# Why is Red Lobster Failing? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 19, 2014, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513 "2014-04-19T22:56:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2014, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/121 "2014-04-21T21:58:55Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > Sure, but I’d argue Fargo (at over 100k) is closer in environment to Des Moines (200k) than Peru, Illinois. Both are basically the “big city” in their immediate area. Fargo is the big city 45 minutes from my sisters. My one sister - who has lived in lovely places all over the country, is well traveled and is a foody, claims there are two good restaurants in Fargo - I haven’t found them yet. I know there are more than two good restaurants in Ames - much less Des Moines. (There is a Thai place in Ames, The Spice, that I really like). ---
**Author:** ![Sarabellum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarabellum/32/3492_2.png) [@Sarabellum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarabellum)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2014, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/122 "2014-04-21T22:09:01Z")
I had lunch there today, oddly enough. Biscuits were good, some reasonable lunch combo specials on the menu. I had bay scallops and crunch-fried fish, which I shared with my 4 year old son, for $10.99. The waitress seemed inexperienced but she tried hard and didn’t do too badly. On the whole, I’d say they seemed understaffed. They’ve certainly experienced some “shrink” in my area the past few years but they’re still kicking. I think the potential for a comeback is still there. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/123 "2014-04-22T01:09:24Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I wonder how much of the chain-bashing in threads like these comes from people who live in big cities. The oft-heard “There are so many better local places” is more true in some locations than in others. I’m right now in a hotel in little Brockville, Ontario, population 30,000, and can\* from my hotel window\* see two restaurants better than a Red Lobster. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/124 "2014-04-22T01:24:31Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > Hell, there’s a sandwich joint in a Chevron Gas station that has the best tomato soup and the best cream of mushroom soup that I have ever tasted, and cheap. Seriously, I live 8 hours away and I still think about it. There is a tiny gas station in St Martin’s Quarter de Orleans near Cul de Sac Bay that has soup daily that is gourmet level. Pig Tail is the best, IMHO. Back on topic, yeah, RL kinda sucks. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/125 "2014-04-22T01:52:40Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Have you ever been to a real Mexican restaurant? Because they have items which Chipotle (which I like) and Taco Bell (which I abhor) don’t carry. The short answer to this is no. Food choices for me have been limited to the fast food/chain options available because diversity isn’t really Indiana’s strong suit, probably better here in Charlotte, but going to “authentic” places like that are a task for me that I don’t feel much to doing. I understand I’m in the minority, but I’m just not much of a foody guy. I don’t even know if you put a RL crab in front of me and a seafood specialty crab in front of me and I would know the difference (not saying it’s impossible but I’ve never known). Same with mexican food. I’ve eaten both Chipotle and Taco Bell and honestly they aren’t THAT much of a difference for me, so I tend to just go to Taco Bell cuz…hey…cheaper. To get back on point, it really could be a change of opinion in America over the last (insert number of) years. Maybe there are less me’s in the world that don’t know the difference and am fine with RL and the like because more people are like you guys and are more sophisticated. ---
**Author:** ![Waymore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Waymore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waymore)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/126 "2014-04-22T03:30:48Z")
Environmental conditions the Cheddar Bay have worsened drastically in recent years. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/127 "2014-04-22T04:37:49Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > [Hijack]How does “NE” mean northeast Indiana? I assumed that **nevadaexile** lived in Nebraska or New England.[/Hijack] Context! He was talking about driving either to Toledo or Indy. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/128 "2014-04-22T04:43:40Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Assuming I figured it out, I’d double-down on it- if it was because they’re the only seafood game in town, I’d try and modernize the menu and bring it more in line with what other places serve- lighter seafood dishes, more varied preparations, and an emphasis on sustainability. The idea would be to make their restaurants vital again in markets that they already have a good beachhead in, and abandon the ones in places that are already well-served by other seafood restaurants. > > They’d have to get used to less profits and growth, but less is better than none. What you say makes sense. Is there a business they can carve out of the whole? And what percentage of locations would be the carve out? It would be an interesting case study… ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/129 "2014-04-22T04:54:10Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Food choices for me have been limited to the fast food/chain options available because diversity isn’t really Indiana’s strong suit… Don’t blame our state! I don’t think it’s any different than any other place. Cities with bigger populations here have more options, small towns have fewer. