# Why is support of Israel such a huge requirement for American politicians? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 9, 2009, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604 "2009-01-09T22:53:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/81 "2009-01-12T11:11:07Z")
_The Israeli Propaganda:_ **Opposition to Israel is a continuation of the Nazis.** > [@brazil84](#): > > It seems to me that this is a matter of opinion, not a matter of fact. The Nazis wanted Europe to be free of Jews and a similar sentiment can be witnessed with many of Israel’s enemies. On the other hand, I’m sure you could think of many differences between Hamas and the Nazis. So claiming that Hamas is “at its core, a continuation of the Nazis” is not any more false than claiming that chocolate covered ants are a delicious treat. Taken as a whole your objections are not those of a mind open to rational persuasion. The salient fact is extermination. The variant on this propaganda is that the M-E opposition to Israel has a second holocaust in mind. This claim is made, false and widely believed. See this article for the effects of this mindset within Israel itself: [http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/opinion/la-oe-burg16-2008nov16,0,1029195.story](http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/opinion/la-oe-burg16-2008nov16,0,1029195.story) > [@](#): > > What does the primacy of the Shoah mean in terms of our politics and policy? For one thing, it becomes virtually impossible to find a conversation carried out with reason, patience, self-control or restraint. Take Iran as an example. With regard to Iran, as with any other security matter that has potentially existential consequences, we have no thoughts at all – only instincts and trauma-driven impulses. Who has ever heard of alternative approaches to the Iranian issue, of strategic arguments underlying the passionate emotions, the old fears and violent rhetoric? > > Few people in Israel are willing to try to perceive reality through a different set of conceptual lenses other than those of extermination and defensive isolation This sentiment is ruthlessly exploited, in the US as well. **Israel has a military commitment to the US.** > [@brazil84](#): > > Again, this is a matter of opinon. Like claiming that Subaru makes the best car on the market. It is opinion in the same way that it is my opinion Israel has no defense treaty obligations to the US and IDF forces have never served as troops allied to the US. \*\*Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East. \*\* > [@brazil84](#): > > I would imagine that most informed Americans are vaguely aware that there have been elections, for example, in Iraq. You did not ask that the propaganda had reached informed Americans. The request was for claims that were “widely believed”. It is. Further, there has never been a time when Israel was the only democracy in the M-E. For your interest, the variant that has evolved is “only country in the middle east that is democratic and similar in values to the US” ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/82 "2009-01-12T11:12:21Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > For anyone who doubts the fanaticism of Israel’s enemies and their determination to wipe Israel from the map I recommend [Palestinian Media Watch](http://www.pmw.org.il/), a daily-updated translation of articles, school texts, cartoons, etc from the Palestinian and Arab press. Julius Streicher himself would have been proud of this stuff, which reflects attitudes that permeate the whole of Arab society. Another agency of Israeli propaganda. Typically claiming to oversight “the whole of Arab society”. My, it’s fortunate I’m posting. The thread was becoming rather choleric. Now we’re calm. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/83 "2009-01-12T11:19:56Z")
> [@furt](#): > > …No, I do not agree. I also do not agree that US-Israeli relations can be called lockstep agreement. It would be a moment’s work to find a dozen issues on which we have disagreed… On reflection I must concede this is true. Today several news sources publicise that the US refused Israeli requests to overfly Iraq for an attack by them on Iran. “Would those airliners have been hijacked if we were not perceived by the arab world to be blindly supporting Israel?” > [@furt](#): > > Yes, they would have. Islamic radicals have stated on many occasions what their goals and ambitions are, and why they oppose America. The Palestian issue is among those reasons, but it is far from the only one. Osama Bin Laden’s primary grieviences were the first gulf war, the enforcement of UN sanctions on Iraq, and the presence of US troops in Saudi Arabia. On the other hand I don’t believe this to be a correct balance of the evidence. In a number of places it is plain that support for Israel is key reason for the hijacks. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/84 "2009-01-12T16:59:40Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > On the other hand I don’t believe this to be a correct balance of the evidence. In a number of places it is plain that support for Israel is key reason for the hijacks. No question Osama hates Israel and wants it gone…completely gone. But the support the US shows to Israel is by no means Osama’s prime motivator. More to him it is just another piece of the pie on why the US and Israel must be destroyed. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/85 "2009-01-12T17:48:12Z")
