More clarification;
You don’t even have to be in the way of another vehicle. If you’re the only one on the interstate you still can be ticketed.
Strange.
OK I think that’s a little silly. Here, we’re going to give you a ticket because you’re doing the speed limit and everyone else isn’t.
I mean, go ahead and ticket drivers that are obstructing traffic. I wish they’d do that here in Florida, where Grandma can barely see over the steering wheel and has no reflexes, so she drives 30 in a 45 to compensate. But why ticket a driver for doing the speed limit? They seem to be admitting that no one really does the posted speed limit. If that’s the case, why not raise it, or eliminate speed limits altogether? One of my earlier links had a lot of evidence that speed limits that reflect the speed people actually drive, or no speed limits at all, are actually safer than artificially low speed limits.
And I get really pissed off when I’m in the left lane doing 75 in a 55 and someone starts riding my ass. Seriously, I’m doing 20 over. That’s not fast enough?
No, it’s not fast enough. I want to go 90. So get the hell out of my way, geezer.
I think a “can’t pass on right” law should take the place of the “slower traffic stay right” law. Not only will the unpredictable-ness be relieved, but it will all but eliminate PEOPLE SPEEDING… :rolleyes:
What’s this nonsense about enabling someone to violate the law? Am I guilty of “enabling” you to commit a crime just by virtue of not having prevented it? That’s absurd.
Adamantly refusing to move out of the fast lane because you’re indignant that others are speeding is just plain rude. Even if you have every right to drive in the left lane just for the hell of it (and as many have pointed out, you do not have that right in many states, and are actually breaking the law), it’s akin to just walking in people’s way on the sidewalk because you like to piss them off. And it seems pretty apparent that it’s probably safer in general if people abide by general rules of conduct which allow people to predict others’ behavior on the road.
Sure, you’re damn right that some people who want to pass you are big assholes about it, and that’s irritating. But let me ask you this: if you don’t follow the custom of keeping to the right, what method do you expect people to use to indicate that they want to pass? Most fast-lane-squatters seem to think that any request to pass whatsoever is extremely rude. My approach is generally to approach and match the slowpoke’s speed at a comfortable distance for 30 seconds or so before giving them a quick flick of the brights. And yet this still angers some people. It’s as if they’re offended at the idea that anyone could want to go faster.
I would fully support any policy changes that would get police to ticket people who don’t keep right except to pass. And that leaves the road clear for me to risk getting my own big fat ticket for speeding, which is also perfectly just.
In summary, I’d like to point out that the cons of driving in the left lane are:
[list=a]
[li]It’s rude[/li][li]It’s probably illegal where you are[/li][li]It contributes to less predictable (and therefore less safe) driving customs[/li][li]It creates traffic slowdowns[/li][/list]
and the pros are:
[list=a]
[li]“I can drive anywhere I want for no reason at all because I don’t care what anyone else thinks”[/li][/list]
I’m just not feeling the “pro” argument here…
I keep hearing this word “Rude”. Are you telling me it isn’t rude to barrel down on someone and ride up on his ass?
Is this a “Chicken or the egg” question? Meaning, a car wouldn’t have to barrel down on someone’s ass if a car wasn’t in the way, or a car’s not in the way if there isn’t another car barrelling down it’s ass. I guess it all depends on perspective.
Honestly, what’s apparent here is that driving, like politics, abortion issue, religion, has it’s left and right camps and there probably isn’t going to be a meeting of the minds.
Here’s how I, for one, look at a three lane highway with a speed limit of say, 65:
It’s a NASCAR track. Literally. I’m not talking about speed. Just maneuverability. Sure, that’s NOT was the law intends but, hey, that’s how I see it.
Do they pass on the right in NASCAR, sure. When someone’s in the way, they look for the best possible way to get around. That’s all I’m saying. Does the NASCAR driver that rides up on somes guys ass think to himself “Why doesn’t this guy get out of the my way? That sure is rude.”
Omnipresent - I think the point you keep missing/ignoring is that in the pecking order of bad driving, obstruction of traffic flow trumps speeding. Many states have laws indicating this; so to constantly harp about how you’re not breaking the law by going the speed limit is irrelevant. Obstructing traffic flow is the key violation.
Seaworthy - good stuff for the references, thanks.
I think this thread, while going a variety of places, is headed generally where I was curious:
- Is Drive Right, Pass Left understood to contribute to a lower accident/fatality rate? Apparently, based on cites from seaworthy and the Italy stat.
- Are there laws for Drive Right, Pass Left? Apparently in a lot of states.
Now - why no big campaign for awareness? I don’t get it.
