# Why is this site overwhelmingly atheist? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 30, 2014, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938 "2014-08-30T04:04:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2014, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/281 "2014-09-08T23:36:15Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Those were just errors in transcription/translation. God tried its level best to explain this stuff, but the imperfect humans wrote it down wrong. Or maybe they wrote it down right at first but it got messed up in the copying process or distorted in translation. You know that’s possible, and I know that’s possible, but the “Literally true” crowd don’t! They (by and large) insist that the translation was divinely guided and inerrant. [There’s a lovely painting by Caravaggio](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Matthew_and_the_Angel) (destroyed, alas, in 1945) showing an angel guiding Saint Matthew’s hand as he struggles to write his Gospel. It’s a charming composition, contrasting the gross material physicality of the man with the aethereal celestial abstraction of the angel. But…there are those who take this is essentially literal. To them, no distortions or errors can possibly exist. How do you deal with that kind of mind-set? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/282 "2014-09-09T00:13:15Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > You know that’s possible, and I know that’s possible, but the “Literally true” crowd don’t! A significant portion of the atheist crowd doesn’t, either. The reason we’re talking about it in this thread right now is because an atheist brought it up as a criticism of moderate Christianity. ---
**Author:** ![Reyemile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@Reyemile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reyemile)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/283 "2014-09-09T00:58:23Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Those were just errors in transcription/translation. God tried its level best to explain this stuff, but the imperfect humans wrote it down wrong. Or maybe they wrote it down right at first but it got messed up in the copying process or distorted in translation. But this invalidates the use of the entire bible, since any and every line is now subject to question of whether it is divinely inspired or merely human transcription error. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/284 "2014-09-09T01:01:00Z")
True, but it seems really pointless for an atheist to lay down “rules of worship” that the faithful have to follow. The lack of authority is enough to kill the idea right off the bat. (It’s a little as if a religious believer insisted that all atheists go through a daily litany of the names of all the gods they don’t believe in. Ahriman, Asmodeus, Asutra, Baal, Bast…etc. And if I accidentally leave out even one name, I’m not “really” an atheist. What a damn fool rule. Who gave them the authority to implement it?) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/285 "2014-09-09T01:15:39Z")
> [@Reyemile](#): > > But this invalidates the use of the entire bible, since any and every line is now subject to question of whether it is divinely inspired or merely human transcription error. How is that different from studying any other historical text? It’s always a process of figuring out what’s true, what’s a transcription/translation error, what’s the writer’s personal bias, what was included to curry favor with the political elite, etc. etc. Nonetheless, the field of history is not wholly debunked by the fact that Herodotus talked a lot of bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/286 "2014-09-09T01:27:15Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > How is that different from studying any other historical text? It’s always a process of figuring out what’s true, what’s a transcription/translation error, what’s the writer’s personal bias, what was included to curry favor with the political elite, etc. etc. Nonetheless, the field of history is not wholly debunked by the fact that Herodotus talked a lot of bullshit. It is different because some people are insistent upon using the bible (or select parts of it) as a definitive guidebook for morality. If the translation is suspect, can we rely on the validity of the moral code? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/287 "2014-09-09T01:30:10Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > How is that different from studying any other historical text? It’s always a process of figuring out what’s true, what’s a transcription/translation error, what’s the writer’s personal bias, what was included to curry favor with the political elite, etc. etc. Nonetheless, the field of history is not wholly debunked by the fact that Herodotus talked a lot of bullshit. it’s not - except that the Bible gets “special” status based on the belief that it is a “Holy Book” - and some treat it even more special than others. If it were treated as any other historical document with cultural significance, it wouldn’t be the “Bible”. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/288 "2014-09-09T01:33:52Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > True, but it seems really pointless for an atheist to lay down “rules of worship” that the faithful have to follow. {…} I just want them to actually follow _their_ “rules of worship”. CMC fnord! Also; I’m not an _atheist_ atheist, its complicated. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/289 "2014-09-09T01:34:53Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > It is different because some people are insistent upon using the bible (or select parts of it) as a definitive guidebook for morality. If the translation is suspect, can we rely on the validity of the moral code? Right. But again, in the context of this thread, it’s not fundamentalists using Biblical literacy to attack non-Christians, it’s atheists using Biblical literacy to attack moderate Christians. Biblical literacy is an intellectually bankrupt idea, but it is not a necessary component of the Christian faith, and there’s nothing hypocritical about believing that the Bible is a human-written history of legitimately divine events, while still being subject to the same risk of error or bias that affects any other history. