# Why should I care about Somalians, since their own countrymen don't? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 29, 2011, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441 "2011-08-29T01:07:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/41 "2011-08-29T18:27:46Z")
> [@downtown1441](#): > > I can’t remember the name of the book right now, but there was a very well received book which argued that giving aid anywhere in Africa is actually detrimental to future growth and development. Damn I wish I could remember the title. But yeah most of sub-Saharan African is so broken that simple aid doesn’t do much unless the entire political and educational systems are revamped. They really give corruption a bad name over there, it’s crazy. > > Although there is the “throwing one starfish at a time back into the ocean” argument… but still you could argue that there are plenty of kids elsewhere who also need help and who actually live in countries with a system set up that will really allow for advancement. [The Road to Hell: The Ravaging Effects of Foreign Aid and International Charity](http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0743227867/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0684828006&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0PX3CMASPRDYSXB911VE) ??? I read it awhile back. He admits there are well run charitable organization that truly do help those they intend too. However, he makes a compelling case for, as he put it, “Where you see Western Charity organizations, you see western employees sending western food and western equipment to accomplish western objectives.” the goal is not to help, the goal is to use the people that need to help to fund an organisation’s self interests. I recall Oxfam and the IMF particularly getting raked over the coals. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/42 "2011-08-29T20:41:45Z")
How does Somalia manage? The place looks like a desert-dry as a bone. As far as sending “aid” to them, what is the point? The place is run by warlords, who steal the food and sell it…so they can by weapons. Check out “Blackhawk Down”-any attempt to help these people usually ends disastrously. In any case, I’m all for having the “red Crescent” handle relief efforts. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/43 "2011-08-29T22:01:20Z")
> [@Snow\_Pea](#): > > Which is more humane: Them dying now, vs suffering war, starvation, rape, etc for the next 15 years, then watching their own kids starve to death in the next famine? If death is more humane than living, then is it more humane to end their suffering quickly? Isn’t a quick and painless death more humane than letting women and children agonize with starving to death over periods of weeks? Perhaps we should be giving them nooses, not food. Could you see your way to contibuting a few bucks to send some nylon rope over there? ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/44 "2011-08-29T22:31:32Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > How does Somalia manage? The place looks like a desert-dry as a bone. As far as sending “aid” to them, what is the point? The place is run by warlords, who steal the food and sell it..so they can by weapons. Check out "Blackhawk Down"any attempt to help these people usually ends disastrously. > In any case, I’m all for having the “red Crescent” handle relief efforts. Sorry, there was “The Nutty Professor” on another channel. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/45 "2011-08-29T22:55:17Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Not just Samalis. Rappers too can die and he won’t shed a tear. Gee, what do these two groups have in common? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/46 "2011-08-29T23:18:29Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Not just Samalis. Rappers too can die and he won’t shed a tear. > [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > Gee, what do these two groups have in common? > > :dubious: They’re both shorter in real life than they appear on television? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/47 "2011-08-29T23:41:41Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > Gee, what do these two groups have in common? > > :dubious: Melanin. ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2011, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/48 "2011-08-29T23:53:33Z")
According to Google, there are at least two albino rappers. ---
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/49 "2011-08-30T01:44:21Z")
> [@Snow\_Pea](#): > > Kinda like the way I feel about rappers killing other rappers, just…“meh, whatever”. Has this ever happened? A rapper killing another rapper? ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/50 "2011-08-30T08:29:18Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > Gee, what do these two groups have in common? > > :dubious: Come now, they’re both just negros killing negros, what’s there to get worked up about? It’s not like white people are dying. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/51 "2011-08-30T09:33:27Z")
> [@Snow\_Pea](#): > > They’re collecting money at work “for Somalian famine”. Why should I donate? You shouldn’t. Generally speaking the growth rate of sub-saharan africa is unsustainable. From 100 million people in 1900 to 770 million in 2005 and projected to hit 2 billion by 2050! Not sustainable and needs to be stablised. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/52 "2011-08-30T09:39:55Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > You shouldn’t. Generally speaking the growth rate of sub-saharan africa is unsustainable. From 100 million people in 1900 to 770 million in 2005 and projected to hit 2 billion by 2050! Not sustainable and needs to be stablised. And as someone who regards people of dark skin as genetically inferior naturally you think that the proper solution - a Final Solution, one might say - for their problems is mass death. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Sheikh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Sheikh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Sheikh)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/53 "2011-08-30T09:45:16Z")
> [@Snow\_Pea](#): > > Are we just helping a whole new future generation of murderous pirates survive, by stepping in and feeding them (even if the food did get through)? Because we are supposed to have already evolved from being animals to being humans. apparently some still haven’t. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/54 "2011-08-30T10:02:29Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > And as someone who regards people of dark skin as genetically inferior naturally you think that the proper solution - a Final Solution, one might say - for their problems is mass death. Keep stirring up that moral outrage **Der Trihs**! That is your one means of argument and you’re sticking with it 🙂 Certainly if the population keeps expanding to the point of 2 billion by 2050 you are likely to see mass death as you put it, through starvation and war. ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/55 "2011-08-30T10:05:48Z")
> [@The\_Sheikh](#): > > Because we are supposed to have already evolved from being animals to being humans. apparently some still haven’t. Don’t feed the animals. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/56 "2011-08-30T10:08:09Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Keep stirring up that moral outrage **Der Trihs**! That is your one means of argument and you’re sticking with it 🙂 Oh, your racist nonsense has done an excellent job of stirring up moral outrage with no help from me. > [@Chen019](#): > > Certainly if the population keeps expanding to the point of 2 billion by 2050 you are likely to see mass death as you put it, through starvation and war. And there’s a classic; naturally, nothing will change between now and then, they’ll grow without limit and the brown hordes will overwhelm the world and the pure Aryan Race will be destroyed. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/57 "2011-08-30T10:13:50Z")
> [@The\_Sheikh](#): > > Because we are supposed to have already evolved from being animals to being humans. apparently some still haven’t. Wrong. Humans are animals. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/58 "2011-08-30T10:17:40Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Wrong. Humans are animals. You know quite well that **The Sheikh** was speaking in the moral sense of “not an animal”, not the biological one. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/59 "2011-08-30T10:25:55Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > You know quite well that **The Sheikh** was speaking in the moral sense of “not an animal”, not the biological one. True, although as I suggest above - the moral approach would be to supply free contraceptive injections to stabilize those populations to prevent further starvation. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2011, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441/60 "2011-08-30T10:39:42Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > True, although as I suggest above - the moral approach would be to supply free contraceptive injections to stabilize those populations to prevent further starvation. No, your suggestion was to cut off aid. You didn’t say a word about supplying anything whatsoever. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-care-about-somalians-since-their-own-countrymen-dont/594441.md?page=4)