# Why should "In God We Trust" be on our currency? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 2, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633 "2013-04-02T16:07:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/61 "2013-04-02T17:37:13Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Is that how civil rights work now? Wait - are we finished talking about the national motto and you wish to begin a new discussion having to do with some aspect of civil rights? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/62 "2013-04-02T17:38:58Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Well, feel free to provide those cites. I’ve lived in this country over 50 years and can’t say I’ve ever detected this vast dislike or persecution. :rolleyes: Seriously? This is hardly obscure, it’s been discussed a fair number of times right here on the SDMB. [This](http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=1786422&page=1) study comes up a lot, for example. > [@TriPolar](#): > > Atheists, who are arrogant. Because they refuse to either convert or kill themselves, the way Christians would prefer. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > I think the animosity of US Christians toward Muslims is probably an order of magnitude greater than that of Christians toward atheists. No, it’s greater towards atheists last time I saw a poll. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/63 "2013-04-02T17:42:32Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs;16155888 Because they refuse to either convert or kill themselves, the way Christians would prefer. [/QUOTE] The Christians who refuse to stop believing in God the way Atheists would prefer? I’m sure you can make better arguments than this. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/64 "2013-04-02T17:47:48Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > :rolleyes: Seriously? This is hardly obscure, it’s been discussed a fair number of times right here on the SDMB. [This](http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=1786422&page=1) study comes up a lot, for example. Lookee there-the poll says that 33.5% of Americans wouldn’t want their children to marry a Muslim, but 47.6% of Americans wouldn’t want their children to marry an atheist. Please note that this poll was done in 2006, and I believe that attitudes against Muslims weren’t exactly high back then. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/65 "2013-04-02T17:49:06Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Nonsense. All the polls show atheists as being one of the most disliked categories in the country. Compared to different religions, perhaps – not true as an absolute statement. That is, I am certain atheists are viewed more fondly than arsonists or mimes. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/66 "2013-04-02T17:50:31Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > The Christians who refuse to stop believing in God the way Atheists would prefer? > > I’m sure you can make better arguments than this. Considering that that’s pretty much the opposite of what I said, of course. > [@Bricker](#): > > Compared to different religions, perhaps – not true as an absolute statement. That is, I am certain atheists are viewed more fondly than arsonists or mimes. Hardly. Perhaps better than child molesters, at best. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/67 "2013-04-02T17:51:58Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Compared to different religions, perhaps – not true as an absolute statement. That is, I am certain atheists are viewed more fondly than arsonists or mimes. And I’m sure the KKK didn’t hate African-Americans as much as they hated drinking lye. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/68 "2013-04-02T17:59:18Z")
I always thought it was funny to have a religious motto on money, since that Jesus guy told us we didn’t need it. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/69 "2013-04-02T17:59:38Z")
Well, we atheists might be despised less than lawyers are, I grant \*\*Bricker \*\*that. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/70 "2013-04-02T18:04:10Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Wait - are we finished talking about the national motto and you wish to begin a new discussion having to do with some aspect of civil rights? I think there’s a basic disconnect between the language **Czarcasm** and those like him use and ours. When they use the phrase “civil rights”, they’re not thinking about trial by jury, freedom of speech, right to vote, or anything else that’s actually in the Constitution. Instead they’re thinking about their own right to brush aside democracy and declare that the government can’t write words on its own money, and other similar “civil rights” that they’ve granted to themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/71 "2013-04-02T18:12:05Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Still, the phrase has been around for a while, and I am pretty sure it was on our currency far before the 1950’s. That does not mean the adoption as the official motto was not motivated by the Cold War. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/72 "2013-04-02T18:21:23Z")
