# Why not just blockade Japan into surrender, WWII? Resolved...it was a bad idea. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 22, 2018, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055 "2018-08-22T16:04:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![spifflog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@spifflog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spifflog)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/21 "2018-08-23T12:35:32Z")
As **septimus** alludes to above, I think the biggest positive unintended consequence of the dropping of the atomic bomb in WWII and then subsequently not using in in Korea or in Vietnam, is that it became not just another bigger bomb. It became something not to be use again. And if it hadn’t been used in WWII, it might have been used in Korea, and then who know how it’s viewed. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/22 "2018-08-23T12:50:28Z")
> [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](#): > > Wait – you think that we have an unequaled weapon, one that we have spent a huge amount of money developing (.6% of the entire war budget) – and now you think our elected leaders should decide not to use it? > Instead, pursue a slower, longer course that will result in many more deaths (on both sides)? Why would our leaders do that? > > And could they have stayed in office if they had tried to do so? > Refusing to use all the weapons at our disposal could have arguably be called ‘giving aid and comfort to the enemy’. Sigh. Did you read the OP? No ‘I’ don’t think that is the case, but you have to make that assumption to debate the question, because, you know, if we did use them then history would have been exactly what it was. Seriously, do you understand the concept of alternative history debates? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/23 "2018-08-23T12:53:28Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > As others point out, OP’s list of the disadvantages of prolonging the war overlook the on-going suffering in the still-vast Japanese-controlled territories in China and Southeast Asia. > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ > > If no A-bomb had been dropped on Japan, one would have been used against North Korea. _Seeing is believing._ I don’t believe that passive demonstrations would have been sufficient for humanity to understand with certainty these weapons’ horror. It isn’t central to the blockade. If we are going to look at all of the ramifications of not ending the war and having the US go on continuous blockade I’d question if there would BE a North Korea, as it’s quite possible that the USSR would have simply taken the entire country and put a unified puppet government in it’s place. I’m unsure if the US et al, still engaged in blockading Japan, would have been in a position to dispute that with the Russians, or would have bothered at that time and place. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/24 "2018-08-23T13:03:43Z")
Did the Japanese have a sizable army in Manchuria that could be considered a military target for a nuclear weapon? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/25 "2018-08-23T13:29:06Z")
The strike needed to be against the Japanese homeland. ‘If you don’t surrender, it’s not just your invading armies that will cease to exist. It is the Empire of Japan - including your emperor.’ Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/26 "2018-08-23T13:52:34Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Did the Japanese have a sizable army in Manchuria that could be considered a military target for a nuclear weapon? The Kwantung Army in 1945 (according to wiki) is estimated to have been around 700-725 thousand troops. However, they would not have been conveniently clustered into a small-town-sized area. IMO, dispersed troops (and ships) are poor targets for the still rare atomic bombs. Atomic bombs are _strategic_ warfare weapons. Better targets for those weapons would be major dockyards, rail centers, industrial complexes, hydroelectric dams, and so forth. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/27 "2018-08-28T05:01:10Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Like weeds. If you just mow the lawn, the weeds will all grow back. If you want to eliminate the weeds, you have to put in some real work. You’ve got to dig out the weeds, root and all, and then do it again when the next generation sprouts. And you’ve got to help the grass and flowers grow. It takes time and effort to produce a healthy lawn. That’s almost beautiful, Chauncy. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/28 "2018-08-28T12:54:20Z")
> [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](#): > > Wait – you think that we have an unequaled weapon, one that we have spent a huge amount of money developing (.6% of the entire war budget) – and now you think our elected leaders should decide not to use it? AKA the Picard option. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/29 "2018-08-28T13:59:55Z")
The author of the video also failed to mention that the Russians would have invaded if the Americans had not. Russians care less about casualties and would have employed every nasty weapon available on civilians if they felt like it. So the blockading forces would have had to sit there while Russian troops, after massive poison gas attacks and firebombing, would have taken island after island. The Russians were tough on German civilians and would have done the same to Japanese. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/30 "2018-08-28T16:32:22Z")