Even if it was provable that 9/11 was solely because of US support of Israel… so? Does that really mean we should stop supporting Israel? Should that dynamic carry through for other things, or just Israel? If there are terrorist attacks, is the correct course of action _really_ to figure out what the terrorists want, and give it to them as quickly as possible? If there were more abortion clinic bombings in the US, should we criminalize abortion immediately, for example? Or is the argument simply that we should reward terrorists as long as their grudge is against Israel? ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/86 "2009-01-12T18:28:43Z")
You ever wonder what Hamas has for a lobbying organization? Think it’s paid for by the Saudi wahabis or by Iran? I think the argument is that Israel is so horrible that whatever terrorists do, it’s okay, because they’re weaker than Israel. And whatever Israel does to them, it’s wrong, because they’re hiding behind innocent people, and also, they’re stronger than the terrorists. What should be dones is that Israel should arrest the terrorists by walking into the Palestinian territories and hauling them out. Me, I think a three state solution maybe has potential. Also, I think that if the Palestianians were to actually work their asses off, in ten years, they’d be indepedent. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/87 "2009-01-12T18:43:09Z")
Five congress men voted no and something like 27 made a no vote in regards to a backing resolution. 800 Israeli protesters in Israel have been arrested in anti war demonstrations. There have been anti Israel demonstrations in many countries. Israel does not have the backing that it appears here and in our news. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/88 "2009-01-12T22:03:47Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > Another agency of Israeli propaganda. … This is a total aside, but how did [“propaganda”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda) become a dirty word? People seem to use it as a synonym for [“disinformation”](http://www.answers.com/topic/disinformation) - which it is not. For many subjects it is difficult (to say the least) to find anyone who does not have some particular POV, or at least appears to, to someone else’s POV. Providing truthful information as a means of influencing opinions is indeed propaganda. Any debate is propaganda. Any political campaign or political discourse in the public sphere involves propaganda. Dismissing something as “propaganda” is a non sequitur. Show that it is false or provide what you believe is missing and therefore why a site is misleading. But dismissing a source because they have an identified POV seems silly. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2009, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/89 "2009-01-12T23:25:01Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > The salient fact is extermination. No it is not. Hitler wanted to get rid of all the Jews and in the early days of the Third Reich, Jewish emmigration was permitted and encouraged. Leter he switched to extermination, but the point is that he wanted his Lebensraum to be Judenrein. In any event, the “exterminate the Jews” sentiment is strong among certain of Israel’s enemies. For example, there is a video on the internet of a pro-Hamas demonstration where you can clearly hear the crowd chanting as follows: “Hamas! Hamas! Joden aan het gas!” > [@](#): > > [ **Israel has a military commitment to the US.** It is opinion in the same way that it is my opinion Israel has no defense treaty obligations to the US and IDF forces have never served as troops allied to the US. That’s one measure, and [here is another:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel-United_States_military_relations) > [@](#): > > The U.S. and Israel also cooperate jointly on a number of technology development programs, notably the Arrow missile system and the Tactical High Energy Laser (also known as Nautilus).[3] The two countries carry out regular exercises together, including carrying out biennial exercises codenamed JUNIPER COBRA intended to test interoperability between the two militaries. In addition, the Israeli port of Haifa is the main port of call in the eastern Mediterranean for the United States Sixth Fleet, and Israel provides other logistical and maintenance support for U.S. forces in the region.[2] > [@](#): > > \*\*Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East. \*\* You did not ask that the propaganda had reached informed Americans. I would imagine that uninformed Americans would not have a strong opinion on the subject. > [@](#): > > The request was for claims that were “widely believed”. It is. Could I have a cite and link for that? > [@](#): > > Further, there has never been a time when Israel was the only democracy in the M-E. For your interest, the variant that has evolved is “only country in the middle east that is democratic and similar in values to the US” Again, that’s a matter of opinion. Some people might claim that Dubai is “similar in values” to the US. Others would not. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2009, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/90 "2009-01-13T15:59:23Z")
> [@DanBlather](#): > > I’m not sure if it’s that Americans like Israel as much as the fact that they dislike the Palestinians’ tactics. For people of my generation the Munich Olympics was the first exposure to the PLA and it’s been pretty much downhill since then. > > Suicide bombings are pretty much antithetical to everything Americans believe in. Add to that the fact that Israelis and Jews haven’t targeted the US for terrorist attacks and I don’t think it’s a big surprise that most Americans come down on the side of Israel. > > As for politicians, they know which way the wind blows. Apart from the Munich atrocity there were also the airline hijacks and murders of airline passengers,the machine gunning of a check in line of people at an airport plus a non terrorist action from our M/E friends in OPEC ,the oil embargo of Holland. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/91 "2009-01-14T12:33:32Z")
