# Why no calls for 'civility' from liberals in wake of "tastes like hate" anti-Chick-Fil-A campaign? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 16, 2012, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656 "2012-08-16T08:55:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/141 "2012-08-21T20:14:14Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > This is a primo example of the left’s smear tactics. Why are organizations that are pro-traditional marriage automatically labelled hate groups? Calling for the kidnapping children of same sex couples isn’t hateful? Calling for homosexuality to be criminalized and homosexuals to be imprisoned isn’t hateful? And aside from that yes, opposition to SSM is hateful; there’s no other motive for it than hate. And for all the whining of the apologists about that accusation being unfair or “broad brushed”, they fail consistently to come up with a reason that doesn’t boil down to hatred. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/142 "2012-08-21T23:05:40Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Calling for the kidnapping children of same sex couples isn’t hateful? Calling for homosexuality to be criminalized and homosexuals to be imprisoned isn’t hateful? > > And aside from that yes, opposition to SSM is hateful; there’s no other motive for it than hate. And for all the whining of the apologists about that accusation being unfair or “broad brushed”, they fail consistently to come up with a reason that doesn’t boil down to hatred. Should groups that encourage all men to secretly tape their sexual encounters with women in case the women accuse them of rape be called classified as “hate groups”? Such an attitude certainly suggests a huge animosity towards women, but I’m sure you’d object to classifying such groups as hate groups. In fact, you’ve stated you think that men should do exactly that. Most reasonable people hearing your views towards women would be horrified and label them misogynistic, but you obviously don’t. Similarly, people objecting to SSM genuinely don’t believe they’re homophobes even if they hold positions that many would view as homophobic. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/143 "2012-08-21T23:22:48Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Should groups that encourage all men to secretly tape their sexual encounters with women in case the women accuse them of rape be called classified as “hate groups”? > > Such an attitude certainly suggests a huge animosity towards women, but I’m sure you’d object to classifying such groups as hate groups. > > In fact, you’ve stated you think that men should do exactly that. In response to women here saying that all men should be treated as potential rapists, and claiming that it’s unreasonable and sexist for men to be offended by that. And neither of those positions begins to approach calling for all homosexuals to be thrown in prison and their children kidnapped, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2012, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/144 "2012-08-22T00:02:33Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > In response to women here saying that all men should be treated as potential rapists, and claiming that it’s unreasonable and sexist for men to be offended by that. > > And neither of those positions begins to approach calling for all homosexuals to be thrown in prison and their children kidnapped, anyway. For starters, not a single person on this thread has suggested that it’s not hateful to call for gays to be imprisoned or their children kidnapped, so your ending commenting are exceptionally stupid and intellectually dishonest. Moreover, I think quite a few women would find your suggestion that they should be secretly taped while having sex quite hateful. Thirdly, my point was that you don’t consider such a statement hateful but common sense since, in your view, “the typical American woman” hates men, views them as monsters, and men should be afraid of them. The point is that you hold viewpoints that most reasonable people would find hateful but you don’t. In short, one can believe that same-sex marriage is wrong or that men should videotape all their sexual encounters because most women are liars out to get men and yet believe one isn’t hateful. If you disagree with me, please explain why encouraging men to secretly videotape all their sexual encounters is less offensive than objecting to the government recognizing gay marriages. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2012, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/145 "2012-08-22T00:15:21Z")
I see no reason the two of you need to take that discussion from the thread where it’s occurring and have it over here. Please drop this tangent. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2012, 9:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/146 "2012-08-22T09:40:11Z")
Back on topic, listening to Dan Savage’s latest podcast he kicks off the whole thing with a lengthy rant about the person who shot up the FRC offices, pointing out that he was among the first on Twitter to not only condemn the shooting but to say that if relevant (e.g. if he was religiously motivated) the shooter should be charged under hate crime legislation as well. Savage also lays into the FRC for claiming that the reason it’s being targetted is due to its opposition to SSM rather than some of its more unpleasant practices, but that’s for the other thread. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2012, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/147 "2012-08-22T19:55:02Z")
> [@Iggy](#): > > I think there is a valid point about how some groups with opposing views frame their opposition. > > In Torrance, California someone spray painted the words “Tastes Like Hate” on the side of a Chick-Fil-A restaurant. > > The Christian Post headline reports [Chick-fil-A ‘Tastes Like Hate’ Vandal Arrested](http://www.christianpost.com/news/chick-fil-a-tastes-like-hate-vandal-arrested-79818/). The person is described as a vandal. > > The Los Angeles Times headline reports [Gay artist arrested in Chick-fil-A ‘hate’ vandalism incident](http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/08/gay-artist-arrested-in-chick-fil-a-hate-vandalism-incident.html). The person is described as a gay artist. > > Yes, I cherry picked these examples. But I did so for a reason. The words we use end up framing a debate. And our choice of words says something about how we view the opposition. If I choose words that are dismissive or a distortion of those who oppose my viewpoint I can more easily assign viewpoints to them that they may or may not hold. Perhaps the L. A. Times declines to label the arrested person as a “vandal” because he has not yet been convicted of vandalism. Had the Christian Post described the person as a “suspected vandal,” your example might have a bit more resonance. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2012, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/148 "2012-08-22T19:57:37Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > The “hateful and bigoted” GD thread by ITR? Fair enough. My post wasn’t a moderating instruction, by the way. I was just mentioning it for your reference. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2012, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/149 "2012-08-22T20:59:11Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Perhaps the L. A. Times declines to label the arrested person as a “vandal” because he has not yet been convicted of vandalism. > > Had the Christian Post described the person as a “suspected vandal,” your example might have a bit more resonance. Excellent. ---
