# Why is Star Wars 2 receving raves from Europe, but not from U.S. critics? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 10, 2002, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381 "2002-05-10T22:27:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/1 "2002-05-10T22:27:44Z")
It’s like it is a French art film. European reviewers seem to be raving(or at least heavily praising) Attack of the Clones, while U.S. reviewers are coming down hard on it. I have read qute a few reviews form Europe that call it “one of the best in the series”. It seems amazing that a film like this would divide Europe and U.S. critics. Ebert even gave it two stars, after giving Phantom Menace FOUR STARS!!!. Very odd. Any explanation? ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/2 "2002-05-10T22:44:41Z")
First, are there any links in the house? Second, film reviewers typically explain their reasoning in their reviews. Is this not the case with the reviews you’re seeing? FWIW, all the advance press I’ve seen (no actual reviews, however) has been very positive. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/3 "2002-05-10T22:47:33Z")
Yep, it is indeed getting [positive reviews](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=638&ncid=762&e=1&u=/nm/20020509/en_nm/leisure_starwars_dc_1) in America. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/4 "2002-05-10T23:11:41Z")
Okay, perhaps I should have done a bit more research before posting. I thought others would have noticed this as well. Ahem, let me try to find some good links. Jump to the story entitled “Clones Watch” here. If that link changes, go to the imdb news for May 10, 2002. [http://us.imdb.com/StudioBrief/#5](http://us.imdb.com/StudioBrief/#5) Here is Eberts less than kind review. [http://www.suntimes.com/output/ebert1/cst-ftr-ebert10.html](http://www.suntimes.com/output/ebert1/cst-ftr-ebert10.html) Here is his review for Phantom Menace. It was 3 1/2 stars, not four. [http://www.suntimes.com/ebert/ebert\_reviews/1999/05/051701.html](http://www.suntimes.com/ebert/ebert_reviews/1999/05/051701.html) Here is the New York Times review. > **[FILM FESTIVAL REVIEW; Kicking Up Cosmic Dust (Published 2002)](https://www.nytimes.com/2002/05/10/movies/film-festival-review-kicking-up-cosmic-dust.html)** > > Early and late, in a starship chase sequence and in a light-saber duel between Yoda and the nefarious Count Dooku (Chirstopher Lee), some of the old "Star Wars" magic returns. But otherwise, the mixture of grandeur and whimsy that made the first... Gosh, I swear there are more, but I can’t find the full reviews. I saw a mention of this phenomenon on the news as well, so I know I’m not the only one noticing it. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/5 "2002-05-10T23:12:24Z")
I’m not posting the NY Times review link because you have to register, but that critic hates the film. ---
**Author:** ![Manach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Manach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manach)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/6 "2002-05-10T23:14:04Z")
The BBC gave a summary of British print reviews and the majority were positve - to - very positive in their reviews. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2002, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/7 "2002-05-10T23:18:54Z")
Richard Corliss of _Time_ and Todd McCarthy at _Variety_ both gave it sound, positive reviews. And all the geeksite reviews I’ve seen all basically say “this is everything Phantom Menace wasn’t.” ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2002, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/8 "2002-05-11T00:23:28Z")
The IMDB said that the british reviewers had mostly bad things to say about the film except for the fx. Of course if there is a more review-proof film than SW:ATOC I’d like to know. ---
**Author:** ![PlanMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/2bfe46/32.png) [@PlanMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlanMan)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2002, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/9 "2002-05-11T00:44:29Z")
At least for the French critics (?), 2 words: Jerry Lewis For some bizarre reason, the French are supposed to _love_ Jerry Lewis movies, thus their movie taste buds are malfunctioning. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2002, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/10 "2002-05-11T03:30:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by PlanMan \* > \*\*At least for the French critics (?), 2 words: Jerry Lewis > > For some bizarre reason, the French are supposed to _love_ Jerry Lewis movies, thus their movie taste buds are malfunctioning. \*\* [Cecil](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a991001.html) on French affection for Jerry Lewis. I think the “French art film” analogy might be on the money. American critics might be looking more for sheer entertainment value, while European critics might be looking for innovation and new techniques (which the new Star Wars movies apparently have). Since I care only about plot and character, and couldn’t tell CGI from a hand-puppet, things that are really meaningful to some critics mean nothing to me. ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2002, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/11 "2002-05-11T14:11:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BobT \* > \*\*I’m not posting the NY Times review link because you have to register, but that critic hates the film. \*\* Fan site [TheForce.net](http://www.theforce.net) published a link today to the NY Times’ review, by Vincent Canby, of “The Empire Strikes Back.” It was, interestingly, [less than complimentary](http://www.nytimes.com/library/film/061580empire.html). I say “interestingly” both because “Empire” is widely considered the best of the series and because Canby gave an extremely positive review to “Star Wars.” Just goes to show the depth of subjectivity that can arise in film criticism. ---
**Author:** ![Jet\_Black](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecc23a/32.png) [@Jet\_Black](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jet_Black)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2002, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/12 "2002-05-11T21:35:46Z")
Well, I’ve actually seen the film (today, at a sneek preview). I liked it much more than Episode I. I think it’s starting to play on it’s own franchise a bit too much. But that’s okay. That’s called “fan service”. And Lucas knows his fans are lining up around the block, not the critics. The best in the series? Uhm, I’m not buying that. However, it works enough, and you’d pretty much need an axe to grind to not like it. I think this is one of those cases where if you’re not into the franchise then you won’t like it. I haven’t read all the reviews, but from what I’ve seen, many critics are asking a lot from Star Wars nowadays. I think this is why Lucas is saying he wants to return to a more “camp” …fun…version of the series. Nuff said. ---