As for the IMHO-related posts in this thread - inevitable, I suppose, but not the point. Both sides have a good point - going slow in the left lane is rude, and driving up someone’s butt is rude. Okay - you’re both rude. The question is: what is safest?
I agree with people who want the speed limit observed - it is there for a reason. However - sometimes (and with clear legal basis and evidence of police pullovers and tickets) it is like people are treating the speed limit as a physical law - you can’t exceed it - the universe will explode!!! Based on the cites I have seen in this thread, it seems like there needs to be a better balance between speed limits and Drive Right - Pass Left: If the flow is going faster (or slower, say, in bad weather) don’t dogmatically adhere to the posted limit and proclaim righteousness - go with the flow. And, to my mind, if you are in the fast lane and going fast, and someone is coming up fast - just get over (with obvious limits if there is a semi next to you or something). Sure they are breaking the law - but what is the rule in a robbery? Just give up your money - it is cheaper than getting shot. There may be a pride thing - but frankly - get over it. Let the speed demon pass and be done with it.
So, I guess that is how I have come to think about it - and it seems like data would support that basic approach. Which means that there is a need to re-culturize (train? educate? whatever) the American public to have a better balance between speed limits and Drive Right, Pass Left.
Anyone know of awareness campaigns in the U.S. on this topic? With gov’t backing?
Thanks!!
Tis true. To complicate things further, Illinois also has a speed limit of 55 instead of 65 for trucks plus there are strectches of interstate where trying to drive in the right lane is like trying to drive on a washboard.
That sure is a matter of opinion, don’t you think?
The campaigns said “Speed Kills” not, “Rudeness kills”.
The obvious answer to the post is; "Because it must not be that big of a problem. Exept to the “The-world-revolves-around-me” drivers, I guess.
Therefore, no campaign. 
Of course, if nobody sped in L.A., or any of our other congested metro areas, when it was clearly safe to do so, I shudder to think of the impact that would have on traffic. When the traffic flows freely, most people seem to do at least 70 or 75 even though the speed limit is 65, or sometimes even 55. If nobody broke that law, wouldn’t that reduce the “throughput” of the system, and increase congestion? If congestion becomes bad enough, it creates another kind of hazard that can lead to accidents.
But I think Omnipresent, whom I hope I never get stuck behind on a two-lane country road, is on the right track. To encourage slow drivers to keep right would encourage speeding.
Wow - you seem to be more set on trolling for angry responses than engaging in a GQ, fact-based dialogue. Too bad and kinda sad.
If it must not be that big of a problem, then why do we have FACTS - which is what I was originally asking for - that show that a Drive Right, Pass Left culture seems to result in few accidents and fatalities in Montana, Germany and Italy - or at least fewer fatalities than would be expected with higher speed limits? Again, I am NOT trying to sway the argument, I am trying to understand the FACTS.
And Spectre - your post is the whole point to my original post. You observe that folks seem to want to go 70 - that it may increase throughput; and, because even traffic flow leads to fewer accidents - may lead to safer roads - but also say that observing the speed limit should be encouraged. THAT IS THE POINT TO MY OP - what is more important - Speed limits only, or a more balanced approach for both speed limits and enforcing Drive Right, Pass Left? It seems, based on the FACTS, that a more balanced approach may be safer - which is the goal…
eeesh.
Having gone through driver re-education for having a pair of speeding tickets on surface streets, the view of the State of Illinois is that you should get over to the right if people want to pass you. It’s dangerous for you to be over there driving just the speed limit and saying “but I wasn’t speeding” won’t help you when they scrape you out of your car. Sure your survivors may get to sue the survivors of the guy who hit you, yipee. As was stated in the course, it’s the police’s job to enforce speeding and it’s your job to drive for the benifit of society, not just yourself. Driving is a priveledge, not a right. If the state thinks your doing more harm than good, they can take appropriate measures.
I think people should think about others a bit more when they’re on the road and we’d all have an easier time of it.
Hey pal…if you want to be the champion of Truth, Justice, and the American Way, fine. Get my plate number and call the cops, but do it from the friggin’ RIGHT LANE.
WordMan, I know keeprightpassleft.net isn’t government funded, but if you feel strongly about this, you can pay 3 bucks and get a bumper sticker. If you’re the first in your state to order one, it’s free. It’s too bad nobody knows about this website, there are definitely some people in America who need to check it out.
Oh, and if any of you guys that like to drive in the left lane when you’re going slower than everyone else have ever sped up so the car that’s trying to pass you couldn’t (I’ll admit, I’ve done this myself before- but not recently) some states, like North Carolina, have added new laws:
It’s too bad it’s only if a crash occurs.
