The lesser regarded acts from the 80s were often entirely synthesized and, obviously, usually did not have vocals as original or skilled. Prince was also frankly just better at using technology; the drum machine in “When Doves Cry” isn’t as obviously a drum machine as (insert forgettable 80’s hits by the hundreds.) That makes the song age a lot better than one where your ears tell you “oh, listen, fake drums.” ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896/300 "2016-04-28T04:08:15Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > I went and listened to damn near every song suggested on this thread. Wouldn’t voluntarily queue up any of them again, except, perhaps, Bambi. Might not speak to the genius thing, but I can’t help but notice how many people in the thread, even those supporting the contention that he’s a genius, have said something similar. You do realize taste is subjective even if the producer is a rare talent? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-prince-considered-to-be-a-genius/752896.md?page=16)