# Why should I ever listen to another woman tell me men need "advice" on oral sex? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 14, 2003, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766 "2003-06-14T06:02:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Muad\_Dib](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/35a633/32.png) [@Muad\_Dib](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muad_Dib)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/41 "2003-06-16T00:01:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dragonblink \* > \*\*Me, I ain’t Linda Lovelace, but I did research on the internet (where else) to improve my technique. \*\* [hijack] Isn’t that just great about the Internet? 15 years ago, where could you have gone to get _real_ information like that outside of fake porn? Not just sex stuff, I am always amazed by what a great convience the Internet is when I go to “look something up”. Where else could I have searched for this stuff? [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/42 "2003-06-16T01:07:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lizard \* > \*\*Well, just make sure you warn him ahead of time, whoever he is. \*\* Was that necessary? I’m getting the strong impression here that some people would do better with a blow up doll or with a paid professional than they would manage to do with a partner. Some of us care about the person we are with as opposed to the skills of the person. Lizard you sound like you are more obsessed with the sucking skills of a girlfriend than anything else. Sex is not the be-all and end-all of a relationship. ---
**Author:** ![Lizard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@Lizard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lizard)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/43 "2003-06-16T04:02:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Primaflora \* > \*\*Was that necessary? I’m getting the strong impression here that some people would do better with a blow up doll or with a paid professional than they would manage to do with a partner. > \*\* How ironic, since some blow-up dolls and probably _all_ professionals could do a better job than most women I’ve known. At least professionals have to put effort into it, instead of just expecting the man to get both of you off. \*\* > [@](#): > > Some of us care about the person we are with as opposed to the skills of the person. Lizard you sound like you are more obsessed with the sucking skills of a girlfriend than anything else. Sex is not the be-all and end-all of a relationship. \*\* Spare me your emotional, self-rightous b.s. Your assessment in no way matches what I have actually said in this thread. This thread is not and never was about how good or bad women are at oral, but about how good/bad they _say_ men are. And my main point (which no one has produced a compelling counter-argument for, in fact, quite the opposite) was that we have to put up with a hell of a lot more criticism over something a which we are no less skilled at performing than women are. And if you think I’m so terribly “sex obsessed,” maybe you should check out THIS thread. ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/44 "2003-06-16T05:40:05Z")
Lizard, I don’t know why you think that women don’t have pressure in bed to be intuitive wonderful partners or that only men get negative feedback. The whole thrust (bwahaha!) of your argument is skewed in my opinion. I think it’s true for both sexes that there is pressure to be good at sex acts. I find it sad that you say that a blow up doll or a professional would be better at sex than most of the women you have slept with. Maybe if you start only sleeping with women you truly care about in a romantic sense, things might improve? ---
**Author:** ![SnoopyFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d07c76/32.png) [@SnoopyFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnoopyFan)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/45 "2003-06-16T06:22:49Z")
**And I agree with Lizard that the majority of women do not give even a half-decent blowjob.** I’m reminded of a Chris Rock routine about women and blowjobs … Three types … Type A doesn’t do it. Type B licks it just enough to shut you up. Type C is obsessed. “Where’s that dick?!” ---
**Author:** ![Lizard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@Lizard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lizard)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/46 "2003-06-16T08:00:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Primaflora \* > \*\*Lizard, I don’t know why you think that women don’t have pressure in bed to be intuitive wonderful partners or that only men get negative feedback. The whole thrust (bwahaha!) of your argument is skewed in my opinion. I think it’s true for both sexes that there is pressure to be good at sex acts. \*\* I don’t believe I said there was zero pressure on women, but IMO the pressure is much less. Not only do men put less pressure on them, but they put less pressure on _themselves._ For all the guys I am personally familiar with (admittedly a smallish sample) the situation is reversed. And in other threads I have included the caveat that I was referring to women in the _United States._ Sorry, but I forgot to do that here. I see you are posting from Australia. May I assume you are a native of that place? If