# Why is the DMV so terrible? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 1, 2019, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030 "2019-08-01T22:50:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![chizzuk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e36b37/32.png) [@chizzuk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chizzuk)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/21 "2019-08-02T10:18:36Z")
I find Maryland’s MVA to be classically awful. First there’s a line to get in line, then you sit for anywhere from 1-4 hours waiting for your number to come up. Vehicle services tends to move faster than driver’s license services and there’s a fair amount you can take care of online, but having to go to the MVA has always been unpleasant for me and I’ve never managed to get out in under an hour. Longest ever wait was 5 hours, for a learner’s permit. Though I will say that I haven’t found the stereotype of the workers being nasty or short-tempered to be true. The MVA clerks have always been very courteous to me, gave good answers and explanations, and were efficient in handling my issue, whenever I actually managed to reach the kiosk. It’s really the sitting around waiting for hours on end that’s the problem. Maybe it’s just my local branch. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/22 "2019-08-02T11:10:44Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > I got my first license 50 years ago in New York. That was a real nightmare. It’s been uphill since then. The New York State DMV, or at least the branches in New York City, were indeed a nightmare for many, many years. I won’t bother with horror stories here, but New Yorkers of a certain age will know what I mean. That said, it has improved a lot. Many transactions can be completed online. And even those that require a visit are better. Recently (this year) I had to visit the DMV to get my new, RealID compliant license. I was in and out in less than 30 minutes. The staff was polite and helpful. The physical plant was clean and well-lit, with adequate seating and boards displaying one’s number, so standing on line was unnecessary. To anyone who first encountered the NYC DMV in the late seventies or the eighties, this was like some weird visit to another dimension. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/23 "2019-08-02T11:57:43Z")
Obligatory Family Guy link: \*btw, Peter is black because it is an episode where he was a newly freed slave and decided to get back at whites by founding the DMV. :) ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/24 "2019-08-02T12:04:03Z")
Not all locations are equal. The one on 99th and King Drive is a nightmare. The one on Pulaski near the Midlothian Turnpike is very user friendly in comparison. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/25 "2019-08-02T12:11:13Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Inspired by something in another thread: it seems to be a common belief in the US that the DMV is extremely slow/incompetent/bureaucratic, and I’ve seem plenty of Americans complain about it over the years. Living in the UK, I’ve never had a problem with our equivalent the DVLA, and haven’t noticed any general complaints. So what are the problems with the DMV and why have they seemingly not been fixed for decades? My last trip to the DMV in Chicago Heights, Il. to renew my license and take the exam was a piece of cake. Kudos to the Chicago Heights DMV, even though someone was shot in the parking lot earlier in the week! (People who knew each other and had a beef, apparently.) ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/26 "2019-08-02T12:15:40Z")
I’ll second the others who have mainly experienced an annoying wait, rather than bad service. If I can avoid the wait, it’s a breeze. Last time I renewed my license, I successfully found a time where it was completely empty and got in and out in under 10 minutes (which included answering the usual questions, taking an eye test, getting my picture taken, and waiting for it to print). ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/27 "2019-08-02T12:29:43Z")
> [@chizzuk](#): > > I find Maryland’s MVA to be classically awful. First there’s a line to get in line, then you sit for anywhere from 1-4 hours waiting for your number to come up. _\_ I expect that’s a function of where you are. St. Mary’s county is not very densely populated, and in addition to our one MVA office, there are a number of the private companies that do many of their functions, for a price, I’m sure. The most I’ve had to wait is an hour, and I did my best to avoid beginning and end of month crushes. One thing I do like about our office - when you first check in, they make sure you have everything you need to do what you want to do, so you don’t sit around for an hour, only to be told “Oh, no, you also need your mother’s birth certificate” or some such. My husband and I have appointments at the end of this month to get our RealID licenses. We know what documentation we need, so theoretically, it will go quickly, especially since we’re on the schedule. We shall see. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/28 "2019-08-02T12:52:04Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > I know my local DMVs have gotten much more efficient. But that can still mean waiting around for a half hour instead of an hour. > > As for why they so terrible, IMO, it’s because their run by the government (hear me out, this isn’t an anti-gov rant). The thing is (and this is all IMO), there’s no competition. No one at the DMV, nor those above them, care how long you have to wait. If you need to do something there, eventually you’re going to find the time to stop in and wait around. And this is really it. No reason to get into another one of these debates, but this is one of those things where: 1. You need it. 2. You can’t get it anywhere else. 3. So, you’ll do whatever you have to. Therefore, there is no real incentive to make things better. Sure, a politician might want to look better by speeding things up or making them more efficient, but as soon as the budget needs cutting, DMV workers get canned before teachers. There is really no reason that in these days of the internet that all of the documents needed, including my picture, cannot be electronically accessed where things are done near automatically. If I was able to borrow money for a home mortgage entirely online from start to finish, there is no reason I cannot get a state permit to drive the same way. But again, why spend all that time and effort to make it convenient for me when I will do it anyways because I have to? ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/29 "2019-08-02T12:53:48Z")
