# Why is sport in the USA connected with colleges? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 23, 2014, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754 "2014-04-23T08:13:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/81 "2014-04-24T15:07:30Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > When I was growing in Southwest Ohio the [Cincinnati Bengals (National Football League) truly sucked wind](http://www.bengals.com/team/history.html) (still do) and pretty nobody in the area cared about the Cleveland Browns because they were too far away (and rivals). But Cincinnati had a powerhouse football team in [Cincinnati Moeller High School](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moeller_High_School) and the[Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten College)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio_State_Buckeyes_football#Results_by_year) to fall back on during those lean years. > > The professional teams in the state of Ohio have never been true powerhouse teams yet people do support them and hope every year that this will be the one. But the Ohio State Buckeye college team is always a contender for a national title (although they often disappoint) and everyone loves to follow a winner. > > ``` > What people from Europe may fail to grasp is the affect of great amount of distance there is in places like the Midwest and Texas between towns and how sometime the local team is the only one you get to see on a regular basis, so it becomes a focal point of local pride. Sure people can go to the city and see a pro game, but when the team isn't winning most people will not bother and just follow them on TV. > > ``` > > That said, I’d say that a many people don’t care about sports in general other than to comment on it like the weather. But the ones who do follow sports are very vocal about their support and interest in “the game”. Whether it be on the national or local level. Its the same here in Kansas city. Unless the KC Chiefs are having a banner year they have to compete with KU, MU, and Nebraska for football fans. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/82 "2014-04-24T16:09:30Z")
Important to understand: collegiate football and collegiate basketball were popular spectator sports years BEFORE there were any professional teams or leagues. Princeton and Rutgers played the first college football game in 1869. The NFL didn’t exist until 1920. College basketball began in 1891, while the NBA wasn’t established until 1947. Professional football and basketball teams were created to capitalize on the immense popularity of collegiate sports! ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Wiggler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/red_wiggler/32/13190_2.png) [@Red\_Wiggler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Wiggler)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/83 "2014-04-24T17:34:52Z")
It appears that our schools began their athletic traditions about the same time as athletic clubs were forming in England and that here in the U.S. the schools just beat the clubs to the punch. They both seem to fill the same basic function within a community. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/84 "2014-04-24T17:46:51Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Athletic scholarships are prevalent among most sports. They permit people a way that couldn’t economically attend university to do so by using their athletic abilities to pay for their tuition. A very small % of college athletes make it to the professional ranks. Most get their degrees and have careers other than professional sports. Most sports, or most sports which pull in thousands of fans? There are many smaller sports and teams in colleges which have neither highly paid coaches or scholarships. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/85 "2014-04-24T17:51:06Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > People have mentioned this before but again, I just don’t “get” being interested in a high school as an adult (outside of a philanthrophic interest in promoting education) that you do not work at and your children are not attending. Two factors. Lack of competing professional or college sports teams, as mentioned, and a large number of high school alumni still living in the area and so still attached to the school. ---
**Author:** ![racepug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@racepug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racepug)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/86 "2014-04-24T18:02:55Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I’ve seen people become loyal to a high school when its the only one in town and its a town pride thing. Its big in Texas where some high schools can have over 3000 students and have attendance at football games as high as some colleges. Hence “Friday Night Lights”. I’ve been to Texas only a couple of times in my life (and never for very long) but I’ve heard that during football season entire towns (as long as they’re not _TOO_ big, I’m guessing) shut down on Friday nights because EVERYone is at the high school football game. Now THAT is dedication! ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/87 "2014-04-24T18:58:07Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > The professional teams in the state of Ohio have never been true powerhouse teams Not entirely true, though you need to go back quite a ways. The Cleveland Browns absolutely dominated the AAFC (a short-lived rival to the NFL) in the late 1940s. They were then one of the AAFC teams which was brought into the NFL in 1950, at which point, they went out and won the NFL title in their first year in the league. From 1950 through 1965, the Browns went to the NFL Championship game nine times, and won four titles. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/88 "2014-04-24T19:35:46Z")
> [@racepug](#): > > Hence “Friday Night Lights”. I’ve been to Texas only a couple of times in my life (and never for very long) but I’ve heard that during football season entire towns (as long as they’re not _TOO_ big, I’m guessing) shut down on Friday nights because EVERYone is at the high school football game. Now THAT is dedication! As you say, this is very much the case in small towns of Texas. Face it- there isn’t that much else to do on a Friday night in many rural Texas towns! Here in Austin, there are some excellent high school football teams (Westlake has won or contended for the state title several times), but they don’t draw huge crowds because kids have a lot more entertainment options. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/89 "2014-04-24T19:51:41Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Two factors. Lack of competing professional or college sports teams, as mentioned, and a large number of high school alumni still living in the area and so still attached to the school. Don’t forget that in small-town America, you may not just be rooting for your local HS football team, but the kid that mows your lawn every week (starting quarterback), the neighbor’s twin boys (left and right defensive tackles), your pastor’s son, your cousin’s daughter (cheerleader)… It’s about the community and the folks you know in it. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/90 "2014-04-24T20:14:24Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Not entirely true, though you need to go back quite a ways. > > The Cleveland Browns absolutely dominated the AAFC (a short-lived rival to the NFL) in the late 1940s. They were then one of the AAFC teams which was brought into the NFL in 1950, at which point, they went out and won the NFL title in their first year in the league. From 1950 through 1965, the Browns went to the NFL Championship game nine times, and won four titles. OMG, a Browns fan. I thought you guys were extinct! ---
