# Why so many homeless in Los Angeles and California in general? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 3, 2018, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967 "2018-03-03T16:04:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/21 "2018-03-04T11:37:46Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > [https://www.opkansas.org/wp-content/uploads/Con-Plan-Final-APPROVED-by-HUD.pdf](https://www.opkansas.org/wp-content/uploads/Con-Plan-Final-APPROVED-by-HUD.pdf) > > You could check out this PDF on homeless/near homeless put out by your own city.The main reason you see no/few homeless in Overland Park seems to be that you move them outside the city limits to other cities. I guess that’s a kind of solution. Your right in that most of the areas homeless shelters are over on the Missouri side. Housing is cheaper there. I have volunteered down at City Union Mission a couple of times. But we do have section 8 housing here in Overland Park. Now what I am told is if a family shows up at say the police station and says they are homeless they refer them to one of the local agencies like the Salvation Army which operates shelters. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/22 "2018-03-04T11:44:47Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > OP, you really have no idea how many homeless people you have seen. You know how many people you’ve seen sleeping in their cars or on park benches or on the sidewalk but if you passed the people described in this [article](https://nypost.com/2015/09/22/de-blasio-vows-to-put-a-roof-over-homeless-city-workers-heads/)on the street, you wouldn’t have a clue that they were homeless. Nor would you know that someone who spends a week or two on one person’s couch and then moves on to the next person’s couch is homeless. There’s a certain subgroup of homeless people who prefer the street to a shelter (that group generally doesn’t have friends or relatives they can stay with) and they do tend to flock to warmer places, but that’s a small part of the homeless population. Well frankly if a person is sleeping on someones couch then , no, I dont count them as homeless. And yes, we do have a couple of those wandering our streets. They are not hurting nobody so they are left alone. Now living in your car, thats a different story. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/23 "2018-03-04T13:31:51Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Yes, I can see weather being a major component. > > I’m surprised though here in Kansas City we dont get more homeless during the summer. What are you saying? That homeless people might “move” to Kansas City in the summer while the weather is nice, then move away again in the winter, as though their time in Kansas City was a vacation of sorts? Is this what surprises you? ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/24 "2018-03-04T21:25:49Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well frankly if a person is sleeping on someones couch then , no, I dont count them as homeless. Curious about this. I mean, they don’t have a home of their own. Is it different if it’s a family of four squeezed into a friend’s spare room? I reckon there are plenty of homeless people around you and you’re not seeing them or somehow, as in the example above, they don’t count as homeless to you. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/25 "2018-03-04T21:48:05Z")
> [@lorene](#): > > Curious about this. I mean, they don’t have a home of their own. Is it different if it’s a family of four squeezed into a friend’s spare room? > > I reckon there are plenty of homeless people around you and you’re not seeing them or somehow, as in the example above, they don’t count as homeless to you. Well then lets admit its a kind of gray area. I mean they have a warm, dry place to sleep. Access to food, toilets, and showers. That to me would be paradise compared to sleeping in a cardboard box on the street. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/26 "2018-03-04T22:10:49Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well then lets admit its a kind of gray area. > > I mean they have a warm, dry place to sleep. Access to food, toilets, and showers. That to me would be paradise compared to sleeping in a cardboard box on the street. So homeless people in homeless shelters aren’t homeless? ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/27 "2018-03-04T22:17:40Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well then lets admit its a kind of gray area. > I mean they have a warm, dry place to sleep. Access to food, toilets, and showers. So do the people in homeless shelters. That doesn’t make them not homeless, does it ? Someone earlier said that only 5% of the homeless in NY are unsheltered. That means the other 95% have a warm, dry place to sleep and access to food,toilets and showers. What they don’t have is a stable place to live, and that’s what makes them homeless. That’s what I meant earlier about you have no idea how many homeless people you’ve seen - you’re defining “homeless people” as only including those you see sleeping in a cardboard box on the street. ---
**Author:** ![drewder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@drewder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewder)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/28 "2018-03-05T01:06:32Z")
In utah the chronic homeless are given homes, turns out to be cheaper than keeping them on the streets. So no doubt the answer is that Californians hate homeless people and so instead of housing them would rather pay more to punish them. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/29 "2018-03-05T01:39:06Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > In utah the chronic homeless are given homes, turns out to be cheaper than keeping them on the streets. So no doubt the answer is that Californians hate homeless people and so instead of housing them would rather pay more to punish them. > > Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Chronic homeless being given homes doesn’t match what I’ve seen in Salt Lake City. There’s a ton of obviously homeless people there. More than I’ve seen anywhere else. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/30 "2018-03-05T05:16:10Z")