**Israeli Propaganda** > [@brazil84](#): > > No it is not. Hitler wanted to get rid of all the Jews and in the early days of the Third Reich, Jewish emmigration was permitted and encouraged. Leter he switched to extermination, but the point is that he wanted his Lebensraum to be Judenrein. > > In any event, the “exterminate the Jews” sentiment is strong among certain of Israel’s enemies. For example, there is a video on the internet of a pro-Hamas demonstration where you can clearly hear the crowd chanting as follows: > > “Hamas! Hamas! Joden aan het gas!” > … > That’s one measure, and [here is another:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel-United_States_military_relations) This is quibbling with the edges of meaning in the statements: **Opposition to Israel is a continuation of the Nazis.** & **Israel has a military commitment to the US.** A twisted reading of those statements can make parts of them look less untruthful. Yet there is no rational way they can be twisted enough to be satisfactory true statements. The plain facts reject it. \*\*Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East. \*\* > [@brazil84](#): > > I would imagine that uninformed Americans would not have a strong opinion on the subject. > > Could I have a cite and link for that?.. Again, you asked for propaganda that was and I quote "widely believed."Don’t you know the rule that states of mind are not susceptible to cites? If you want to argue that North America is not affected by Israeli propaganda because people disbelieve the Israelis, feel free. “Only democracy in the Middle East” turns out 30,000 hits on google, so a lot of people are saying it. Perhaps they and everyone who hears them knows it has never been true? BTW its falsity is not opinion, it is fact. Be upfront with your argument: “Americans are not affected by the Israeli propaganda because they always knew it was lies.” ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/92 "2009-01-14T12:36:35Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > This is a total aside, but how did [“propaganda”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda) become a dirty word? People seem to use it as a synonym for [“disinformation”](http://www.answers.com/topic/disinformation) - which it is not. > > For many subjects it is difficult (to say the least) to find anyone who does not have some particular POV, or at least appears to, to someone else’s POV. > > Providing truthful information as a means of influencing opinions is indeed propaganda. Any debate is propaganda. Any political campaign or political discourse in the public sphere involves propaganda. > > Dismissing something as “propaganda” is a non sequitur. Show that it is false or provide what you believe is missing and therefore why a site is misleading. But dismissing a source because they have an identified POV seems silly. The first 2 paragraphs of your link explain its pejorative air: > [@](#): > > Propaganda is the dissemination of information aimed at influencing the opinions or behaviors of large numbers of people. As opposed to impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience. Propaganda often presents facts selectively (thus lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or gives loaded messages in order to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the cognitive narrative of the subject in the target audience to further a political agenda. > > Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/93 "2009-01-14T12:50:27Z")
Ah. It is presenting one side of a debate that may have another side to be presented. I see now why that is enough for anything so tarred to be dismissed as not worthy of hearing. In reality, if you disagree with the goals of the presenter it is propaganda; if you agree it is speaking truth to power or something similar. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/94 "2009-01-14T13:06:12Z")
Oh, I have no doubt there can be and is propaganda that is benign. I think we can say it crosses the line when it ceases to use information that is true. In the current discussion the propaganda is not benign. **brazil84** specifically asked for some that was not true. Supplied. In fact, I did not originally state that the propaganda of the Israelis was all untrue, merely that it was pervasive. Secondly, _Palestinian Media Watch_. Do you think, if asked that Palestinians would agree it is a “Self Portrait of Palestinian Society”? That’s what its banner claims. It is not fit to be read any further than that. