# Why LGBTQ? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 20, 2016, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731 "2016-04-20T15:39:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/1 "2016-04-20T15:39:44Z")
As far as I knew it’s always been the LGBT community. Now I sse LGBTQ on several sites, such as [this one](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/04/20/whole-foods-countersues-gay-pastor-saying-he-faked-homophobic-slur-on-cake-it-sold-him/?tid=pm_national_pop_b) (a story on the dispute between Whole Foods and one of their customers over an alleged gay slur): > [@](#): > > We stand behind our bakery team member, who is part of the LGBTQ community, and the additional team members from the store, who confirmed the cake was decorated with only the message ‘Love Wins.’” I gather the Q stands for Queer, and that’s fair enough. But isn’t Queer also represented by Gay? What’s the point? Surely it can’t be simply that some Gays prefer to be known as Queers. Under that reasoning the acronym could stretch out to the crack of doom. Or is there some subtle difference between Queer and Gay that I’m missing? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/2 "2016-04-20T15:42:37Z")
Q is for Questioning ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/3 "2016-04-20T15:44:33Z")
… and he’s a Doctor, you can trust him. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/4 "2016-04-20T15:45:16Z")
[Queer.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer#Inclusivity_and_scope) It’s apparently a label for people who don’t like labels. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/5 "2016-04-20T15:47:26Z")
The extra B is for BYOBB. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/6 "2016-04-20T15:50:45Z")
I think it basically means “…and Other.” ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/7 "2016-04-20T16:00:01Z")
In its entirety, the proper term is LGBTQRSTEIEIO. I’m wondering what micro-specific identity “genderqueer” represents. Also, which one is okay with manacles but draws the line at poppers? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/8 "2016-04-20T16:01:56Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > Q is for Questioning That’s the _other_ Q. Not even joking. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/9 "2016-04-20T16:08:16Z")
On a quick Google, one of the longer versions runs “LGBTQQIP2SAA”. Here’s an article - the bits after “LGBT” stand for: > [@](#): > > Two Q’s to cover both bases (queer and questioning); > > I for Intersex, people with two sets of genitalia or various chromosomal differences; > > P for Pansexual, people who refuse to be pinned down on the Kinsey scale; > > 2S for Two-Spirit, a tradition in many First Nations that considers sexual minorities to have both male and female spirits; > > A for Asexual, people who do not identify with any orientation; and > > A for Allies, recognizing that the community thrives best with loving supporters, although they are not really part of the community itself. The rest I’m familiar with, but I have to admit the “2S” thing is a new one to me. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/10 "2016-04-20T16:19:46Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > The rest I’m familiar with, but I have to admit the “2S” thing is a new one to me. Definitely a Native American thing. “Winkte” in the Lakota language, although it doesn’t literally mean “2 spirit”, as “win” is the root word for “woman”, so it means something like “acts as a woman”, referring to men only. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/11 "2016-04-20T17:11:05Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > I gather the Q stands for Queer, and that’s fair enough. But isn’t Queer also represented by Gay? What’s the point? Surely it can’t be simply that some Gays prefer to be known as Queers. Under that reasoning the acronym could stretch out to the crack of doom. Or is there some subtle difference between Queer and Gay that I’m missing? Gay generally refers to men who are exclusively involved with men, and in some cases includes women who are exclusively involved with women, though usually ‘lesbian’ is the preferred term. It doesn’t really have any space for non-binary gender or people who’s attraction doesn’t follow the simple model (a masculine male who’s interest is receptive sex with butch women doesn’t really fit any of the standard categories, for example), while ‘queer’ has evolved to mean basically ‘anything that isn’t entirely straight’, so is a better general term. Also, ‘gay’ and ‘lesbian’ have rather specific subcultures directly attached to the name, and good number of queer people aren’t welcome and/or don’t want to be in those specific subcultures. I think that the super-long acronym variants turn into a self-parody and sticking with the historical LGBT is the way to go for understandability, much like the NAACP sticks to the now-archaic ‘colored people’ terminology. I think that terms for ‘attracted to categories’ are evolving and are really inadequate now (there’s no word for ‘man who’s attracted to women, but not necessarily exclusively women’ for example), and that it’s going to evolve a lot over the next few decades, and messing with the acronym distracts from the real issues. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/12 "2016-04-20T17:14:35Z")
For what it’s worth, LGBTQ has been in use [at least since 1996](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT). ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/13 "2016-04-20T17:34:45Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > As far as I knew it’s always been the LGBT community. Always? No. For a while we were the “Gay and Lesbian community.” Before that, we were the “Gay community.” Before that, there was no community, just a bunch of homos and dykes who got beaten up and left for dead. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/14 "2016-04-20T18:18:15Z")
Once, America was the Melting Pot, now it’s the Alphabet Soup. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/15 "2016-04-20T18:49:12Z")
[QUOTE=AHunter3’s Formal Book Proposal] People who are affirmatively tolerant on gay, lesbian and transgender issues still ask “Why do we need to add another letter to the acronym? Isn’t anyone who isn’t mainstream already covered by ‘gay’ or ‘lesbian’ or ‘bisexual’ or ‘trans’? I understand not liking rigid categories but seriously, do we need this term?” [/quote] Q is for Genderqueer, at least as much as it is for any other term. (Can’t use G, it’s already in use). Genderqueer, in turn, basically means “it’s something else”. Well, more specifically it means “your gender isn’t the one that folks would normally expect of you”. I would readily agree that it doesn’t readily encompass intersex. Intersex people have a different and nonconventional SEX identity, which is a somewhat different critter than a gender identity. I’m glad the “Q” is in the acronym. It makes me feel included. I never identified as trangender. I know it is theoretically _supposed_ to include folks like me, but in practice if you go around saying you’re transgender, everyone expects it to mean that you either have transitioned, plan to transition, or at least would ideally choose to transition if that were a financial and medical possibility for you. I prefer “genderqueer”. Folks may have less of an idea what it means but that’s better than giving folks a pretty strong idea that’s fundamentally incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/16 "2016-04-20T19:29:04Z")
I never heard Q standing for genderqueer until quite recently, and, in fact, was under the impression that any variation on the word queer when referring to LGBT was offensive. I had always heard it as questioning, especially applying to teenagers. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/17 "2016-04-20T19:36:10Z")
> [@That\_Don\_Guy](#): > > I never heard Q standing for genderqueer until quite recently, and, in fact, was under the impression that any variation on the word queer when referring to LGBT was offensive. For some. Increasingly it has been [reclaimed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer) from being a slur. “We’re here, we’re queer, get used to it.” ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/18 "2016-04-20T19:37:33Z")
> [@That\_Don\_Guy](#): > > . . . was under the impression that any variation on the word queer when referring to LGBT was offensive. That’s exactly why we use it, to take ownership of the word and dilute its offensiveness. The same way that we took ownership of the Nazi’s pink triangle. Of course, depending on who’s using the word, and how they’re using it, it can still be damn offensive. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2016, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/19 "2016-04-21T03:52:40Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > That’s exactly why we use it, to take ownership of the word and dilute its offensiveness. The same way that we took ownership of the Nazi’s pink triangle. Of course, depending on who’s using the word, and how they’re using it, it can still be damn offensive. You need a set of formalized guidelines for the word and its usage. structured queery language ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2016, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731/20 "2016-04-21T03:57:08Z")
It does seem kind of weird that a new usage like this seems to pop up everywhere with no explanation for the uniniated. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-lgbtq/752731.md?page=2)