# Why is Tesla's market cap so high? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 13, 2024, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594 "2024-12-13T06:09:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/101 "2024-12-18T20:58:37Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Agility Robotics > [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > > > Perhaps because Boston Dynamics has never been a publicly traded company? > > Well yeah, there’s that too. I’d lost track of their current ownership, anyhow. Still, one could ask why they were bought for $1.1B rather than $110B. They have some neat tech but nothing that actually _scales_. And nothing remotely interesting for a consumer. Agility Robotics has a lot of manufacturing uses and is worth less than 1 billion. Lots of companies are working on household bipedal robotics, not just Tesla. > **[21 top companies in the vanguard of the rise of humanoid robots – Ross Dawson](https://rossdawson.com/futurist/companies-creating-future/top-companies-rise-humanoid-robots/)** ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/102 "2024-12-18T22:18:12Z")
The vast majority of those companies will fail. They have no manufacturing experience and no ability to train AI at scale. Tesla has 50k NVIDIA GPUs in their datacenter for AI training, and they plan on growing further. Which other robotics companies have anything close to that? It’s pretty clear now that in the AI space, it’s basically all about your training set and the amount of compute you can throw at the problem. If you don’t have a $X billion datacenter, you aren’t playing with the big boys. Tesla is also likely to have “premium” access to xAI, which has an even larger datacenter. And then when it comes to manufacturing, Tesla has demonstrated that they’re very good at driving down costs and building millions of units per year. They can also build new factories quickly and have plenty of cash on hand (\>$30B) for capital expenditures. Robots aren’t quite the same as EVs, but they share many components, so they’re probably better positioned than just about any other company. ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/103 "2024-12-18T23:01:19Z")
I disagree with Elon’s politics but it seems he sure knows manufacturing and scaling it to the next level like no one else. Nvidia ceo Jensen Huang on Elon… > **['Superhuman': Nvidia CEO Jensen Huang on Elon Musk’s xAI building...](https://www.businesstoday.in/technology/news/story/superhuman-nvidia-ceo-jensen-huang-on-elon-musks-xai-building-supercluster-of-100000-gpus-in-just-19-days-453583-2024-11-13)** > > Elon Musk’s rapid execution on the xAI supercluster redefines what’s possible in high-speed AI infrastructure setup. Building a supercomputer in 19 days instead of 2-3 years and taking it online is an unheard of achievement and Huang says no one else other than Elon can do it. ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/104 "2024-12-18T23:10:51Z")
Coming to Tesla Energy this…YoY growth exceeding 50% and exceedingly profitable with gross margin close to 25%…yes 25 % ! > **[Tesla's energy business is growing — and it could be company's next big...](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/teslas-energy-business-is-growing--and-it-could-be-companys-next-big-earnings-driver-100040150.html)** > > One area of outsized growth for Tesla beyond its car business could be energy. ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/105 "2024-12-18T23:20:58Z")
Not directly related to Tesla but which could have huge implications for autonomous driving (Full fsd and robotaxis) and humanoid robots, Elon Musk is building one of the best infrastructures for AI at a pace others can only envy…(I wish he were on democrat party side politically, sad and fearful he went over to Trump lock, stock and barrell). > **[Elon Musk builds xAI, world's largest AI computing system in just 16 months,...](https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international/us/elon-musk-builds-xai-worlds-largest-ai-computing-system-in-just-16-months-sparks-anxiety-among-rivals-like-openai-heres-how-he-did-it/articleshow/115938199.cms?from=mdr)** > > Elon Musks xAI has redefined the AI landscape, achieving a staggering $50 billion valuation in just 16 months—a feat that took industry leader OpenAI over nine years. If this pace of development continues he will overtake OpenAI (Chatgpt) by 2026 ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/106 "2024-12-18T23:24:27Z")
I was about to make a post that its genuinely sad for the world that Musk seems to be evil. Thats not hyperbole either. When you read how he treats his spouses, his children, his employees. Plus him siding with Trump. A world where he is in charge of ASI is scary. ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2024, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/107 "2024-12-18T23:34:32Z")
It’s so sad and scary to see a technologically very very competent man and a manufacturing genius go MAGA. I wish Biden could go back in time and erase that un-invite for the EV summit. From that point in time Musk started tilting against the democrats. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Librarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_librarian/32/402_2.png) [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/108 "2024-12-19T07:29:18Z")
Market manipulation. It may come as a shock to some of the fanbois here, but Musk isn’t known to be a very truthful, honest or decent person. He is in a perfect position to manipulate Tesla stock AND he benefits (or tries to) from the ludicrous price. The idea that he would NOT be manipulating stock prices is hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/109 "2024-12-19T13:15:37Z")
> [@The\_Librarian](#): > > It may come as a shock to some of the fanbois here, but Musk isn’t known to be a very truthful, honest or decent person. Who here is a Musk fanboy? Please show one instance of anyone claiming in the last five years that Musk is honest or decent. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Librarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_librarian/32/402_2.png) [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/110 "2024-12-19T13:48:48Z")
Why do you feel I was talking about you? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/111 "2024-12-19T14:14:23Z")
I didn’t. Your claim is that there are Musk fanboys here. I am asking for a cite specifically where someone thinks Musk is decent and honest. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Librarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_librarian/32/402_2.png) [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/112 "2024-12-19T14:18:19Z")
