# Why is that when bigots are called out for their views, they call it harassment or bullying? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 3, 2018, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970 "2018-03-03T17:17:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BloodStalk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee59a6/32.png) [@BloodStalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BloodStalk)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/1 "2018-03-03T17:17:54Z")
I don’t get this. They hold reprehensible views and yet when they are criticized, they act like victims. Why is that? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/2 "2018-03-03T17:23:23Z")
> [@BloodStalk](#): > > I don’t get this. They hold reprehensible views and yet when they are criticized, they act like victims. Why is that? Because they believe they are right. ‘It ain’t [del]biggitry[/del] [del]biggatry[/del] racism if it’s true!’ . ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/3 "2018-03-03T18:18:27Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Because they believe they are right. Yes. Keep in mind that nobody thinks that the views that they hold are wrong. (On this, see Kathryn Schulz’s [book](https://www.amazon.com/Being-Wrong-Adventures-Margin-Error-ebook/dp/B003JBHW08/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1520100732&sr=1-1&keywords=kathryn+schulz) or [TED talk](https://www.ted.com/talks/kathryn_schulz_on_being_wrong#t-474973).) > [@Kathryn Schulz](#): > > But by definition, there can’t be any particular feeling associated with simply being wrong. Indeed, the whole reason it’s possible to be wrong is that, while it is happening, you are oblivious to it. When you are simply going about your business in a state you will later decide was delusional, you have no idea of it whatsoever. You are like the coyote in the Road Runner cartoons, after he has gone off the cliff but before he has looked down. Literally in his case and figuratively in yours, you are already in trouble when you feel like you’re still on solid ground. So I should revise myself: it does feel like something to be wrong. It feels like being right. > > This is the problem of error-blindness. Whatever falsehoods each of us currently believes are necessarily invisible to us. Think about the telling fact that error literally doesn’t exist in the first person present tense: the sentence “I am wrong” describes a logical impossibility. As soon as we know that we are wrong, we aren’t wrong anymore, since to recognize a belief as false is to stop believing it. Thus we can only say “I was wrong.” Call it the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle of Error: we can be wrong, or we can know it, but we can’t do both at the same time. And when people criticize you for your views, you can examine them to see if your critics have a point, or you can get defensive. It’s human nature to react the second way, especially if you have a vested interest in the views you hold, or a lot of your personal identity is tied up in them. And the more people criticize them, the more you feel ganged up on—the more you feel like a victim. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/4 "2018-03-03T21:02:58Z")
One of my rules of thumb is that most people tend to think that other people operate mentally like them. So a bigot is fine with harassment and bullying. He thinks everyone else does it all the time. Ergo, anyone confronting him is merely harassing him. The idea that the other person is helpful/factual/merely different doesn’t occur as a first thought. E.g., an anti-semite will tend to think that Jewish people are strongly anti-goyim. And therefore one needs to “protect” oneself from them. Facts have no affect on how most people operate mentally. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/5 "2018-03-03T22:12:58Z")
> [@BloodStalk](#): > > I don’t get this. They hold reprehensible views and yet when they are criticized, they act like victims. Why is that? Because they’ve learned that it works. No matter how racist they are, if they cry victim when someone points that out, they inevitably find people who fall for it, and stick up for them. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/6 "2018-03-04T12:03:16Z")
Because bullies like to get their martyrdom in first. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/7 "2018-03-04T12:21:44Z")
But then, who exactly is a bigot? How about the [group banning white students from the University of Berkeley](https://reason.com/blog/2016/10/26/video-uc-berkeley-protesters-built-a-hum)? If someone tried to tell me where I can or cannot walk there would be trouble. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/8 "2018-03-04T16:31:47Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But then, who exactly is a bigot? > > How about the [group banning white students from the University of Berkeley](https://reason.com/blog/2016/10/26/video-uc-berkeley-protesters-built-a-hum)? If someone tried to tell me where I can or cannot walk there would be trouble. First in with the obligatory “They do it too!” response. Here’s a clue: If you do something bad, it does not become less bad if someone else someplace else also does something bad. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/9 "2018-03-04T16:51:55Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > First in with the obligatory “They do it too!” response. Here’s a clue: If you do something bad, it does not become less bad if someone else someplace else also does something bad. And if it bothers you that for an hour or so, a handful of white people were inconvenienced, then it should bother you even more that for generations, millions of people were oppressed. It should also bother you that, while things have gotten better, most of these students encounter far more formidable obstructions to their pursuits every single day. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/10 "2018-03-04T17:18:29Z")
It’s a very common technique in domestic violence cases and nasty divorces. It not only serves to imply the violence or reason for the divorce was perpetrated on both sides, it interrupts the “narrative”, obscures the facts and course of events, and is so fucking annoying people will settle to just end the whole frustrating and humiliating process. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/11 "2018-03-04T18:28:07Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But then, who exactly is a bigot? > > How about the [group banning white students from the University of Berkeley](https://reason.com/blog/2016/10/26/video-uc-berkeley-protesters-built-a-hum)? If someone tried to tell me where I can or cannot walk there would be trouble. Guess what? That was a limited time protest. I guess you must think those bigots blocking the Selma Bridge were in the wrong also. Bigotry is trying block the entry of black people into schools permanently. Bigotry is lynching. Bigotry is killing civil rights workers. Bigotry is burning down churches. The defenders of all those things got real upset by pushback from the federal government and from “outside agitators” from the North. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/12 "2018-03-04T20:58:42Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Guess what? That was a limited time protest. I guess you must think those bigots blocking the Selma Bridge were in the wrong also. > Bigotry is trying block the entry of black people into schools permanently. Bigotry is lynching. Bigotry is killing civil rights workers. Bigotry is burning down churches. > . So what DO YOU CALL telling students they have to alter the way they go to school? Do racist actions of the past justify racist behavior now? ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/13 "2018-03-04T21:01:52Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > And if it bothers you that for an hour or so, a handful of white people were inconvenienced, then it should bother you even more that for generations, millions of people were oppressed. It should also bother you that, while things have gotten better, most of these students encounter far more formidable obstructions to their pursuits every single day. Curious, if you were one of those students kept from attending class that day, what would you have done? So what should “white” people do about the sins of the past? Should I get down on my hands and knees and beg for forgiveness? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/14 "2018-03-04T21:04:36Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > So what DO YOU CALL telling students they have to alter the way they go to school? If it is everyday, and it is supported by the community and those in authority, as were jim crow era laws and policies, then that would be bigotry and racism. A small group of people for a short time, I’d call a demonstration. > [@](#): > > Do racist actions of the past justify racist behavior now? No, but the continuing effects of past racism, combined with current racist attitudes that still exist more than justify a demonstration that causes a slight amount of inconvenience to a handful of people over a short period of time. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/15 "2018-03-04T21:04:43Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > First in with the obligatory “They do it too!” response. Here’s a clue: If you do something bad, it does not become less bad if someone else someplace else also does something bad. I, and nobody in my family, EVER did anything racist. So why do you dump the blame for Selma Alabama on me? So just how far can the left go in racist actions like this BEFORE you finally agree that is enough? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/16 "2018-03-04T21:08:06Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But then, who exactly is a bigot? > > How about the [group banning white students from the University of Berkeley](https://reason.com/blog/2016/10/26/video-uc-berkeley-protesters-built-a-hum)? This characterization of the events recounted at the link is categorically false and is in no way supported by the information provided at the link. > [@Urbanredneck](#): > > If someone tried to tell me where I can or cannot walk there would be trouble. The students protesting were told where they can and cannot gather; consequently, there was trouble. I take it, then, that you agree with their goals and methods, right? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/17 "2018-03-04T21:09:02Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Curious, if you were one of those students kept from attending class that day, what would you have done? I would have realized that the slight inconveniences that they are posing me reminds me of the obstacles that society has put in their paths. I would have either stopped and talked to them to encourage them that not all white people are racists, and that some white people can even empathise with their challenges, or if I were in a hurry to get to class, I would have made my way around the best I could. > [@](#): > > So what should “white” people do about the sins of the past? Acknowledge that they happened, that they have effects that are still evident, and that they are still ongoing. > [@](#): > > Should I get down on my hands and knees and beg for forgiveness? If you feel, in your conscience, that you have significantly contributed to the problem, and that is what you need to do to clear your conscience of the damage that you have inflicted upon others, then sure, do what you need to do. Otherwise, no one is asking you to do anything like that. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/18 "2018-03-04T21:18:46Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > If it is everyday, and it is supported by the community and those in authority, as were jim crow era laws and policies, then that would be bigotry and racism. A small group of people for a short time, I’d call a demonstration. No a demonstration is standing somewhere holding signs. However when it targets people just on the basis of skin tone, THAT is a racist action and should have been immediately stopped by police. Plus it wasnt just a one time thing. They are pushing the school to have “safe spaces” for only “persons of color”. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > No, but the continuing effects of past racism, combined with current racist attitudes that still exist more than justify a demonstration that causes a slight amount of inconvenience to a handful of people over a short period of time. How? Do you think the white people humiliated by this action are now going to suddenly feel sorry for black people? Heck [some of the articles](https://mystudentvoices.com/uc-berkeley-protesters-demand-racially-segregated-safe-space-d8d2c3d0ce4c) I was reading showed it probably hurt their cause and created a greater racial tension than before. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/19 "2018-03-04T21:32:50Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I, and nobody in my family, EVER did anything racist. So why do you dump the blame for Selma Alabama on me? Neither did in the past, nor do now, virtually anyone in the disempowered groups do anything to deserve the way they were (and in some aspects still are) treated unjustly. Now, sure, the idea ideally is \*\*\*not \*\*\*to “dump the blame on you”, but rather to _give the dominant group some idea of what it felt like_, so maybe they can understand where the others are coming from. Of course there will always be some ass who decides to make it about blind payback or who comes up with a daft display to try and show off, but that is peripheral. Going back to the OP: the bigots consider it entirely unacceptable to have it thrown back in their faces, because they consider it a counterpunch and an attempt at _now subjugating them_. They will stand on the position that there is nothing wrong about what they thought, said or did, and that everyone just has to get over it. And if their positions are now socially unacceptable, it’s not that society has weighed them and found them wanting, but merely that “the other side” has the upper hand for now. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970/20 "2018-03-04T21:35:44Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This characterization of the events recounted at the link is categorically false and is in no way supported by the information provided at the link. > ? What do you mean? [White students were told “go around” while students of color were told “let him thru”](https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/oct/24/berkeley-protesters-form-human-chain-stop-white-st/). The video very clearly shows white students being told to go around while non whites were allowed thru. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-that-when-bigots-are-called-out-for-their-views-they-call-it-harassment-or-bullying/809970.md?page=2)