**Author:** ![lycopersiyum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9fc29f/32.png) [@lycopersiyum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lycopersiyum)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2012, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/150 "2012-08-23T22:27:37Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > During the height of the Tea Party movement, the stylish thing for liberals to do was wax poetic about the need for “civility” in our public discourse, particular after liberals (wrongly) implied that the Tea Party’s rhetoric and symbolism was the motivation behind the Gabby Giffords shooting Don’t expect civility from the left. Ever heard of Pyrite? ---
**Author:** ![lcdclear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47774/32.png) [@lcdclear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lcdclear)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/151 "2012-08-23T23:19:17Z")
I’m confused where exactly is the proof that Chik-fil-A president supports Hate groups?😕 ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2012, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/152 "2012-08-23T23:40:54Z")
> [@lcdclear](#): > > I’m confused where exactly is the proof that Chik-fil-A president supports Hate groups?😕 Right here in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2012, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/153 "2012-08-23T23:43:33Z")
> [@lcdclear](#): > > I’m confused where exactly is the proof that Chik-fil-A president supports Hate groups?😕 All that work for nothing. Exactly 50 posts ahead of your post is some well-cited proof, provided by a poster as charming as he is devilishly handsome. Did you forget to read the thread before responding to it? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2012, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/154 "2012-08-23T23:45:06Z")
> [@lcdclear](#): > > I’m confused where exactly is the proof that Chik-fil-A president supports Hate groups?😕 After a quick google; [this](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/shane-l-windmeyer/5-simple-facts-about-chick-fil-a_b_1751404.html) story talks about it. > [@](#): > > [ul] > [li]Chick-fil-A profits fund documented hate groups that aggressively work against LGBT people, advocating for their criminalization, psychological abuse, or death.[/li] > [li]Chick-fil-A profits support the radical-right-wing group Eagle Forum, which supports LGBT people being considered criminals.[/li] > [li]Chick-fil-A profits support Exodus International, which claims to “cure homosexuality” through psychological coercion of LGBT people. It says LGBT people are “perverse.”[/li] > [li]Chick-fil-A profits support Focus on the Family (FOF) and its off-shoot group, the Family Research Council (FRC), which has been designated as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. FOF aggressively defames LGBT people as a threat to children, and FRC spent $25,000 to stop the U.S. Congress from condemning Uganda’s anti-homosexuality bill, which calls for the execution of gay people in some cases.[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![lycopersiyum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9fc29f/32.png) [@lycopersiyum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lycopersiyum)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/155 "2012-08-24T09:00:39Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > After a quick google; [this](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/shane-l-windmeyer/5-simple-facts-about-chick-fil-a_b_1751404.html) story talks about it. A Huffington Post article? Honestly, people, if you wish to reach a broader audience, you’re going to have to start quoting a more broadly accepted source. I’m even unopposed to gay marriage/gay equal rights in general, but I see something like a Huffington Post article as no “proof” of anything other than left-wing zealotry. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/156 "2012-08-24T09:25:06Z")
> [@lycopersiyum](#): > > A Huffington Post article? Honestly, people, if you wish to reach a broader audience, you’re going to have to start quoting a more broadly accepted source. > > I’m even unopposed to gay marriage/gay equal rights in general, but I see something like a Huffington Post article as no “proof” of anything other than left-wing zealotry. Oh, please; I just grabbed the top google result since you were asking for “confirmation” of a well known fact. Let me guess; the only “cite” you would accept would be something from Fox News. You no doubt didn’t bother to look where **Left Hand of Dorkness** pointed you; [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15396336&postcount=101) is the link to the post mentioned on the off chance you actually care. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/157 "2012-08-24T09:25:21Z")
> [@lycopersiyum](#): > > A Huffington Post article? Honestly, people, if you wish to reach a broader audience, you’re going to have to start quoting a more broadly accepted source. Are they wrong about any of those facts? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/158 "2012-08-24T10:48:55Z")
> [@lycopersiyum](#): > > A Huffington Post article? Honestly, people, if you wish to reach a broader audience, you’re going to have to start quoting a more broadly accepted source. Dude, I am a broadly accepted source. Ask any broad. And post 101 contains specific quotes from a group that Chik-Fil-A supports. ---
**Author:** ![lycopersiyum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9fc29f/32.png) [@lycopersiyum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lycopersiyum)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/159 "2012-08-24T11:04:49Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Oh, please; I just grabbed the top google result since you were asking for “confirmation” of a well known fact. Is this your standard for acquiring information? > [@](#): > > Let me guess; the only “cite” you would accept would be something from Fox News. What? Where did I imply that if I don’t accept far left-wing blogs as sources of truth, I must only accept Fox News? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656/160 "2012-08-24T11:28:51Z")
> [@lycopersiyum](#): > > Is this your standard for acquiring information? When someone is asking a question about a well known fact that could be answered by just googling it if they cared to make the effort themselves, yes. > [@lycopersiyum](#): > > What? Where did I imply that if I don’t accept far left-wing blogs as sources of truth, I must only accept Fox News? When you characterized it as some “far left blog”, assumed the information mentioned was false, and apparently didn’t bother to even look at what **Left Hand of Dorkness** posted. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-no-calls-for-civility-from-liberals-in-wake-of-tastes-like-hate-anti-chick-fil-a-campaign/631656.md?page=9)