Even IF the U.S. blockaded instead of either invading or using atomic weapons, and even IF the Soviet Union wouldn’t go forward and invade Hokkaido after it took Salkhalin and the Kuril Islands. . . There would still be the matter of 700,000 Imperial Japanese troops in Manchuria, cut off from any kind of support from their home, and about to be overwhelmed by a bigger and better equipped Soviet force. The _absolute best_ those troops could hope for would be to be thrown in prisoner camps until a Japanese peace treaty was finally signed … 1948? 1950? Who knows. And based on the Soviet treatment of German prisoners, it wouldn’t have been pretty. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/31 "2018-08-28T16:53:36Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > The author of the video also failed to mention that the Russians would have invaded if the Americans had not. Russians care less about casualties and would have employed every nasty weapon available on civilians if they felt like it. > > So the blockading forces would have had to sit there while Russian troops, after massive poison gas attacks and firebombing, would have taken island after island. The Russians were tough on German civilians and would have done the same to Japanese. Russia had virtually no navy and no landing craft except what we gave them. No aircraft carriers or Battleships to support the landing. No, they couldn’t. wiki \*"By August 1945, the Pacific Fleet consisted of two cruisers, one destroyer leader, ten destroyers, two torpedo boats, 19 patrol boats, 78 submarines, ten minelayers, 52 minesweepers, 49 “MO” anti-submarine boats (MO stands for Малый Охотник, or “little hunter”), 204 motor torpedo boats and 1459 war planes. \* ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/32 "2018-08-28T17:13:50Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Russia had virtually no navy and no landing craft except what we gave them. No aircraft carriers or Battleships to support the landing. No, they couldn’t. Was it impossible for the Germans to invade Norway in 1940? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/33 "2018-08-28T17:18:53Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > The Russians were tough on German civilians and would have done the same to Japanese. To be fair the Russians had an axe to grind when it came to the Germans. Not so with the Japanese. They probably would not have been nice but with no score to settle they might not have been as vigorous about it. ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/34 "2018-08-28T17:24:44Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > The Kwantung Army in 1945 (according to wiki) is estimated to have been around 700-725 thousand troops. However, they would not have been conveniently clustered into a small-town-sized area. > > IMO, dispersed troops (and ships) are poor targets for the still rare atomic bombs. Atomic bombs are _strategic_ warfare weapons. Better targets for those weapons would be major dockyards, rail centers, industrial complexes, hydroelectric dams, and so forth. Let alone the fact that nuking Manchuria meant nuking territory claimed by China, America’s ally. It’s a non-starter. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/35 "2018-08-28T17:32:09Z")
If the war had been prolonged, the Soviets would have invaded with the Allies and they would have likely remained in part of Japan for decades just as they did in Eastern Europe. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/36 "2018-08-28T17:41:41Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Was it impossible for the Germans to invade Norway in 1940? Norway was taken almost by surprise and it’s army wasn’t mobilized. And of course there was Vidkun Quisling. However the Imperial Japanese forces were well prepared and experienced at defending against naval invasions. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/37 "2018-08-28T17:48:21Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Russia had virtually no navy and no landing craft except what we gave them. No aircraft carriers or Battleships to support the landing. No, they couldn’t. > > wiki \*"By August 1945, the Pacific Fleet consisted of two cruisers, one destroyer leader, ten destroyers, two torpedo boats, 19 patrol boats, 78 submarines, ten minelayers, 52 minesweepers, 49 “MO” anti-submarine boats (MO stands for Малый Охотник, or “little hunter”), 204 motor torpedo boats and 1459 war planes. > \* Sounds like plenty to back up an invading force using only fishing boats and aircraft for transport. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/38 "2018-08-28T17:49:38Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > To be fair the Russians had an axe to grind when it came to the Germans. Not so with the Japanese. They probably would not have been nice but with no score to settle they might not have been as vigorous about it. Hadn’t the Czar as well as Communist Russia lost wars to the Japanese? I recall Nicholas II calling the Japanese “Little yellow monkeys”. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/39 "2018-08-28T18:56:28Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Was it impossible for the Germans to invade Norway in 1940? With almost complete surprise against a non-militarized nation, and yet they still lost a large portion of their Navy and the lion’s share of their transport aircraft destroyed. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055/40 "2018-08-28T18:59:20Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Hadn’t the Czar as well as Communist Russia lost wars to the Japanese? I recall Nicholas II calling the Japanese “Little yellow monkeys”. The Russo-Japanese war but that was 40 years earlier and you had WWI and WWII in there where Russia fought Germany. In WWII the level of suffering inflicted by the Germans on the Russians was pretty off the charts and a heckuva lot more fresh in the Russian mind. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-not-just-blockade-japan-into-surrender-wwii-resolved-it-was-a-bad-idea/820055.md?page=3)