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/130 "2014-04-22T05:55:10Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > Des Moines has changed a lot food-wise. Yes, the country rubes still come to town to eat at Olive Garden (though Cheesecake Factory finally moved in and stole a lot of their thunder) and to some extent Red Lobster may still be okay in that market. But the Midwest is getting more sophisticated just like anywhere else. When I moved to central Iowa in '95, we were considered pretty cosmopolitan for going to the bagel place every week like we did on the coast. Now, some of the closest restaurants to my suburban home are what would have been considered breathtakingly exotic just a few years ago (Vietnamese, Ecuadorian, sushi). Ethnic food used to be getting cheese enchiladas at a cookie-cutter Mexican place, now everyone’s grandma is happy eating pad thai and you can get pho and banh mi at the mall. Nobody wants to go to Red Lobster for an anniversary when you can’t throw a rock without hitting a cute little bistro or another quirky local place. I resemble that remark! (I’ve always wanted to say that.) We are the type of people who like to eat at Olive Garden. It’s just a slight class above the normal restaurant fare, and gives the feeling of eating fancy without it costing any more than anything else. But that doesn’t mean we’d go to Red Lobster. I think the problem is actually the opposite. Our tastes haven’t really expanded all that much. Sure, we have our Thai restaurants now, but seafood never really took off. It just wasn’t what we wanted. The seafood we like is the kind available everywhere. We don’t need to go to a specialty seafood place when we can get our fried catfish, roasted salmon, or shimp at any restaurant, and can get our lobster at any slightly higher scale restaurant. If we want something else, we can go to a buffet restaurant on Fridays, where they’ll also have crab and grilled cod. Red Lobster just doesn’t feel any more special than the local catfish fry. It doesn’t hit that same slightly higher level that places like Olive Garden, Applebees, or Outhouse Steakhouse hit. It’s just not a good enough place to come into the big city for. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/131 "2014-04-22T06:55:55Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > The short answer to this is no. > > Food choices for me have been limited to the fast food/chain options available because diversity isn’t really Indiana’s strong suit, probably better here in Charlotte, but going to “authentic” places like that are a task for me that I don’t feel much to doing. > > To get back on point, it really could be a change of opinion in America over the last (insert number of) years. Maybe there are less me’s in the world that don’t know the difference and am fine with RL and the like because more people are like you guys and are more sophisticated. I used to go to Charlotte for a conference, and have had some good meals there - none Mexican, but I was stuck downtown near the convention center. I’m sure there are some. Give it a shot. Hell, Charlotte has better bagels than I can get in the Bay Area. But food is a lot different. When I was growing up in the 50s and 60s food choices were a lot more limited, even in New York. I was reading about the 50th anniversary of the NY Worlds Fair in the Times, and a lot of people mentioned that they had lots of kinds of food for the first time there. I had sukiyaki for the first time there - quite exotic. Nothing like Thai or Brazilian or Vietnamese. I did eat Vietnamese in 1962, but that was in the French Congo, not NY. Look up good Mexican restaurants near you, hop in your car, and enjoy yourself. Don’t order the same things you can get in Taco Bell, though they will have them. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4bbf92/32.png) [@Charlie\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/132 "2014-04-22T12:43:26Z")
Bad food, poorly priced, bad drinks, over priced, bad menus, poorly done, Bad service and they don’t care. Any more reasons you need? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/133 "2014-04-22T13:04:37Z")
> [@Charlie\_Wayne](#): > > Bad food, poorly priced, bad drinks, over priced, bad menus, poorly done, Bad service and they don’t care. > > Any more reasons you need? All they need are some food related deaths, like Chi-Chis had with hepatitis. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/134 "2014-04-22T13:22:38Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Look up good Mexican restaurants near you, hop in your car, and enjoy yourself. Don’t order the same things you can get in Taco Bell, though they will have them. I kind of alluded to it above, but this is part of the problem with me and my lack of elite food tastes. I don’t really have the gumption to go to yelp, find a place, get in my car, drive there (by myself no less…maybe in a month when future-mrs-cups comes) and try somewhere. I would rather just go to the places I know that are close to me. Not saying I’m right in my thinking (in fact, I’m probably more wrong) but if I feel this way, how much of 'Merica does too? ---
**Author:** ![johnspartan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a183cd/32.png) [@johnspartan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnspartan)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/135 "2014-04-22T13:46:31Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Don’t order the same things you can get in Taco Bell, though they will have them. Well… Paquito’s near here has 100 tequilas and some great handrolled flautas, but is suspiciously short on AM Crunchwraps or Cheesy Gordita Crunches 😉 That’s not to speak to or against the merit of running for the Border… just that their “Mexican Pizza is neither Mexican nor Pizza. Discuss.” ---
**Author:** ![Uncle\_Jocko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uncle_jocko/32/2932_2.png) [@Uncle\_Jocko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncle_Jocko)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/136 "2014-04-22T14:30:42Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > Even this is going to be tough. Do you really think people in Fargo don’t expect fresh