# Why is so much political debate in the US seemingly based on pure BS? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 2, 2010, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415 "2010-01-02T17:39:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/21 "2010-01-02T19:24:33Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > Having lived in Montreal during the separation crisis of the 1970s, I would say that Canada can be extremely polarized, but on very different issues. that’s why I tried to limit this by saying “current political issues”. Comparing anglo-franco tensions in Canada to the current political issues in the united states is a bit off and skews the analysis. a better analogy, imo, would be comparing anglo-franco tensions to white-black tensions in this country - they’re both pervasive and germane to each nation’s culture and politics, but they are more undercurrents, not out-and-out active polarizations. ---
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/22 "2010-01-02T19:24:47Z")
> [@salinqmind](#): > > Because the losers in the USA! USA! know they’re losers. They blat out lies and untruths louder and louder to drown out that knowledge. They are all sheep, wandering fearfully about, looking for a leader who will pump up their righteous self-esteem by proclaiming just how dangerous the world is, how they are all going to the slaughterhouse, how the shepherd is not their friend, that they are doomed, and unless they rise up on their back legs and make a lot of noise, that’s the way it’s going to be. Not having any ideas of their own, they listen to soothing lies and BS to make themselves feel as one: us against them. [Off topic] It’s odd how many people like to refer to Americans as “sheep” - even in a thread about how raucous American political discourse is. Whatever bad things you may say about the system in this country, Americans are _not_ “sheep” - we have, in fact, one of the more hotly debated, analyzed, passionate political scenes in the developed world (that I’ve seen). Doesn’t do much good in terms of national unity, it inevitably brings up a lot of BS, and it _may_ not be the best way to get things done, depending on your point of view. But in the US, you _will_ have your political beliefs challenged, like it or not. “Sheep” my ass. I’ve written before on these boards about the experience of moving to the UK in early 2005, months after the American presidential election, and around the time Tony Blair was re-elected prime minister. The difference was _stunning_ - in the US, everyone was following the election, politics was on every tongue, and every point was hotly debated. In Britain, by contrast, you could have heard a pin drop for all the apathy and quiet acceptance of the status quo. I heard more about the American election from British friends, coworkers, and news commentators than I did about their own election. Crazy. [/Off topic] ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/23 "2010-01-02T19:32:12Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > [Off topic] > > It’s odd how many people like to refer to Americans as “sheep” - even in a thread about how raucous American political discourse is. Whatever bad things you may say about the system in this country, Americans are _not_ “sheep” - we have, in fact, one of the more hotly debated, analyzed, passionate political scenes in the developed world (that I’ve seen). Doesn’t do much good in terms of national unity, it inevitably brings up a lot of BS, and it _may_ not be the best way to get things done, depending on your point of view. But in the US, you _will_ have your political beliefs challenged, like it or not. “Sheep” my ass. > > I’ve written before on these boards about the experience of moving to the UK in early 2005, months after the American presidential election, and around the time Tony Blair was re-elected prime minister. The difference was _stunning_ - in the US, everyone was following the election, politics was on every tongue, and every point was hotly debated. In Britain, by contrast, you could have heard a pin drop for all the apathy and quiet acceptance of the status quo. I heard more about the American election from British friends, coworkers, and news commentators than I did about their own election. Crazy. > > [/Off topic] I think you are conflating rancor with learned analysis, frankly. Yes, Americans are probably the best at rabble rousing and being “passionate” about politics. But in terms of an average person having a substantive grasp on the actual policies being debated? no fucking way. I also think the parliamentary system leads itself to more low-key political discourse - you’re only voting for your MP, after all. Then, there’s typical British stoicism which makes the comparison difficult. You’re kidding yourself if you think Americans are at the fore front of learned debate in re politics - sit down in a working-class coffee shop in Italy, Greece, etc. and you will see “real” political debate. None of this “well, \*I \*didn’t \*see \*the birth certificate” malarkey that passes for political discourse. (i would also point out that a command of the substance of the debate would probably lead to less shouting, more quiet argument and self-analysis, which could also explain your british experience) ---
