# Why is the 'R' difficult?

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-r-difficult/823998>\
**Category:** Factual Questions\
**Created:** [November 5, 2018, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-r-difficult/823998 "2018-11-05T11:07:29Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 3\
**Page:** 3

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\
**Post date:** [November 12, 2018, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-r-difficult/823998/41 "2018-11-12T04:19:46Z")

</div>

“/r/ voiced alveolar-dental flap; it occurs in word medial positions; it does not occur in word initial or final positions.” —A Grammatical Sketch of Isaalo (Western Sisaala), 2006, p. 57.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\
**Post date:** [November 12, 2018, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-r-difficult/823998/42 "2018-11-12T05:17:17Z")

</div>

> [@JKellyMap](#):
>
> The OP mentioned rhotics often “disappear” — true, they sometimes do, but note there is a difference between “r-coloring” (no distinct sound is made, such as a trill or uvular aproximant, BUT the adjacent vowel changes quality — as in ‘non-rhotic’ Received British Pronunciation of English), and true disappearance (as in many African speakers of English as a second language, for whom “work” sounds to me like “wek”).

They’re just changing ɝ or ɚ into something closer to ɛ - if you asked them to actually say “Weck”, it might sound different. But you can hunt all you like to find the actual “r” in an ɝ sound - there isn’t one. What I mean is that you’re not saying an “r” in “work” any more than the Africans are. (Unless you’re Scottish or something.)

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\
**Post date:** [November 12, 2018, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-r-difficult/823998/43 "2018-11-12T05:27:40Z")

</div>

> [@Nava](#):
>
> One of the defining characteristics (perhaps the defining characteristic) of a Catalan accent when speaking Spanish is precisely that the Ls are different in both languages; in most Catalan dialects, the L “moves to the ceiling” (it’s palatal vs the alveolar version of Spanish).
> 
> Thanks to[this person](https://www.velabas.com/writing/language/how-catalan-different-from-spanish/) who thinks Spanish ortography is actually easier than it is, and who pointed out that both Ls are found in Portuguese, I was able to find the two IPA symbols: Spanish /l/, Catalan /ʎ/. For some reason the listings I find when searching for Catalan phonetics always say /l/, which is definitely not right.

Listen to some Russian, and see if they have any “Catalan L’s”. 🙂

[Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-the-r-difficult/823998.md?page=2)