seafood? Think again. The foodie revolution didn’t overlook the Midwest. I’m in Des Moines, which is about as white bread as it gets, and nobody I know eats at Red Lobster (except with kids, who seem to like it). Even if you won’t try the local seafood restaurants (notably, The Waterfront in mid-range cost and Splash which is pricier), you’d go to Joe’s Crab Shack if you want a “reliable” chain experience. Same prices, more options (with actual spices), better taste. Well, la-di-da, Des Moines and all your fancypants eateries. I live in Cedar Rapids - second largest city in Iowa, close to 150,000 in the metro area - and Red Lobster is just about the only seafood option in these parts. (I know Des Moinesians look down their noses at eastern Iowa, but hey … somewhat sophisticated people live here, too!) We do have lots of new, good, local restaurants opening up, and the food scene’s future is bright in CR. But there just aren’t any places that really try to do seafood. (Well, maybe Daniel Arthurs, but that’s about it, and it has no parking and isn’t really a family place). Red Lobster is somewhat high priced for the value of the food you get, but I can’t call it _bad_ food. As mentioned above, the biscuits and the coconut shrimp are both very, very tasty. Red Lobster does still fill a niche outside large metro areas, where no one is stepping up to fly in seafood and go all out (not to mention, I doubt the prices would be much different, although I agree the quality would be better). All you folks mentioning Bonefish Grill, or Whole Foods, or Trader Joes … we don’t have any of those in eastern Iowa. They simply don’t exist as options. A couple of other questions from the thread: whoever said it didn’t make economic sense to use the coupons and just pay full price … what the heck? Isn’t ten bucks off two entrees still, you know, ten bucks off? Why would it make more sense to leave the coupon at home and pay the extra ten bucks? I don’t get your reasoning. Also, **Magiver** … where in the heck can you get a good steak dinner for $10? And can you get me in there? You’re describing a price point for something like Bonanza or Ponderosa (do those still exist? Our local ones closed years ago), but let me tell you - that’s not a good steak ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/137 "2014-04-22T14:48:47Z")
I’ve only been there once or twice. They are expensive and most of my friends/family don’t like seafood beyond fish or shrimp. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4bbf92/32.png) [@Charlie\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/138 "2014-04-22T14:57:17Z")
> [@Uncle\_Jocko](#): > > Well, la-di-da, Des Moines and all your fancypants eateries. I live in Cedar Rapids - second largest city in Iowa, close to 150,000 in the metro area - and Red Lobster is just about the only seafood option in these parts. > \ I would guess there are some very nasty jokes that could be made about someone living in Iowa and hankering after seafood. But I won’t do that because IMO, it is really very poor taste to take such enormously cheap shots. I took a look at a Yahoo map just to see how many rivers and lakes there are in Iowa and I couldn’t see any. It would seem (on the surface) like Iowa is completely missing any sources of water or seafood. So, bottom line is that if someone loves seafood, maybe Iowa is not a good place to live. But I can understand there are many good reasons why someone might choose to live there regardless. After all, you could always use your annual vacation to go visit one of the coasts and try some of the best seafood restaurants there. It’s just my personal preference, but I love the seafood available in Chinese restaurants. I’m not talking about cheap buffets or cheap chain stores. I’m talking about some very high class expensive Chinese restaurants that are worth every penny they charge. My favorite dish (in case you ever get the chance to try it) is called “Salt Baked Crab Legs with Chilies”. As I understand, there are many kinds of seafood that you can substitute into the title of the dish “Salt Baked X with Chilies” where the X represents the name of a seafood. I used to eat that dish in a Chinese restaurant and it was so delicious, so delectable, it would just melt in your mouth. It was one of the very best restaurant dishes I have ever tasted in all my life. I kid you not. Whenever I tasted that dish, I could close my eyes and I imagined that I was in Heaven. Well, now I forgot where I was going with this post. But that’s OK. The important thing was that I wanted to tell you the name of that dish in case you ever visit a Chinese food restaurant and find anything with a similar name on the menu. Believe it or not, I am planning a vacation to Las Vegas and San Francisco just so that I might be able to check a few restaurants in each city to see if I can find that dish in either city. Many of the Las Vegas Buffets have a good selection of sea food and so if you are ever in Las Vegas, it’s worth checking out. As well, the Chinatown in San Francisco has some truly fabulous restaurants. They may cost perhaps double what cheaper restaurants cost. But, IMO, the food is worth any price at all. I hope that you might make it to some high quality restaurant and find such a dish and try it and that you will enjoy it as much as I did. Good Luck! ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/139 "2014-04-22T14:58:40Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > or Outhouse Steakhouse I don’t think that chain has made it to my part of the world. I must say, I am intrigued! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Doyle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doyle/32/439_2.png) [@Doyle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doyle)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2014, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513/140 "2014-04-22T15:42:26Z")
Bottom line: way overpriced for frozen seafood. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-red-lobster-failing/686513.md?page=8)