California has the highest poverty rate of any state, when [adjusting](http://www.politifact.com/california/statements/2017/jan/20/chad-mayes/true-california-has-nations-highest-poverty-rate-w/) for the cost of living. Cost of living in this context basically means housing costs, hence a lot of homeless people. In southern California at least, proximity to Mexico means an extra [segment](https://www.kqed.org/news/11100554/immigrants-a-largely-hidden-segment-of-l-a-s-homeless-population) of the homeless population due to undocumented immigration. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/31 "2018-03-05T09:58:37Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Chronic homeless being given homes doesn’t match what I’ve seen in Salt Lake City. There’s a ton of obviously homeless people there. More than I’ve seen anywhere else. Yeah and plus even if homeless are given free home there is still a large segment of them which are going to prefer living on the street. Even some European countries vaunted for their progressive homeless policies and generous safety nets still wind up with a considerable number of homeless people that just aren’t reported on. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/32 "2018-03-05T12:17:17Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > So do the people in homeless shelters. That doesn’t make them not homeless, does it ? Someone earlier said that only 5% of the homeless in NY are unsheltered. That means the other 95% have a warm, dry place to sleep and access to food,toilets and showers. What they don’t have is a stable place to live, and that’s what makes them homeless. > > That’s what I meant earlier about you have no idea how many homeless people you’ve seen - you’re defining “homeless people” as only including those you see sleeping in a cardboard box on the street. I admit I dont understand how to fully analyze and evaluate the issue. I, like most people, only see what we see and we see people sleeping on the streets and call them “homeless”. However you are absolutely right that persons living in a homeless shelter are still technically “homeless”. I guess I am like most people if I dont “see” a problem I dont think their is one. But then it shows the system is working in that “homeless” people are not freezing on the streets and are getting aid. I dont know. Is there a term for a “homeless” person who is receiving aid and has a “home” like a shelter? This makes it difficult to actually count the number of people who are homeless. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/33 "2018-03-05T12:24:28Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > Yeah and plus even if homeless are given free home there is still a large segment of them which are going to prefer living on the street. Even some European countries vaunted for their progressive homeless policies and generous safety nets still wind up with a considerable number of homeless people that just aren’t reported on. When we were visiting Hawaii (Maui) we stayed at this hostel and their was this man staying there, I’m guessing he was in his 40’s, who would be technically “homeless”. However, he has a pretty good life. He did odd jobs in the community for extra money, food, or a place to stay. Including house sitting some big mansions. Imagine that. One night your sleeping in a beachfront mansion, the next he is back sleeping on a cot at the hostel. But, he says life is good. If he gets sick he says he goes to the clinic. He picks up enough money from odd jobs to afford a car. If he really needs money he makes a sculpture out of leaves and sells it to a tourist. Also he told me his brother, a fancy lawyer from New York city, recently visited him and he said NO WAY would he want his brothers rat race lifestyle. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/34 "2018-03-05T13:15:22Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > In utah the chronic homeless are given homes, turns out to be cheaper than keeping them on the streets. Well, not exactly. The reduction in homelessness seems to be, in large part, the [way they count homelessness](https://www.huffingtonpost.com/kevin-corinth/think-utah-solved-homeles_b_9380860.html). Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/35 "2018-03-05T13:27:59Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > There are a good number of Californians who are homeless by choice; they just camp out on the beach all year. That good number is 10%, according to the most recent studies, I believe. Another 10% are homeless because of mental illness/drug addiction. The remaining 80% are people–often families–who cycle in and out of homelessness at varying rates. Housing costs play a big role in Los Angeles. CF the [case of Nadia, who fled with her children from an abusive marriage and ended up homeless](http://www.latimes.com/opinion/editorials/la-ed-economically-homeless-20180226-htmlstory.html). ---
**Author:** ![JackieLikesVariety](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackielikesvariety/32/296_2.png) [@JackieLikesVariety](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JackieLikesVariety)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/36 "2018-03-05T15:13:24Z")
> [@](#): > > If he gets sick he says he goes to the clinic. so, not having any health insurance turns out to be no problem. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/37 "2018-03-05T15:25:15Z")
Also note that lots of other states like to dump homeless onto CA via the standard tactic of Greyhound Therapy. Suburbs do the same thing onto the nearest city. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/38 "2018-03-05T16:19:50Z")
> [@JackieLikesVariety](#): > > so, not having any health insurance turns out to be no problem. :dubious: Not in Maui. But then most major cities have free health clinics. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/39 "2018-03-05T17:30:47Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > In utah the chronic homeless are given homes, turns out to be cheaper than keeping them on the streets. So no doubt the answer is that Californians hate homeless people and so instead of housing them would rather pay more to punish them. It’s not personal: Californians are strongly opposed to building housing for any reason. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2018, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967/40 "2018-03-05T18:08:03Z")
It seems to me there are three types of homelessness. One is where you don’t own or rent a place to live, and have to stay with friends or family. The next is when you don’t have friends or family to stay with and instead have to stay in a shelter. The next is sleeping in the streets. It’s the last population that’s the real problem. Sure it’s not cool to have to sleep on your buddy’s couch for a few months while you’re looking for a job. It’s even less cool to be destitute and not have anyone you can turn to and end up in a shelter or church basement or whatever. But to not even have that option is an even worse problem. Every day on my way to work I have to walk past people sleeping on the streets. If they’re lucky they have a tent. So why aren’t these guys sleeping on their brother’s couch? Because they’ve used up their friends and families. For the temporarily homeless who can stay with friends or family the problem is economic. For the people sleeping on the streets the problem is mental illness, addiction, mental illness compounded by addiction, and addiction compounded by mental illness. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-so-many-homeless-in-los-angeles-and-california-in-general/809967.md?page=3)