There are two ways it could be removed: 1. Vote it off; and 2. Convince a court that its use is unconstitutional. Neither seem likely in the near future, though method #2 is somewhat more likely - convince your highest court that it was wrong about “ceremonial deism” and that the use of the phrase infringes the seperation of church and state, and you are golden. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/73 "2013-04-02T18:24:48Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > I think there’s a basic disconnect between the language **Czarcasm** and those like him use and ours. When they use the phrase “civil rights”, they’re not thinking about trial by jury, freedom of speech, right to vote, or anything else that’s actually in the Constitution. Instead they’re thinking about their own right to brush aside democracy and declare that the government can’t write words on its own money, and other similar “civil rights” that they’ve granted to themselves. Well, this is in the Constitution: > [@](#): > > Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion Placing a religious statement upon currency surely qualifies, at least under the “separation” interpretation of the Establishment Clause. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/74 "2013-04-02T18:27:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Because removing it would violate 31 U.S.C. §§ 5112(d)(1) and 5114(b). Well, duh. Obviously I’m talking about _changing_ the law so that it wasn’t required. “I think the speed limit should be changed from 65 mph to 70 mph.” “You can’t because the law says it’s supposed to be 65!” > [@Bricker](#): > > As a national motto, the phrase has “spiritual and psychological value” as well as an “inspirational quality.” It being valuable as is, I see no reason to change it. Please elaborate on this. What did “In God We Trust” do for our country that “E pluribus unum” couldn’t have done just as well? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/75 "2013-04-02T18:32:21Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What did “In God We Trust” do for our country that “E pluribus unum” couldn’t have done just as well? Shoot, done better. E pluribus unum _means_ something concrete about our nation, referring to both a federal union of states, and the concept of democracy. It’s a statement of principles. In God We Trust means…we’re fond of God. It fails as statement of principles by virtue of being vague, and by violating another dearly-held principle, the separation of church and state. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/76 "2013-04-02T18:34:01Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] Seriously? This is hardly obscure, it’s been discussed a fair number of times right here on the SDMB. This study comes up a lot, for example. [/QUOTE] I’m sorry, but your cite is far from conclusive, even if I’m to assume it’s still relevant…2006 was 7 years ago after all and attitudes change. But leaving that aside, and even assuming that this poll is accurate and accurately represents how Americans feel (which, frankly, I’m skeptical of without a series of polls), what this actually says is that people wouldn’t want their kid to marry an atheist (47.6%) and that atheists ‘did not share their vision of American society’ (whatever that actually means), 39.5%. I’m, of course, aware that this has come up many times on this board, since I’ve participated in several of those debates, and I’m well aware of YOUR particular view on it as well, for similar reasons. Frankly, I find it laughable that many atheists feel persecuted by the vast majority of theists among us, and that they feel threatened by things like having ‘In God We Trust’ on the currency. In my experience, no one really cares if you are an atheist as long as you aren’t attempting to throw it in their faces and belittle them for being theists. Sadly, it seems that many of my fellow agnostics/atheists can’t resist poking at the theists and putting them down…which undoubtedly has a lot to do with poll results such as those you linked too. I’m sure that trying to get ‘In God We Trust’ off the currency is going to do wonders for that image as well. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/77 "2013-04-02T18:37:55Z")
Atheist checking in. I don’t give 2 shits if it’s on the currency or not. I understand that we have a history of being a fairly religious people, and we’re simply not going to erect that legendary “wall of separation”. And I’m not even sure if that wall was meant to separate the government from a vague sense of spirituality or from organized religion, although I suspect the latter. I have somewhat stronger feelings about “under God” in the pledge since there are so many instances when a person finds himself being asked to recite it over his lifetime. If we’re going to have a pledge (which I don’t really want anyway), it should not include references to a deity that many of us don’t believe in. Still, on the list of things that need changing, this is pretty far down there-- definitely below the need to change the “carried interest” tax advantage that hedge fund managers get. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/78 "2013-04-02T18:45:24Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Hardly. Perhaps better than child molesters, at best. To the proponent belongs the burden. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/79 "2013-04-02T18:47:19Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Well, we atheists might be despised less than lawyers are, I grant \*\*Bricker \*\*that. Lawyers are quite a despised group… and, all joking aside, I suspect would be more reviled in survey answers than atheists. This despite the fact that no one ever finds themselves falsely accused of a crime and says, “Quick, what’s the number of a good atheist?” ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633/80 "2013-04-02T18:48:58Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > I think there’s a basic disconnect between the language **Czarcasm** and those like him use and ours. When they use the phrase “civil rights”, they’re not thinking about trial by jury, freedom of speech, right to vote, or anything else that’s actually in the Constitution. Instead they’re thinking about their own right to brush aside democracy and declare that the government can’t write words on its own money, and other similar “civil rights” that they’ve granted to themselves. Ooooh! Made-up language. I see. Yes, then I guess I’d need some sort of translation between Czarcasese and real English before answering that question. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-should-in-god-we-trust-be-on-our-currency/654633.md?page=5)