# Why is rap allowed to be so shamelessly commercial? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 7, 2004, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495 "2004-09-07T16:17:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/1 "2004-09-07T16:17:52Z")
So many hit songs in the rap genre are just catchy commercials (Pass the Courvosier, Do the Rocawear…etc). This would be considered career suicide for a rock band. (imagine, say, U2 writing a song called Pop the Pringles) Sure, you can sell your song to be used in a commercial, but this is usually only done after your song has left the charts and is sure to never be ‘cool’ again (or perhaps there are legions of Bob Seger fans out there that can block out Chevrolet trucks when ‘Like a Rock’ comes on). What is the basis for the double standard? Why does the music world allow one set of stars to be utter shills and one set of stars are beholden to an abstract artistic ideal? ---
**Author:** ![Stringer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Stringer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringer)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/2 "2004-09-07T16:34:35Z")
My completely unsubstantiated theory is that black people are more comfortable with shameless marketing, because it is seen as a legitimate way to increase black wealth. Professional athletes in America (a group dominated by blacks) have been merchandising and marketing like this for years, so perhaps this isn’t seen as disgusting to blacks as it is to whites. Another theory may be that commercial rap isn’t seen as “art” by its producers and consumers, while music produced by U2 and the like is “art.” Of course, both of these are WAGs laced with generalizations. ---
**Author:** ![vibrotronica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@vibrotronica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vibrotronica)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/3 "2004-09-07T16:38:00Z")
The materialism of mainstream rap totally turns me off. If all you have to write your songs about is what kind of car you drive–or what kind of car you WANT to drive–then I have no interest in anything you have to say. There is good rap out there, but you wouldn’t know it by listening to the radio. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/4 "2004-09-07T16:46:52Z")
I wouldn’t say that it’s because blacks are any more or less comfortable with marketing. White rofessional atheletes were advertising for razors and shaving creams long before they even let blacks play in the major leagues. I think part of it is the sheer volume of rap music in the market now. A few years back at an entertainment law seminar I was at, an agent told me that in the last year or so rap had for the first time begun to outsell country music on the charts. This is the first time this has happened since…well, ever. Country music has outsold any other genre of music since music began being recorded and sold in the United States, until now. With that kind of unprecedented attention being focused on rap, it stands to reason that more and more different elements will being trying to capitalize on it. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/5 "2004-09-07T16:53:56Z")
One must ask: Are these product-placement raps in any way funded by the companies they’re advertising? It seems to me that makes a big difference. If they’re not, then this is just the performance equivalent of wearing t-shirts with a chest-sized Tommy Hillfiger logo, or hats with a prominent Nike swoosh. Not that I entirely understand that one, either, but it seems like whatever the reason, it’d be the same. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/6 "2004-09-07T17:15:44Z")
Current, mainstream, rap is all about materialism in the first place. For the past five years or more, ever since Sean Combs “reinvented” the genre, it’s been about the kind of car you drive, the liquor you drink, how many women you’ve slept with, and the size of your … bank account. It only makes sense that with that sort of mentality, that the current crop of rappers would have no problem shilling for various corporations. After all, if you do a commercial for Reebok, you’ll have more money for bling, an extra Bentley, and maybe even another “ho” or two and, thus, more material for your songs. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/7 "2004-09-07T18:59:21Z")
I read an article relatively recently (NYTimes maybe?) about the growing practice of compensated product placement on Rap albums. So no, you’re not imagining things. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/8 "2004-09-07T20:05:00Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > I read an article relatively recently (NYTimes maybe?) about the growing practice of compensated product placement on Rap albums. So no, you’re not imagining things. And if that seems to work at all, it’s only a matter of time before product placements show up in other styles of music. I think there’s something to what **Chronos** said. ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/9 "2004-09-07T20:09:23Z")
> [@Aesiron](#): > > Current, mainstream, rap is all about materialism in the first place. For the past five years or more, ever since Sean Combs “reinvented” the genre, it’s been about the kind of car you drive, the liquor you drink, how many women you’ve slept with, and the size of your … bank account. 😕 > [@Run D.M.C.](#): > > Now the Adidas I possess for one man is rare > myself homeboy got 50 pair > got blue and black cause I like to chill > and yellow and green when it’s time to get ill > got a pair that I wear when I’m playin ball > with the heal inside make me 10 feet tall > [@Beastie Boys](#): > > I had to get a beeper 'cause my phone is tapped > You better keep your mouth shut 'cause I’m fully strapped > I got money in the bank - I can still get high > That’s why your girlfriend thinks that I’m so fly > I’ve got money and juice - twin sisters in my bed > Their father had envy so I shot him in the head Both from the eighties. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/10 "2004-09-07T20:23:03Z")