**Author:** ![zoog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7ea924/32.png) [@zoog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoog)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/24 "2010-01-02T19:33:58Z")
> [@sleeping](#): > > Well, for one thing, a major news source for Americans is 24-hour news networks, which often prefer sound bites to in-depth reporting. Obviously, this makes the task of those who come up with lies and distortions much easier. The irony here of course, is that these networks have 24 hours a day to fill with programming, so you’d think that they’d be able to do better in-depth pieces. Of course, if they did, their ratings would likely suffer. > [@](#): > > Also, unlike the UK, we don’t have a publicly-funded news source. Although some claim that for-profit news sources will provide more reliable information because they aren’t tied to the government, the reality is that there is considerable deference to the government and self-censorship. > > Finally, the lack of a publicly-funded news source and regulation of the media, allows corporate interests to dominate national discourse. We do have PBS for shows like Newshour and Frontline. But again, it’s not like they’re getting big ratings numbers. I sometimes think that we’re just ignorant by choice. ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/25 "2010-01-02T19:40:22Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > There is only one side of the political spectrum who will skew and distort the terms of the debate with out and out lies and material misstatements. > > Why do they do it? Because it’s extremely effective if it works. And it does work, sadly. > > Why does it work? Oh gee. That’s another thread. Are you contending that Democrats haven’t lied and made material misstatements in the healthcare reform debate? You may want to study a little more closely the tricks and gimmicks they’ve installed into paying for their plans, then the numbers they’ve presented as representing its cost, and their assertions that their plans will reduce deficits. The answer to the OP is because this country has gotten so hyper-partisan, people care more about their side defeating the other side than they do about things like “the truth.” Nowhere is this more evident than on the Internet. Partisanship has been around forever. I think the hyper-partisanship kicked in with Democrats’ outrage over the Clinton impeachment (an example of “the truth” not being particularly important to some – the guy either perjured himself in a court proceeding or he did not); fuel was added with the 2000 election controversy, and it just went full, spittle-flying rage over the eight years of Bush’s tenure and controversial actions such as the two wars, response to 9/11, etc. ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/26 "2010-01-02T19:40:52Z")
> [@zoog](#): > > We do have PBS for shows like Newshour and Frontline. But again, it’s not like they’re getting big ratings numbers. Those are funded with government money, donations from individuals, and corporate contributions. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/27 "2010-01-02T19:41:01Z")
> [@zoog](#): > > I sometimes think that we’re just ignorant by choice. I think the size of our society and economy makes accessing and immersing yourself with “conforming analysis” feasible, is what does it, frankly. You can purposely and successfully choose to never expose yourself to contrary political opinions in this society. I think, again because of the size of the economy and society, this is harder to do in smaller democracies. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/28 "2010-01-02T19:43:42Z")
> [@Milossarian](#): > > Are you contending that Democrats haven’t lied and made material misstatements in the healthcare reform debate? yes, actually. can you give me something along the lines of “death panels” that democrats have propagated and embraced as a viable political strategy? no, i’m not claiming that no democrat has ever, never made a hyberbolic statement in regards to health care reform. but something as a matter of a national talking point? (and yes, I am genuinely interested. I don’t think I have heard of one, but I am not discounting my own bias and mental filtering here, either) ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/29 "2010-01-02T19:45:57Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > [Off topic] > > It’s odd how many people like to refer to Americans as “sheep” - even in a thread about how raucous American political discourse is. Whatever bad things you may say about the system in this country, Americans are _not_ “sheep” - we have, in fact, one of the more hotly debated, analyzed, passionate political scenes in the developed world (that I’ve seen). Doesn’t do much good in terms of national unity, it inevitably brings up a lot of BS, and it _may_ not be the best way to get things done, depending on your point of view. But in the US, you _will_ have your political beliefs challenged, like it or not. “Sheep” my ass. > [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > You’re kidding yourself if you think Americans are at the fore front of learned debate in re politics - sit down in a working-class coffee shop in Italy, Greece, etc. and you will see “real” political debate. None of this “well, \*I \*didn’t \*see \*the birth certificate” malarkey that passes for political discourse. > (i would also point out that a command of the substance of the debate would probably lead to less shouting, more quiet argument and self-analysis, which could also explain your british experience) **Rodgers01** , in addition to seconding **Rumor\_Watkins** on this, I’d like to point that the range of permissible opinions in the U.S. is quite narrow, and generally becomes more so as the news source of choice becomes more mainstream. I’ve never heard of British people decrying others’ views as “anti-British.” Yet, in the U.S., labeling something as “anti-American” is an oft-used and fairly effective argument. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/30 "2010-01-02T19:49:35Z")
> [@Milossarian](#): > > You may want to study a little more closely the tricks and gimmicks they’ve installed into paying for their plans, then the numbers they’ve presented as representing its cost, and their assertions that their plans will reduce deficits. you seem to think that “death panel” is the moral equivalent of fudging _estimates_ about future costs and benefits. I don’t think the two are in the same league of “political tricks played”, and i don’t think anyone with a fair opinion would think so either. the equivalent of “death panel” would be “UHC will bring untold prosperity and utopia for all” or something along those lines. ---