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/290 "2014-09-09T01:35:40Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > I am going on the assumption–perhaps not quite accurate–that the JBS has pegged non-conservative politicos generally, as Reds or Pinkos. In any case, I know Jefferson had enemies during his lifetime and has been commonly attacked since his death. So a) you have no idea what you’re referring to (as backed up in the next post) b) knowing that Jefferson had enemies? so what - after all, he was one of the founding fathers - pretty sure they all had enemies of one kind or another - whats that got to do with anything? Admit it - you’re just making this up as you go along, you have no intention of debating or discussing the topic honestly - right? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/291 "2014-09-09T01:37:55Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Right. But again, in the context of this thread, it’s not fundamentalists using Biblical literacy to attack non-Christians, it’s atheists using Biblical literacy to attack moderate Christians. Biblical literacy is an intellectually bankrupt idea, but it is not a necessary component of the Christian faith, and there’s nothing hypocritical about believing that the Bible is a human-written history of legitimately divine events, while still being subject to the same risk of error or bias that affects any other history. so - how do you decide what is a legitimately and accurately recorded “divine event” and what is not? Lets start with evidence for any single “divine event” thats recorded in the Bible… I’m patient - I’ll wait. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/292 "2014-09-09T01:53:37Z")
> [@simster](#): > > so - how do you decide what is a legitimately and accurately recorded “divine event” and what is not? I dunno. Try asking a Christian. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/293 "2014-09-09T01:58:08Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I dunno. Try asking a Christian. It’s an open question - while I was responding to your post - anyone is free to answer. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/294 "2014-09-09T04:59:04Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > True, but it seems really pointless for an atheist to lay down “rules of worship” that the faithful have to follow. The lack of authority is enough to kill the idea right off the bat. > > (It’s a little as if a religious believer insisted that all atheists go through a daily litany of the names of all the gods they don’t believe in. Ahriman, Asmodeus, Asutra, Baal, Bast…etc. And if I accidentally leave out even one name, I’m not “really” an atheist. What a damn fool rule. Who gave them the authority to implement it?) You know what would be great? A version of Tom Lehrer’s “The Elements” with the names of various gods in place of the elements. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/295 "2014-09-09T05:00:11Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I dunno. Try asking a Christian. I did in that other big thread - and didn’t get much of an answer. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/296 "2014-09-09T05:02:29Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > You know what would be great? A version of Tom Lehrer’s “The Elements” with the names of various gods in place of the elements. I do so like the way you think! (Ha! I nominate **GIGObuster** to write it! How’s that for passing the buck deftly?) ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/297 "2014-09-09T05:35:02Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > The mixed fabrics, specifically, God refers to as an abomination. > > Not just a rule of cleanliness; it is an abomination to God for us to mix fabrics. I believe that is mistaken. I’ll quote Leviticus 17-19. (The first 2 numbers are provided by way of contrast with 19, which is related to the ancient belief that mixtures belong to the divine). I use the Schocken translation, because I like it. [INDENT] You are not to hate your brother in your heart; rebuke, yes, rebuke your fellow, that you not bear sin because of him! You are not to take-vengeance, you are not to retain-anger against the sons of your kinspeople– but be-loving to your neighbor (as one) like yourself, I am YHWH! My laws, you are to keep: Your animal, you are not to (allow to) mate (in) two-kinds; your field, you are not to sow with two-kinds; a garment of two-kinds, of [_shaatnez_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shatnez), is not to go on you. [/INDENT] Nothing about fashion abominations, AFAIK. That said, I’ve always thought this passage provides a nice way of IDing certain hypocritical fundamentalists. Matthew [6:5](http://biblehub.com/matthew/6-5.htm) is another. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/298 "2014-09-09T05:41:11Z")
> [@simster](#): > > So > > a) you have no idea what you’re referring to (as backed up in the next post) > > b) knowing that Jefferson had enemies? so what - after all, he was one of the founding fathers - pretty sure they all had enemies of one kind or another - whats that got to do with anything? > > Admit it - you’re just making this up as you go along, you have no intention of debating or discussing the topic honestly - right? Hey, I’ve tried to be as honest as you have. If the shoe fits, wear it. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/299 "2014-09-09T05:46:25Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I think the Bible makes it fairly plain that God really only understand multiplication. fnord I followed the link to that odious skeptics’ site. They don’t make points with me for objective or respect. As for hares and rumination, I refer you to the Proceedings of the London Zoological Society, Volume 110 (1943). Now: What’s this about bats? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2014, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938/300 "2014-09-09T06:41:56Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > I followed the link to that odious skeptics’ site. They don’t make points with me for objective or respect. Respect is irrelevant. You can’t get someone to respectfully tell you that you can fly, and because he was so god dammed polite, you’re able to lift off and float into the air. On the other hand, someone who rudely tells you that there’s a cliff edge hidden by a row of bushes and that you’d be a moron to walk through the bushes, cause you’d fall to your death, well I’d suggest believing him, regardless of how much he’s disrespecting you. At the end of the day, reality is whatever it is, irregardless of your feelings on the subject. Now do you actually have an argument you want to make any more? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-is-this-site-overwhelmingly-atheist/696938.md?page=16)