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/95 "2009-01-14T13:36:36Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > … > In fact, I did not originally state that the propaganda of the Israelis was all untrue, merely that it was pervasive… On reflection this is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/96 "2009-01-14T14:23:29Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > Secondly, _Palestinian Media Watch_. Do you think, if asked that Palestinians would agree it is a “Self Portrait of Palestinian Society”? That’s what its banner claims. It is not fit to be read any further than that. How unfair! They provide official PA/Hamas sermons and television broadcasts, showing what they think in their own words, and that makes your distortions that much harder. Can’t they just be good Jews and not fight back? Of course you’d say that it’s not fit to be read any further than the accurate masthead. If someone did read it further, they’d see your argument is full of shit when it claims that, for instance, the current militant factions of Palestinian society aren’t, say, [dedicated to a religious holy war against the Jews](http://www.pmw.org.il/specrep-37.html), or [dedicated to the genocide of the Jews](http://pmw.org.il/tv%20part6.html), or [teaching children to kill and commit to suicide operations against Israelis](http://pmw.org.il/tv%20part3.html), or well, you get the point. Your deceptive apologia for the modern ideological descendants of the Nazis becomes much more difficult if the facts are known. _Of course_ you’d advise people to avoid the facts. I believe your traditional dodge is, at that point, to claim that the Palestinians are stupid and infantile and unable to differentiate between “Israel, Judaism and Jews”. Ya know, like Hamas explicitly does in its charter showing that when they talk about Jews, they mean (gasp!)… Jews. Or I suppose you could brag about having me on your ignore filter some more, but at least your apologia doesn’t have much of a chance at tricking honest observers if they look at the facts themselves. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/97 "2009-01-14T16:54:25Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > **Opposition to Israel is a continuation of the Nazis.** That’s not what you said before, you said this: > [@](#): > > Palestinian / Hamas / Arab opposition to Israel is, at its core, a continuation of the Nazis. There’s a big difference between the two, since there is clearly strong sentiment among many Hamas supporters to, at a minimum, evict Jewish people from the area of Israel. On the other hand, generic opposition to Israel doesn’t necessarily imply a desire to make the area Judenrein. I have my own rules of debate, and one is that you cannot weasel, i.e. pretend that you said something different from what you actually said. If you are abandoning your earlier statement, please just say so. Your choice. > [@](#): > > **Israel has a military commitment to the US.** Again you are weaseling. Here is what you said before: > [@](#): > > Israel has a military alliance / commitment to / is the strongest military ally of the US in the region. Being an “ally” doesn’t necessarily mean having a military commitment, which I understand to be something in the nature of, for example, a mutual defense treaty. Kindly stop weaseling and we can continue the discussion. Your choice. > [@](#): > > Again, you asked for propaganda that was and I quote "widely believed."Don’t you know the rule that states of mind are not susceptible to cites? That’s not necessarily true, since states of mind could be shown by polls, or even maybe a few mainstream newspaper articles. > [@](#): > > If you want to argue that North America is not affected by Israeli propaganda because people disbelieve the Israelis, feel free. I am not making such an argument. Another rule I have is that you can’t debate by means of attacking strawmen. Please do not state or imply that my argument is that North America is unaffected by Israeli propoganda. Obviously, as with the parties to any other controversial issue, Israel (and its supporters) advocate for Israel’s position and that advocacy can be expected to influence some peoples’ opinions. Here is the snippet from your original statement which started this exchange: > [@](#): > > North America has been irredeemably saturated with Israeli propaganda. While none of it is true Are you abandoning this position? ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2009, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/98 "2009-01-14T17:01:08Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > Secondly, _Palestinian Media Watch_. Do you think, if asked that Palestinians would agree it is a “Self Portrait of Palestinian Society”? Probably they wouldn’t. I imagine that it paints a rather ugly picture. So what? ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2009, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/99 "2009-01-15T10:48:26Z")
**North America has been irredeemably saturated with Israeli propaganda. While none of it is true …** > [@brazil84](#): > > Are you abandoning this position? As **DSeid** rightly points out I have neglected to mention the half-truths and misdirections falling within the set of Israeli propaganda in North America. Apart from that omission the statement stands. Your statements take you no further than previously, attempting to find truth in the claims put about by contorting the meaning of words beyond recognition. There is no need to add any more than I stated previously. Without anything new this discussion is completed. As to my summaries of the earlier statements, those are fair and made in good faith. The original forms needed attention to their presentation and were re-presented as proper sentences. **Secondly, Palestinian Media Watch. Do you think, if asked that Palestinians would agree it is a “Self Portrait of Palestinian Society”?** > [@brazil84](#): > > Probably they wouldn’t. I imagine that it paints a rather ugly picture. So what? It is no “self portrait” and knowingly so. The site is aggressive in its goals and its disdain for truthfulness. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2009, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604/100 "2009-01-15T11:09:40Z")
Sevastopol, if I may have some examples? You’re making a lovely assertion. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-support-of-israel-such-a-huge-requirement-for-american-politicians/480604.md?page=6)