so, your experiences might vary. From what I have both heard from friends who are also international travellers and witnessed firsthand in my own travels, American women are pretty pampered socially compared to their foreign counterparts. Nothing I am saying might apply to the citizens of your country. \*\* > [@](#): > > I find it sad that you say that a blow up doll or a professional would be better at sex than most of the women you have slept with. Maybe if you start only sleeping with women you truly care about in a romantic sense, things might improve? \*\* Stop it, I’m getting misty. But seriously, how could you expect me to hew to that? You are not the first woman to suggest this, and I think there’s a good reason no man has. How many women am I supposed to date before I find one I truly “care about” enough to sleep with? Dating anyone, whether I care about them or not, takes time, energy, and money, none of which I possess in infininte supply. Therefore, I can either have sex occasionally with women I don’t care much about, or I can have multi-year dry spells. Which do you think I (or any man) might prefer? Of course, it’s reasonable to question my logic, given how bad I’ve said much of my sex life is. But I’m not convinced yet (at least not completely) that some “emotional” component was entirely to blame. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/47 "2003-06-16T08:17:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lizard \* > \*\* > Given that, and given how few _really good_ blowjobs I have ever received, I am heretofore swearing off ever listening to any advice/comments/passing remarks/“interesting” stories about the supposed lack of skill men have at orally pleasuring women. Since women apparently know so little about their _own_ plumbing, how can they criticize my gender with a straight face? I might make an exception for any woman I am in a relationship with, but then again, maybe not. \*\* Well, I’ve had a lot of straight women ask for indepth blow job technique description so they could improve their technique. That’s a few dozen women less who give bad head. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Pixelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ad7895/32.png) [@Pixelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pixelle)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/48 "2003-06-16T12:25:32Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Lizard \* > \*\* Dating anyone, whether I care about them or not, takes time, energy, and money, none of which I possess in infininte supply. Therefore, I can either have sex occasionally with women I don’t care much about, or I can have multi-year dry spells. Which do you think I (or any man) might prefer?_\* I guess a lot of guys are going to take the first option, but if you do that, you have to accept that the sex is more often than not going to be of a much poorer quality. There’s every chance that you wont get the sort of blow jobs you want. But you can’t really whinge about that if you’re not willing to put effort into dating to find a woman that suits you. And thats all it sounds like to me, you just haven’t met the right sort of woman. ---
**Author:** ![tanookie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/48db29/32.png) [@tanookie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanookie)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/49 "2003-06-16T12:43:06Z")
This thread makes me glad I’m not dating anymore and that my husband shares my values about sex. I understand sex is an important part of a relationship but hardly the most important part. Oh and I feel plenty of pressure (all from myself) to please my spouse. Lizard, what would you do if you entered into a marriage where things were wonderful and you found your sexual goddess and something happened to her to make sex impossible? Would you just divorce her and walk away? It sounds like Lizard has yet to have a good relationship and this has left him bitter. Also if dating anyone, whether you care about them or not, takes so much of your resources… why not only date people you’re truly interested in and could care about? If the sex is so bad that a blow up doll would be preferable… just stay home and masturbate. Why waste your time and hers? ---
**Author:** ![isthatsowrong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/35a633/32.png) [@isthatsowrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/isthatsowrong)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/50 "2003-06-16T12:48:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lizard \* > **How ironic, since some blow-up dolls and probably _all_ professionals could do a better job than most women I’ve known. At least professionals have to put effort into it, instead of just expecting the man to get both of you off.** You can get a lackluster blowjob from a hooker. In my experience, hookers are not very different from non-hookers. Some enjoy giving head and do a wonderful job. Others want nothing to do with it and take your money and leave you unsatisfied. Best blowjob I ever got from a hooker: She would deepthroat me and stay there while she licked my scrotum. She would work on me for 15 or 20 minutes and never use her hand. She would ask me to thrust in and out of her throat. She licked and sucked every part of my penis. By the end, I was so satisfied that I felt like I never needed to come again. Of course, five minutes later I wanted another one. Worst blowjob I ever got from a hooker: She opened her mouth in the general vicinity of my penis and told me to jerk off. I insisted that she actually earn her money. A few perfunctory licks later, I told her to stop. She kept the money of course. I got as many bad blowjobs as I got good ones. Going to a professional is no guarantee. ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/51 "2003-06-16T12:53:22Z")
No one has ever told me I give bad head. Then again, I don’t know a woman ANYWHERE who anyone has told gives bad head. We keep hearing things like, “Any head is good head!” Obviously, it’s not. Thing is, when you’ve finished sucking a guy off (or sucking him at all, really) it’s not as if any of them are going to say, “Well, you got off to a good start, but you were rough on the throughway and your dismount was atrocious.” How the hell are we **supposed** to know we’re bad at it? Also, there’s that “every guy is different” thing. What made one guy’s eyes roll back in his head and forced from his lips words about Gods, Demons, and Peoria may make another one look down at you quizically and say, "Exactly… **WHAT** …are you doing down there? Feedback, people - feedback. More men have to tell women what they’re doing wrong, and more women have to get over their Little Oral Egos and listen. Also, the “give me head or you get no cunnilingus” won’t work on those of us for whom cunnilingus is an “…eh.” Oh yeah - and several guys have told me that with their special tongue yoga techniques learned on the wild Serengeti and honed with Tibetan Monks (or their female friends) they are the assorted Gods’ Gift to female genetalia. They were wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Geobabe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/geobabe/32/3908_2.png) [@Geobabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Geobabe)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/52 "2003-06-16T13:07:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hamadryad \* > \*\*Oh yeah - and several guys have told me that with their special tongue yoga techniques learned on the wild Serengeti and honed with Tibetan Monks (or their female friends) they are the assorted Gods’ Gift to female genetalia. They were wrong. \*\* Ditto. This thing is hardly confined to one gender. ---
**Author:** ![Lizard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@Lizard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lizard)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2003, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/53 "2003-06-16T15:51:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by tanookie \* > **Lizard, what would you do if you entered into a marriage where things were wonderful and you found your sexual goddess and something happened to her to make sex impossible? Would you just divorce her and walk away?** Of course not. I thought I was pretty clear in saying I think things are different when you love someone. Beyond that, I can’t say what I’d do. \*\* > [@](#): > > It sounds like Lizard has yet to have a good relationship and this has left him bitter. \*\* Yup. I won’t deny the obvious. \*\* > [@](#): > > If the sex is so bad that a blow up doll would be preferable… just stay home and masturbate. Why waste your time and hers? \*\* You have encapsulated my current position precisely. ---
**Author:** ![Omorka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/50afbb/32.png) [@Omorka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omorka)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766/54 "2003-06-17T06:28:55Z")
I was going through one of my sex manuals earlier today (yeah, yeah, I know - but that and _Xxxenophile_ are my fantasy fodder). One of the chapters opened with a quote from an article in a women’s magazine; one of the readers had asked a question about French kissing (oh, wait, is that called Freedom kissing now? :rolleyes: ), and the response was, in essence, “Close your eyes, open your lips a little, and then let him do it to you. If you do anything back to him, you’ll just make him uncomfortable.” Of course, the manual had quoted the advice in order to debunk it, but what I took away from it was that most women are _taught_ in USian culture, even in these post-postmodern times, that sex is largely something done to them, rather than something they are supposed to be an equal partner in. In some ways, my extreme naivete at age 16 may have been a blessing in disguise - I had no clue what I was doing, but I didn’t start out with bad habits, either. And my first two sexual partners were sufficiently different to teach me that what one person wants may not resemble the next at all. (In particular, one liked lots of testicle play and the other could barely stand to be touched there.) I shudder to think what a girl whose sexual education consisted of _Seventeen_ and _Cosmo_ would have to suffer through to learn that. So, here’s my disclaimer: with any given person, my first round of sex (oral or otherwise) is likely to be fumbling and awkward, a proper comedy of errors. However, it is likely to improve from there, especially if you are willing to tell me what you want (I will return the favor). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-i-ever-listen-to-another-woman-tell-me-men-need-advice-on-oral-sex/181766.md?page=2)