I’ve told this story in other places here, but here we go again. A friend of mine spent the first twenty years of her married life going around the country with her husband in the Air Force. Never had trouble with DMVs and getting a new license in a different state. Then they moved from Alaska to Texas, and the clerk told her about all the difficultieds that would be involved getting a Texas license. Why? \* “Because we don’t take licenses from foreign countries!”\* The clerk refused to believe Alaska was a US state. So it’s like others have said, it’s the particular office, not the institution in general, that’s sometimes the problem. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/30 "2019-08-02T13:04:38Z")
> [@chizzuk](#): > > I find Maryland’s MVA to be classically awful. First there’s a line to get in line, then you sit for anywhere from 1-4 hours waiting for your number to come up. Vehicle services tends to move faster than driver’s license services and there’s a fair amount you can take care of online, but having to go to the MVA has always been unpleasant for me and I’ve never managed to get out in under an hour. Longest ever wait was 5 hours, for a learner’s permit. I was just at the MVA last month. Beltsville, which is typically one of busier ones. I had to renew my license, which last time I just did through the mail but now that they’re issuing new TSA-compliant licenses you HAVE to go in to a branch to do it. I found this out when I went to do it on their website like last time, but that’s also where I discovered you can make an appointment. **Make an appointment**. I was in and out of there in 15 minutes. Seriously. There was only a few minutes waiting, and they absolutely take people by their appointment time (that is to say, if you’re in the “Appointments” line and there are people ahead of you in line with a later appointment, you will be taken before them). But don’t worry, if you want to wait for hours and hours, they still offer that too. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/31 "2019-08-02T13:11:29Z")
The real question is, why do some people in the DC area (e.g. the deejays at DC-101) refer to our area as the “DMV”, given the crappy reputation of the bureaucratic institution that’s been known as the DMV for a hell of a lot longer? Yeah, I know: DMV = **D** istrict, **M** aryland, **V** irginia, but you really want to attach one of the most detested acronyms to an area you’re trying to _promote??_ (Not that it makes much difference, but the motor vehicle bureaucracy is the DMV in both DC and VA. As others have noted above, in Maryland it’s the MVA.) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/32 "2019-08-02T13:21:14Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > I was just at the MVA last month. Beltsville, which is typically one of busier ones. I had to renew my license, which last time I just did through the mail but now that they’re issuing new TSA-compliant licenses you HAVE to go in to a branch to do it. I found this out when I went to do it on their website like last time, but that’s also where I discovered you can make an appointment. > > **Make an appointment**. I was in and out of there in 15 minutes. Seriously. There was only a few minutes waiting, and they absolutely take people by their appointment time (that is to say, if you’re in the “Appointments” line and there are people ahead of you in line with a later appointment, you will be taken before them). Yeah, I had to get my new RealID license early this year, so like you, I made an appointment. A lot of offices were booked up pretty far in advance, but I was able to get an appointment at the Largo MVA, which wasn’t too far out of my way, with no problem. There was a bit of a wait, but I was still in and out of there in no more than 45 minutes, even though the place was a zoo full of people. And the clerk who I dealt with was quite pleasant. Sure, it would have been nice to be able to do it all online like we used to, but for a once-every-seven-years deal, it was a pretty minor hassle. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/33 "2019-08-02T14:14:53Z")
WA state, where I live in the county with the highest/densest population. The last time I went to the DOL, the hardest part was finding the place (it was in a hard to find building of an off the beaten path area and I missed the sign the first time I drove past.) But I was in and out in under 10 minutes. That 10-15 minute wait is usual for me. It’s not that bad. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/34 "2019-08-02T14:37:31Z")
I live in a mostly rural county in the most densely populated state in the country. It seems to me that much of the problem comes from the fact that everyone wants to go to the one closest to them. It can be a long wait in more densely populated areas. I live pretty close to a full service MVC (DMV) location. I’ve never had more than 2 people ahead of me in line. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/35 "2019-08-02T14:40:29Z")