**Author:** ![Asylum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/53a042/32.png) [@Asylum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asylum)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2002, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/13 "2002-05-12T06:16:10Z")
In all fairness the fellow from the NYT who did the reviews of A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back is not the same person who gave an unfavorable review to Attack of the Clones. I don’t think that **Pldennison** was implying that he was, I just wanted to make that clear. Having read said review of AotC I must say that it seems like the reviewer had more than a smattering of cynicism in his system. He claims the movie is two and a half hour ad for action figures and seemingly not much more. He does everything from comparing the movie to Dawson’s Creek to The Mummy franchise, and the comparisons are never complimentary. I get the feeling that he went in with the intent to dislike it and I wonder if part of his dislike stems from his knowing that the movie will turn a handsome profit regardless of his critique, or even the public’s consensus on how good or not the movie is (it happened with Phantom Menace). He even goes so far as to state: > [@](#): > > Like weary Brezhnev-era Muscovites, the American moviegoing public will line up out of habit and compulsion, ruefully hoping that this episode will at least be a little better than the last one, and perhaps inwardly suspecting that the whole elephantine system is rotten. Perhaps I am wrong and when I see the movie my opinions will be very similar to Mr. Scott’s (the reviewer) but I suspect that he disliked the movie, but not to the degree that he claims in his review: I think he’s just venting his frustration. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2002, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/14 "2002-05-12T12:43:05Z")
OK, we have hit on a pet peeve of mine. sorry for the Hijack here. French Cinema is equal, if not better to Hollywood. The French movie industry certainly know their stuff, so please dont give me the “Jerry Lewis” blowoff. Don’t accept the “American=Best” analogy in cinema that rears its head waay to often. ---
**Author:** ![bigbird120](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@bigbird120](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bigbird120)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/15 "2002-05-13T00:07:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by TwistofFate \* > \*\*OK, we have hit on a pet peeve of mine. sorry for the Hijack here. > > French Cinema is equal, if not better to Hollywood. > > The French movie industry certainly know their stuff, so please dont give me the “Jerry Lewis” blowoff. > > Don’t accept the “American=Best” analogy in cinema that rears its head waay to often. \*\* Seriously. I’m an american and we’re stupid. We let Titanic win best picture, for the love of christ! No wonder the rest of the world thinks we’re a bunch of cocky idiots, we are!!! ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/16 "2002-05-13T00:29:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bigbird120 \* > \*\*Seriously. I’m an american and we’re stupid. We let Titanic win best picture, for the love of christ! No wonder the rest of the world thinks we’re a bunch of cocky idiots, we are!!! \*\* Er . . . what do you mean “let?” And what do you mean “we?” Are you a voting member of AMPAS or something? I’m not. Also, according to the IMdB, during all of 1998, around 21 million people saw _Titanic_ in France. It was the top-grossing movie in France that year, making three times as much as the #2 film. So I guess maybe the French liked it, huh? I don’t know that I’d say that French cinema is qualitatively different from American cinema, anyway. I mean, for every _Baise-moi_ there’s another crappy _Asterix_ movie with Gerard Depardieu. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/17 "2002-05-13T02:45:07Z")
Are you trying to imply that _Basie-moi_ was somehow worth the film on which it was printed? I don’t know how Episode II is tracking in Europe, but it is only doing so/so here among the critics. [Rotten Tomatoes](http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/StarWarsEpisodeIIAttackoftheClones-1112314/) tracks this stuff and is showing a 43% positive reviews from the top critics (though only seven are listed right now) and only 60% positive from the generally easier “all critics” category. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/18 "2002-05-13T02:54:40Z")
> [@](#): > > Are you trying to imply that _Baise-moi_ was somehow worth the film on which it was printed? Maybe not, but it’s got a hell of a title. Re the Rotten Tomatoes tracking, **Obfus** , is 60% substantially different form most films? I don’t visit the site as much as I’d like, so I have no clue. ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/19 "2002-05-13T13:35:31Z")
Any movie that includes a scene of a woman vomiting in the lap of a man she’s fellating is worth at least the price of a rental. Anyway, I just hate the characterization of European cinema generally, and French cinema specifically, as a bunch of existentialist, beret-wearing, clove-cigarette-smoking, _auteur_-theory-spouting fans of Godard, Cocteau and Tati. French cinema produces as many dogs as any other countries film industry; and the French sure love American movies. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381/20 "2002-05-13T20:16:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by andros \* > \*\* > > Maybe not, but it’s got a hell of a title. > > Re the Rotten Tomatoes tracking, **Obfus** , is 60% substantially different form most films? I don’t visit the site as much as I’d like, so I have no clue. \*\* I don’t know averages or anything, but my feeling that 60% is kind of low is based on the fact that there is so much hype and expectation placed on this movie. But 60% is the minimum for a “Fresh” rating. It is also my experience, that the overal critics are softer on mainstream fair (where frequently the overall rating will be lower than the restricted rating for art films) than than the “cream of the crop” critics. Overall ratings for other recent “event movies”: Spider-Man: 84% positive Harry Potter: 79% positive Lord of the Rings: 96% positive The Scorpion King: 39% positive Monsters, Inc: 94% positive Shrek: 87% positive Pearl Harbor: 27% positive The Mummy Returns: 47% positive Planet of the Apes: 45% positive Rush Hour 2: 48% positive Episode 1: 58% positive (so the critical reaction so far is about the same as for the last movie). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-star-wars-2-receving-raves-from-europe-but-not-from-u-s-critics/108381.md?page=2)