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/31 "2010-01-02T20:10:28Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > I think you are conflating rancor with learned analysis, frankly. Yes, Americans are probably the best at rabble rousing and being “passionate” about politics. But in terms of an average person having a substantive grasp on the actual policies being debated? no fucking way. > > I also think the parliamentary system leads itself to more low-key political discourse - you’re only voting for your MP, after all. Then, there’s typical British stoicism which makes the comparison difficult. > > You’re kidding yourself if you think Americans are at the fore front of learned debate in re politics - sit down in a working-class coffee shop in Italy, Greece, etc. and you will see “real” political debate. None of this “well, \*I \*didn’t \*see \*the birth certificate” malarkey that passes for political discourse. > (i would also point out that a command of the substance of the debate would probably lead to less shouting, more quiet argument and self-analysis, which could also explain your british experience) You’re probably partly correct in re. rancor vs. analysis, though I think you’re still selling Americans way short in that regard - most American discourse goes way beyond questions of Obama’s birth certificate. In re. the UK, I’ve been in countless social situations over there and have not seen anything that indicates quiet argument or a keen mastery of facts so much as a lot of disinterest and apathy - though maybe the social code is such that people are just unwilling to talk about politics in public while they bone up in private. I haven’t sat in too many coffee shops in Greece, but I have in Germany, Austria, the Netherlands, and a few other countries in mainland Europe, and have found a stronger interest in politics and an eagerness to discuss things, but a striking uniformity in the political beliefs espoused. In comparable settings in the US I’ve typically found a much greater range of beliefs brought to the table and a greater willingness to debate them (even if it too often devolves into shouting past one another). ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/32 "2010-01-02T20:15:05Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Because the “one side” - the Right - is wrong. Not just in disagreement, but flat out wrong. Factually incorrect on all sorts of issues, incompetent, immoral, nasty and more than a little crazy. Their side of the debate is based on “pure BS” because that’s pretty much all they have to offer. And they don’t value truth, even among themselves much less towards their enemies. > > If they DID start speaking truth, they’d have to admit that their basic positions are incorrect, incoherent, inconsistent, or so nasty that no one but true believers and fools would ever vote for them. Self-admitted greedy, incompetent, sadistic lunatics aren’t likely to get many votes or much respect; so they outright lie because the truth is unacceptable. Are you truly so blindly partisan that you can’t see how laughable that statement is? In your twisted version of reality, everyone to the right of John Lennon is the moral equivalent of Hitler. It’s ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/33 "2010-01-02T20:31:45Z")
> [@sleeping](#): > > **Rodgers01** , in addition to seconding **Rumor\_Watkins** on this, I’d like to point that the range of permissible opinions in the U.S. is quite narrow, and generally becomes more so as the news source of choice becomes more mainstream. I’ve never heard of British people decrying others’ views as “anti-British.” Yet, in the U.S., labeling something as “anti-American” is an oft-used and fairly effective argument. Thanks, but I don’t see this as true at all. Yes labeling something as “anti-American” is (somewhat) oft-used, but I don’t see that it’s been “fairly effective” - the opposition was certainly not squelched when some people in Bush’s administration tried the line; arguably, it was bolstered. Beyond that, it’s simply not true that the “range of permissible opinions in the U.S. is quite narrow” - among the relatives I saw over Thanksgiving and Christmas, for example, I can count neocons, “blue dog democrats”, socialists, “Massachusetts liberals”, libertarians, a quasi-paleocon, union workers, etc. I’ve heard and debated any number of political beliefs with people across the country, from college dorms to factory floors. A lot of this gets filtered out and stampeded by the two-party system, but on the ground level, there’s a _ton_ of political diversity in the US. ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/34 "2010-01-02T20:35:52Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > Beyond that, it’s simply not true that the “range of permissible opinions in the U.S. is quite narrow” - among the relatives I saw over Thanksgiving and Christmas, for example, I can count neocons, “blue dog democrats”, socialists, “Massachusetts liberals”, libertarians, a quasi-paleocon, union workers, etc. I’ve heard and debated any number of political beliefs with people across the country, from college dorms to factory floors. **A lot of this gets filtered out and stampeded by the two-party system, but on the ground level, there’s a _ton_ of political diversity in the US**. (Emphasis mine.) This is the point. Political diversity exists in many places, but if only a few opinions are permitted on the air, how representative is the democracy? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/35 "2010-01-02T20:35:58Z")