The biggest problem with and DMV is that idiots don’t have the correct paperwork or are trying to do something hinky. Nevada DMV rocks and I never have a problem. I can do most everything online, and if I need to go in, I hit a ‘secret’ office in a small town nearby and Alisha takes real good care of me. 😉 Never a wait and in and out! ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/36 "2019-08-02T15:01:50Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Not really. All my dealings with the DVLA have either been online or through the post office. When I needed to renew my drivers licence I filled in a form online and paid £14. I didn’t even have to send them a photo, just tick a box to use the one in my biometric passport. I had to post them my old licence and received the new one a few days later. I was actually impressed by how easy it was and the fact they’ve joined up these databases, and it surely saves money for the government, too. > > Car tax is also done online, and you can look up your registration in the database to check when it’s due. Buying or selling a car involves paper forms that you post to the DVLA. > > Seems a lot of the issues are caused by making everyone go to a (busy) office in person. Does every state DMV make you do this? Why can’t they automate it? They don’t necessarily make everyone to a busy office in person for every transaction. I live in NYC and _Saintly Loser \*\* is correct- the DMV offices in NYC were a horror show up until maybe the '90s. But even then, everyone did not have to go to an office for every transaction - I could renew my license/registration by mail for as long as I can remember. But if I needed a duplicate, or if I forgot to renew by mail in time , I had to go in person . And of course, for a brand-new license, I would have to go in person. A new registration/plates would depend on how I obtained car - if I bought it from a dealer, the dealer would handle the registration/plates, but for private party sale, I would have to go in person . Nowadays , I really only have to go in person for a new license ( either because I never had one , or because it expired too long ago or because I want to upgrade the type of license_ from Standard to Real ID compliant or enhanced) And you have to remember , there are certain differences between the UK and the US. First off, it seems the DVLA is a national agency - that’s not the case in the US. Various DMV/BMV/Secretary of State offices don’t have access to passport photos. It wouldn’t really matter if they did- only about 42% of Americans hold passports. If you didn’t have a passport, would you have had to go in person? - or possibly use a Private Service Bureau for an extra fee - they exist now, but I don’t know when they started. Many of them don’t actually get you your license/registration quicker than a visit to the DMV ( it can take 24 hours to get your documents) but you do spend less time waiting in line. \*\* Standard allows me to drive, REAL ID is accepted for boarding domestic flights and entering Federal facilities and enhanced allows me to enter the US from Canada , Mexico and some Caribbean countries by land or sea. Each has different documentation requirements. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/37 "2019-08-02T15:07:32Z")
I had to renew my driver’s license this year (California). I could have done it online if I didn’t want to upgrade to a Real ID, which would have been a piece of cake. I normally make an appointment when I go to the DMV, but I guess because of the Real ID rush, appointments were only available 3 months out in some offices, and not available at all in others. The CA DMV website has a very useful feature that tells you the current wait time in every office, so when I was out one day on another errand I found an office with a 15 minute wait time and went there. Unfortunately the wait time only counts the time from when you check in until you’re serviced, but doesn’t include the time in the line to check in, which was about 30 minutes. Still overall I was in and out in about an hour, which I can’t complain too much about. I’ve waited longer than that in a doctor’s office. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/38 "2019-08-02T15:16:01Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Its more just people bitching about the government. I’ve found the DMV to function fine. It depends on where and when, IME. For decades (decades!), the CA DMVs specifically in San Francisco, South San Francisco, and Santa Clara were notoriously inefficient. If you needed to go, you pretty much wrote off half your day just to get basic services. It was truly terrible, even with appointments it was a terrible experience. Awful customer service. This was true in the 70s, 80s, 90s, and 00s. There’s been significant improvements in the last over 10 years, IME. But it took decades for that to be corrected. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/39 "2019-08-02T15:49:24Z")
There are just a lot of rules and regulations concerning drivers and vehicles. The workers have to know all those regulations and deal with a lot of people in a lot of moods that don’t want to deal with the red tape and have to pay too much for something they don’t even want. So it’s just not a happy place. All you can do is make the best of it. And of course like any other organizations, some offices are better with better morale than others. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2019, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030/40 "2019-08-02T15:58:03Z")
Cause the people working there are only interested in doing as little work as they can to collect their paycheck. And that applies to every branch of the government, not just the DMV. I have two thoughts on dealing with the gummint: Do it as little as possible and do whatever they tell you to do. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-dmv-so-terrible/838030.md?page=3)