**Author:** ![racepug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@racepug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racepug)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/91 "2014-04-24T20:29:23Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Not entirely true, though you need to go back quite a ways. > > The Cleveland Browns absolutely dominated the AAFC (a short-lived rival to the NFL) in the late 1940s. They were then one of the AAFC teams which was brought into the NFL in 1950, at which point, they went out and won the NFL title in their first year in the league. From 1950 through 1965, the Browns went to the NFL Championship game nine times, and won four titles. Well, to be fair, _since_ that time the Browns have come within one win of the Super Bowl a number of times (1968, 1969, 1986, 1987, and 1989) but you’re right - for the most part the Browns’ greatest success can be measured in terms of being DECADES ago, not just years. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2014, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/92 "2014-04-24T22:44:43Z")
If anybody is really interested in seeing what small town dedication is to their high school teams, you should watch the movie “Hoosiers”. It’s a fictionalized account of a real high school team that won the Indiana state basketball title for all comers from an extremely small school in the early 1950s. The dedication of the townspeople to their team is pretty realistic. ---
**Author:** ![dzeiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@dzeiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzeiger)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/93 "2014-04-25T02:17:41Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > I don’t know a lot about how football is set up in England, but I do would imagine it’s less about one of the lower-level team members having any shot of getting to the Premier League as it is about it being a local community event, supported by people who know the players because they work with them, live next door to them, etc. Not quite the same thing as supporting a high school football team, IMHO. Why would supporting the guy that lives next door to me be all that different from supporting the kid down the street? Just in my walks around my neighborhood I easily see a half-dozen or more signs in yards announcing that their kid is a member of some supportable/attendable activity–a sports team, a cheerleader, band member, whatever. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/94 "2014-04-25T14:52:32Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Most sports, or most sports which pull in thousands of fans? There are many smaller sports and teams in colleges which have neither highly paid coaches or scholarships. The total number of available scholarships per year outside of football and mens basketball is 119,000. Football has 30,000 scholarships available and Men’s basketball has 28,000 scholarships. Many of the scholarships in smaller sports are not full scholarships but are divied up amoung 3 or 4 people. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/95 "2014-04-25T16:37:07Z")
To the more general question of “How did college football become a big deal in the first place,” I’ve heard some historians say that the end of the Civil War was a big part of the reason. A lot of America’s elites believed that the Civil War had been a great character building exercise for the young men who served in it, and worried that young college men who wouldn’t have to go to war would become “soft” and unmanly as a result. Football was seen in many circles as a perfect substitute for war, and a way to build tough, manly men. According to this theory, old, antiquated football cheers like “Sis Boom Bah” were originally intended to replicate the sounds of a battlefield. Either that or the sound of an exploding sheep. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2014, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/96 "2014-04-25T17:13:08Z")
> [@sunstone](#): > > As a dissenting voice, I want to say that Stanford is a top notch university in the USA, nearly always placing in the top 10 in terms of academics/research…and it is often in the top tier of ratings for football and basketball. As far as I know, even though there are sports scholarships, all students must first pass muster on high school academics, SAT scores and activities or unusual contributions in their high school years. They are a hot bed of high achieving graduates, who not only contribute to the school financially, but are often avid sports fans for Stanford. (Even the large number of “nerds” in the alumni) So sports can be found in all levels of university academic institutions in the USA. > > While my two sons didn’t play sports, they are both fans of the Stanford football teams. > > For our non US members, Stanford is a large highly rated private university located in the Bay Area of California. It pains me to agree with a Stanford fan (Go Bears!) but this is precisely true. It’s a false dichotomy, proposed earlier in this thread, that there is some sort of trade-off between academic excellence and college sports. Stanford was an excellent school when its football team sucked. It’s an excellent school now that it’s football team is good. It would be an excellent school if it cancelled inter-collegiate sports altogether. And the above is true for Berkeley (aka Cal), University of Texas, Michigan, Wisconsin, North Carolina, UCLA, USC… And in general: Exapno Mapcase has covered this ground succinctly and accurately. So to answer the OP: just read his responses. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/97 "2014-04-26T12:45:17Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > And the above is true for Berkeley (aka Cal), University of Texas, Michigan, Wisconsin, North Carolina, UCLA, USC… Are these schools where the athletes actually are students? That’s why Stanford was mentioned. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/98 "2014-04-26T13:50:34Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > Are these schools where the athletes actually are students? That’s why Stanford was mentioned. Yes. Real schools with real student athletes. Even Michigan which I was born to despise. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/99 "2014-04-26T14:16:19Z")
[This opinion piece](http://deadspin.com/the-origins-of-amateurism-or-why-college-sports-are-s-1566714902) addresses the ongoing mess in collegiate athletics concerning amateurism (which I agree is totally messed up), but it also includes a history that addresses the OP’s question. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754/100 "2014-04-26T15:08:52Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Yes. Real schools with real student athletes. Real schools with \*\*\*some \*\*\*real student athletes. Let’s not pretend that all those schools aren’t bending the rules at times. Perhaps often. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-sport-in-the-usa-connected-with-colleges/686754.md?page=6)