1. No publicly funded news 2. Anti-intellectualism 3. The internet The UK, for example, has the BBC. The BBC gets paid no matter what they do, so they have no particular financial reason to care whether the populace finds their reports popular. In the US, there is only privately funded news, and any news source which sounds all that informed is going to be avoided by anti-intellectualists–which is most of the market. And of course there tends to be a link between sounding informed and being informed. Back when there was money in news, the newspapers had enough money to waste on doing research anyways, but with the rise of the internet, they’ve had to cut back and fire everyone who actually went out and looked stuff up. With no mass media to overlook them, then, politicians have been fairly free to go gung-ho with whatever they want to spout. ---
**Author:** ![kevlaw](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kevlaw/32/2281_2.png) [@kevlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevlaw)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/36 "2010-01-02T20:36:51Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > In comparable settings in the US I’ve typically found a much greater range of beliefs brought to the table and a greater willingness to debate them (even if it too often devolves into shouting past one another). There are two things going on here: There is a variant of ‘all chinese people look the same’. You are more acutely aware of the fine distinctions around your norm than of those in a different culture. There is also Sturgeons Law - 90% of everything is crap. In your own domain you are better at separating wheat from chaff, sheep from goats, worthwhile stuff from crap. In an unfamiliar domain, you only see the crap. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/37 "2010-01-02T20:36:59Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > I’ve written before on these boards about the experience of moving to the UK in early 2005, months after the American presidential election, and around the time Tony Blair was re-elected prime minister. The difference was _stunning_ - in the US, everyone was following the election, politics was on every tongue, and every point was hotly debated. In Britain, by contrast, you could have heard a pin drop for all the apathy and quiet acceptance of the status quo. I heard more about the American election from British friends, coworkers, and news commentators than I did about their own election. Crazy. Your elections are, quite simply, a bigger deal. The campaigns are highly funded and last months. Ours are much more low-key. In addition, you’re right: there _is_ a problem with voter apathy over here. I’m not sure what the answer to that is, but I believe that the _issues_ are less polarized, so the debate is much quieter. You guys from what I can tell have a small number of REALLY hot issues which get massive attention. I don’t know why, but the same issue don’t usually map over here. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/38 "2010-01-02T20:44:46Z")
> [@Milossarian](#): > > Are you contending that Democrats haven’t lied and made material misstatements in the healthcare reform debate? > > You may want to study a little more closely the tricks and gimmicks they’ve installed into paying for their plans, then the numbers they’ve presented as representing its cost, and their assertions that their plans will reduce deficits. The assertion about deficits came from the Congressional Budget Office, not the Democrats. Estimates are estimates. Sometimes they come in low, sometimes high. All sides take the side of the range that supports their position - this hardly counts as a lie or misstatement. At least they made an effort to pay for it, unlike the Republican Medicare drug plan. Please tell us any statement that approaches “death panels” or “socialism” in untruthiness. Then we can talk. ---
**Author:** ![kevlaw](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kevlaw/32/2281_2.png) [@kevlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevlaw)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/39 "2010-01-02T20:47:04Z")
> [@Candyman74](#): > > The tabloids are famous for it! Imagine if _The Sun_ had the influence of _The Nine O’Clock News_ and you’ll understand why so much political debate in the US is pure BS. In the UK, Murdoch managed to pollute discourse at the low end with _The Sun_ but never had quite the same success with _The Times_ or _Sky News_. In the US, _Fox News_ is a major player. [QUOTE=The Sun] [It’s The Sun Wot Won It!](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_The_Sun_Wot_Won_It) [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2010, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415/40 "2010-01-02T20:49:42Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > Static, conservative political ideologies typically cater to the current power elite. It only makes sense that there are extremely low levels of popular appeal for these policies, which mandates the use of deception to obtain political power in a democracy. As has been mentioned before, the more heterogeneous the electorate is, the more divergent the power elite will be from the mean voter, which requires more dishonesty. I think this is a lot of it. Quite frankly, if expressed honestly Republican policies screw most of the population financially. To cover this up, you ignore that fact that Joe the Plumber will do better today under Obama than McCain, and highlight that if his fantasies come true and he gets rich he’d do better under McCain. Would the average person get better, cheaper, healthcare under UHC? Sure, but cover it up by yelling socialism. The second reason is that when Republicans had power they drove the country right into the dumpster, and that takes lots of lies (it’s all the fault of the poor people) to cover up. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-so-much-political-debate-in-the-us-seemingly-based-on-pure-bs/523415.md?page=3)