Omnipresent, like I said before I’m not toooo peeved at you, but I have a serious question for you. Let’s say you’re cruising comfortable at 80 in a 70. And I’m comfortably cruising at 90 in a 70. We’re both breaking the law. We’re the only guys on the road except for one person in the right lane I’m passing on the left, and you’re ahead of me in the left lane. So the big question is: How do I know it’s you driving?
Knowing it were you, I could safely pass you on the right (no one else on the road in this hypothetical, remember, except the guy I just passed), confident that you’re going to stay in the left lane just because that’s who you are. But I don’t know who’s in the car ahead of me, and whether they’re going to do the correct thing and get out of the left lane as they see me coming up on them. There’s the danger – my passing on the right could cause me to rear end them. Yeah, it’d be my fault, but I should never have to pass on the right, and I avoid it when I can.
FWIW, I perfectly understand your contempt of the people that ride your ass in the left lane, at least if that’s their first step. I don’t think I ride anyone’s ass, and I certainly try to give them time to get the heck out of the way.
Actually, the big reason I’m not as seething as I was earlier is because you’re at least not poking along slowly in the left lane, which means you’re probably passing. I have patience for people who are passing, and am willing to slow down slightly for a little while waiting for a safe opportunity. The bigger problem are the butt-holes that stay in the left lane going slowly, which does cause dangerous behavior by right-passing and does impede traffic.
There are too many people in my area that don’t have any patience whatsoever, and they’re constantly zipping in and out of all three or four lanes, and they’re going to cause a wreck. So my wanting the left lane free isn’t just for me; it’s for the common good.
Ok, well in case no has realized, the little rule hasn’t caught on. Not everyone get’s over, and you know what, that might be a fact of life. So, guess what that means? The rule is useless. I’ve seen the almighty rule in action on my trips… it doesn’t always work, and it sometimes causes a problem, rather than helping.
By simple logic, I conclude that the rule should be thrown out and a “no passing on right” rule be enacted, making it illegal and worthy of a ticket to anyone who passes on the right (unless the person in the left was going under the speed limit, of course).
This would make your frightful situation not only unlikely, as is the case with the current rule, but it makes the unpredictable situation IMPOSSIBLE. O, and for kickers, it would physically eliminate 90% of the speeders out there, the people who are causing the REAL DANGER to us all.
Think the speed limit is too slow? Well, in addition to my new rule, throw in a higher speed limit, Uncle Sam. Say, 80mph? That would decrease overall speeding, ya know?
Ok, let me get my facts straight: Less speeding, NO, NONE, NADA unpredictable situation, we all get to our destination in a reasonable amount of time… where do I sign up?
Here’s a few links confirming the information samclem provided – namely that both Italy and Germany have higher fatality rates per km travelled than the USA. So practice really does make perfect (USAians on average travelling more many miles than their European counterpart) and the Germans are not, contrary to myth, all expert race car drivers with nerves of steel and hair trigger reflexes. I’ll never believe a BMW commercial again!
http://www.bast.de/htdocs/fachthemen/irtad/utility/p73.pdf
http://www.roadmc.com/default.asp?page=speeding_general.htm
http://195.167.162.57/library/key_findings.htm
http://www.fiafoundation.com/content/PDFs/executive%20summary.pdf
Oh, and while Italians have more cars per capita than the Americans, the Amercans have many many many more 4-wheeled vehicles per capita … yup, it’s all those SUVs! (See the last link)
Not at all. I guess this was the wrong place for debate. I guess was just trying to add two cents to the picture which asks in the op why there doesn’t seem to be a campaign against “slow” drivers that stay in the left lane.
Well, I would imagine that ALL driving gripes will be addressed with some sort of campaign over time but, the fact that this one hasn’t yet, doesn’t necessarily mean that it won’t but, just not today! Meaning that there are probably more dangerous situations to campaign against, (like drunk driving, speeding and, let’s not forget, anyone over 70)
Just being a little self-rightious is all. Sorry, it sometimes comes off as trolling for angry responses. However, my opinion counts, whether you agree with or not.
I was thinking today about this (see what this stupid SDMB does) and someone mentioned about how annoying it would be it someone was walking and someone in front of them just stopped short.
Not a good analogy. We’re not talking about a car slamming on his breaks.
A better analogy would be: Have you ever been walking and then someone from behind you kind of steps on the back of your heel and your shoe comes partially off? EVERYONE has had that happy to them. You’re the guy with the shoe partially off. What’s the first thought that comes to mind?
But, I digress. Drive on fellow drivers. It’s all good!