There is someone right above my post who thinks he is “a genius who went MAGA” Do you need more cites? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/113 "2024-12-19T14:23:50Z")
You said “decent and honest” which is different than acknowledging business acumen. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Librarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_librarian/32/402_2.png) [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/114 "2024-12-19T14:31:53Z")
It is implied in “went MAGA” While he was always a white supremacist. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/115 "2024-12-19T14:39:55Z")
So then your claim that people here currently think that Musk is honest and decent is ridiculous hyperbole. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/116 "2024-12-19T15:01:14Z")
> [@Ash\_trav511](#): > > It’s so sad and scary to see a technologically very very competent man and a manufacturing genius go MAGA. That would be even sadder than Musk going MAGA if it ever happens. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2024, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/117 "2024-12-20T03:11:11Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > The vast majority of those companies will fail. They have no manufacturing experience and no ability to train AI at scale. Tesla has 50k NVIDIA GPUs in their datacenter for AI training, and they plan on growing further. Which other robotics companies have anything close to that? > > It’s pretty clear now that in the AI space, it’s basically all about your training set and the amount of compute you can throw at the problem. If you don’t have a $X billion datacenter, you aren’t playing with the big boys. Tesla is also likely to have “premium” access to xAI, which has an even larger datacenter. > > And then when it comes to manufacturing, Tesla has demonstrated that they’re very good at driving down costs and building millions of units per year. They can also build new factories quickly and have plenty of cash on hand (\>$30B) for capital expenditures. Robots aren’t quite the same as EVs, but they share many components, so they’re probably better positioned than just about any other company. But again, a lot of that applies to Hyundai too. Hyundai has a large manufacturing base. Hyundai has 20 billion in cash reserves, they make EVs, and they own the robotics company boston dynamics. They also have multiple subsidiaries involved in manufacturing of various products. Despite Hyundai having the same things Tesla has, their market cap is 37 billion. > **[Hyundai Motor Group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_Motor_Group#Affiliates)** > > The Hyundai Motor Group (HMG; .mw-parser-output .IPA-label-small{font-size:85%}.mw-parser-output .references .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .infobox .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .navbox .IPA-label-small{font-size:100%}IPA: \[ˈhjəːndɛ\]; stylized as HYUNDAI) is a South Korean chaebol (loosely similar to a multinational conglomerate but without a central holding company or ownership structure) headquartered in Seoul, South Korea. > The HMG also refers to the group of affiliated companies int... Its hard to find info because a lot of sites seem to confuse Hyundai motor group (the parent company) with hyundai motor company (the auto manufacturer). But the Hyundai motor group has revenues of about 224 billion USD a year and their market cap ‘may’ only be 37 billion (but again, that may just be the Hyundai auto group). But the auto group alone seems to have revenues of ~80 billion a year. Tesla has 94 billion in revenue and nearly 1.4 trillion in market cap. Why is Hyundai with their automobile facilities, EV division, large manufacturing facilities and robotics department worth so much less than Tesla? ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2024, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/118 "2024-12-20T04:44:46Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Why is Hyundai with their automobile facilities, EV division, large manufacturing facilities and robotics department worth so much less than Tesla? With my limited business knowledge, yes. Hyundai and other auto majors have not invested in AI. Tesla is way ahead in AI infrastructure, datacentres and ability to scale very rapidly. At the pace X.ai is going it is likely to overtake Open AI by 2026. And Musk treats all his companies as one. So he will use the AI capabalities of not just Tesla but also X.ai for autonomous driving. China has given approval for Tesla FSD real world testing as has Switzerland. So Tesla is ahead of other rivals in this aspect. Waymo can’t compete as their vehicles are too costly compared to Tesla(5 to 10 times costlier) and they need high res maps. Tesla has gone for pure visual FSD with cameras mimicking human senses. As someone said, in the coming years Tesla will be an AI first company which also makes automobiles and solar panels and humanoid robots. ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2024, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/119 "2024-12-20T04:47:21Z")
> **[Elon Musk builds xAI, world's largest AI computing system in just 16 months,...](https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international/us/elon-musk-builds-xai-worlds-largest-ai-computing-system-in-just-16-months-sparks-anxiety-among-rivals-like-openai-heres-how-he-did-it/articleshow/115938199.cms?from=mdr)** > > Elon Musks xAI has redefined the AI landscape, achieving a staggering $50 billion valuation in just 16 months—a feat that took industry leader OpenAI over nine years. ---
**Author:** ![Ash\_trav511](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@Ash\_trav511](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ash_trav511)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2024, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594/120 "2024-12-20T04:48:48Z")
> **[The Colossus Supercomputer: Elon Musk’s Drive Toward Data Center AI Technology](https://www.datacenterfrontier.com/machine-learning/article/55244139/the-colossus-ai-supercomputer-elon-musks-drive-toward-data-center-ai-technology-domination)** > > How xAI and NVIDIA are pushing the limits of AI data center compute, power, and cooling possibilities. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-teslas-market-cap-so-high/1011594.md?page=7)