I didn’t say it was limited only to the current variety, only that it’s so widespread as to be almost ubiquitous in the rap songs of today. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/11 "2004-09-07T20:29:06Z")
Besides, Run D.M.C. and the Beastie Boys have more meaningful things to say. ---
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/12 "2004-09-07T21:06:36Z")
I think that it was different for say Run DMC. Adidas were already in high fashion amongst the hip hop world, so a song like My Adidas is just a boast, which is a hip hop tradition. Did it help Adidas sell thousands of more shoes and track suits that year? Sure did, but I doubt that Run DMC were compensated for their contribution (until recently where they did television shoe commercials, but celebrity endorsements I have less of a problem about). Some of these new songs are #1 on the Billboard Charts (at least in the rap/r&b category) and they’re just…commercials. Commercials for products sometimes not already in mass consumption by the target audience. The newest Petey Pablo song even goes so far to actually say at the end of the song (Now I got to give a shoutout to Seagrams Gin cuz I drink it, and they payin’ me fo it). Shameless indeed. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/13 "2004-09-07T21:09:27Z")
Hey, if there’s room for paid product placement in lyrics, maybe I can get funding to record my death metal epic, “Christ Lies Rotting In The Tomb So Drink Diet Coke”. ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/14 "2004-09-07T21:17:53Z")
Maybe it’s just that it’s a characteristic of the genre itself. People expect to hear bragging in rap, and they don’t in rock. Just like country songs have a standard subject matter. And a rap song about unrequited love would probably have a hard time being accepted by anyone. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/15 "2004-09-07T21:21:15Z")
No; there is no standard subject in rap. THere are, however, a standard short list of rappers whom MTV promotes. It’s all about marketing. The rappers that I listen to–MANY rappers–rarely go there. ---
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/16 "2004-09-07T21:41:59Z")
> [@ultrafilter](#): > > Hey, if there’s room for paid product placement in lyrics, maybe I can get funding to record my death metal epic, “Christ Lies Rotting In The Tomb So Drink Diet Coke”. Hahahahaha… ---
**Author:** ![ZeroGyro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47774/32.png) [@ZeroGyro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZeroGyro)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2004, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/17 "2004-09-07T22:10:31Z")
I think a key point, linked to the bragging that others have mentioned is very frequent in mainstream rap, is that rap is often self-referential, unlike a lot, if not the majority, of rock. A lot of rappers also use, I don’t know if this is the right phrase for the idea I have, stream-of-conciousness, They rap about a greater variety of subjects in one song than your average rock band sings about in one song. Rappers mention all sorts of things out of pop culture and commercial products are included. Another cause may be the fact that a lot of rappers come from poor or working class backgrounds and may value their monetary success to a great degree. They want to flaunt it. Also, gang culture has been very influential to many mainstream rappers, and they may be taking their cues from movies like “Scarface” where wealth and possesions are shown off. I think the OP is wrong-headed in his approach to the question, though. Though some rappers do do commercials, the type of songs he mentions aren’t usually commercial in the way a jingle is. The title is frequently just the hook and the item mentioned in this title isn’t even referenced in the rest of the song. Google the lyrics for some of the songs you’re thinking of. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2004, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/18 "2004-09-08T00:50:49Z")
I’m not sure I even understand what the puzzle is here. Rap music is heavily commercialized because that’s one of the primary themes of rap music. Materialism, especially of the ostentatious variety, and urban style are important to the people making the music, are important to the people buying the music, and so naturally are expressed in the music. What’s the problem? How is this any different from grunge music constantly repeating themes of angst and disillusionment? Or country music constantly repeating themes of redneck patriotism and drunkenness? Or pop music constantly singing about how much they love “baby”? There’s nothing “shameless” about Run-DMC singing about their love for their Adidas shoes that isn’t “shameless” about Evanescence blathering Standard Angsty Teen Love Song Lyrics For Windows XP in “My Immortal,” or Beyonce shouting out the usual I-love-my-baby crap in her various dance tunes, etc. etc. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2004, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/19 "2004-09-08T00:57:21Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I’m not sure I even understand what the puzzle is here. Rap music is heavily commercialized because that’s one of the primary themes of rap music. Materialism, especially of the ostentatious variety, and urban style are important to the people making the music . . . Again (_hello?_–:tap:tap:–_is this thing on?_): this is not true. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2004, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495/20 "2004-09-08T00:59:36Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Again (_hello?_–:tap:tap:–_is this thing on?_): this is not true. Well, if it’s not, then 1. Why is it so many rappers DO rap about this stuff - I realize some don’t, but quite a few do, and todeny it is akin to denying that pop musicians don’t sing love songs because you listen to some who don’t, and 2. Why is it that the consumers of the music eat it up like popcorn? Are you telling me I’m seeing and hearing things? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-rap-allowed-to-be-so-shamelessly-commercial/263495.md?page=2)