# Why the American desire for happy endings?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [June 8, 2011, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725 "2011-06-08T11:39:02Z")
**Posts on this page:** 17
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/41 "2011-06-08T17:15:13Z")
> [@Knorf](#):
>
> But I find it interesting that pampered Americans–in a very wealthy society where every need is taken care of in abundance for almost everyone–are the most disinclined to enjoy tragedies with whines of “life is depressing enough.” Whereas, in Shakespeare’s day (for example), during which I time I think it would be very hard to argue that life wasn’t a great deal shittier than it is now, tragedies were widely enjoyed.
The reason Shakespeare’s tragedies were so popular was because the tragedies happened to the elite and ruling class and the plays were shown to the general public. It’s like reading the Enquirer or watching Real Housewives.
“oh boo hoo. Some stupid Danish prick’s life is sooooo terrible. All he can do is whinge about his life of luxury. You want tragedy? It’s me determining if next year’s rain will get me the crops I need to feed my family or whether they die of influenza, not whether my mom’s boinking my uncle. Man, I hope they kill every one of these stupid SOBs in this play.”
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### Author:  [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/42 "2011-06-08T17:32:13Z")
> [@minlokwat](#):
>
> I would have to postulate that the filmmakers decided American audiences wouldn’t understand the psychological nuances of the protaginist’s struggle, couldn’t have evil triumphing over good, and had to have a more proper resolution to the conflict.
I suspect that the perception of what a movie-watching experience is, may be very different between Europe and the US, and the endings reflect that.
I really doubt it came down to a “Europeans = sophisticated and nuanced, Americans = simple and stupid” decision.
I think the thought process went more like this:
“Hmm… Americans go to the movies on Friday nights for entertainment. They’re going to be irritated (and rightly so) if they go to the movies with their girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/etc… buy cokes and popcorn, and see the protagonist get buried alive and the bad guy win.”
Having evil win just doesn’t play well with cokes and popcorn and a date on Friday nights or Saturday matinees.
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### Author:  [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/43 "2011-06-08T17:51:13Z")
Don’t Europeans mostly watch American movies these days?
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### Author:  [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/44 "2011-06-08T17:56:35Z")
> [@Disposable Hero](#):
>
> There are many examples of movies or books with their endings changed or reworked for an American audience to make them more upbeat
> [@newcomer](#):
>
> I think it’s because American film is totally market oriented packaged product and in order to generate profit film needs to be seen by majority of the movie going audience. As opposed to say, European films that rely on elaborate funding schemes based on taxpayer money.
I think **newcomer** (and **jjimm** previously) nailed the main point here. AFAICT, the only practical reason to distribute a non-American film (or produce an American remake of a non-American film) in America, with its huge movie audience potential, is to make as much money as possible.
And if that’s your goal, you might as well go to the extra trouble of tweaking the last fifteen minutes or so of the film to maximize its appeal to the greatest number of potential American audience members and get more butts in theater seats.
I suspect (on the basis of zero actual evidentiary data, mind you) that if European filmmakers typically tried out their films on the same sort of mass-consumption test audiences that the American movie industry relies on so heavily, they would find a similar popular preference in their own cultures for happy endings. But they seem to have a little more latitude within their film industries in controlling the trade-offs between creative vision (or artistic merit, or whatever you want to call the basic concept behind the attitude “this choice may not be as popular with audiences but I think it makes the movie better”) and commercial marketability.
But if the filmmakers are then going to go to the trouble of trying to sell their films to American audiences too, that’s a marketing decision, so it makes sense to pay more attention to commercial marketability for the American distribution.
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### Author:  [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/45 "2011-06-08T18:11:43Z")
> [@Alessan](#):
>
> Don’t Europeans mostly watch American movies these days?
Yes: [http://boxofficemojo.com/intl/](http://boxofficemojo.com/intl/)
And they’re typically dubbed to boot!
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### Author:  [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/46 "2011-06-08T19:09:40Z")
> [@Alessan](#):
>
> Don’t Europeans mostly watch American movies these days?
In the UK, most of the top-grossing films come from Hollywood. I can’t find any figures, but I think this is true throughout most of Europe as well.
As others have pointed out, the tacked-on happy ending is not solely an American phenomenon. Conan Doyle brought Sherlock Holmes back from the dead due to popular demand, which is a similar kind of thing. However, the studio culture is very strong in American US and TV.
> [@Anaamika](#):
>
> That movie Slumdog Millionaire - those things that happened to that kid happen to people in India, but rarely do they all happen to one person. Just keep tacking on tragedies and I don’t believe you anymore.
Slumdog Millionaire is not a tragedy. The blurb on the DVD box says “the feelgood film of the decade”, it’s a romantic film with many moments of comedy. There is terrible suffering, but the main characters overcome it all to be reunited, and it ends in a big dance number. It’s not meant to be a realistic film (very few are), it’s more of a fable. It uses the conceit of the questions to tell the story of a life in flashbacks, and to explore some of the dark side of India. I can understand why you didn’t like it, but it’s not a good example in this thread. It’s not a tacked on happy ending, it’s very much part of the film.
Tragedy is not just about catharsis. Romeo and Juliet die, but their families are reconciled. We are left sadder and wiser, it’s one of the humanising stories. There is a big difference between tragedy (things fall apart, but are worth struggling for) and nihilism (life is meaningless).
I certainly wouldn’t want the majority of films I watch to be tragic, but I wouldn’t want to feed only on popcorn either.
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### Author:  [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/47 "2011-06-08T19:19:15Z")
I would disagree with the OPs premise. Here are the top 50 grossing films and a summary of their endings:
1 Avatar Happy 😃
2 Titanic Sad:(
3 The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King Bittersweet:)
4 Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man’s Chest Happy 😃
5 Toy Story 3 Didn’t See)
6 Alice in Wonderland Happy 😃
7 The Dark Knight Tortured Superhero Ending:cool:
8 Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone To be continued:eek:
9 Pirates of the Caribbean: At World’s End Bittersweet:)
10 Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 1 To be continued:eek:
11 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix To be continued:eek:
12 Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince To be continued:eek:
13 The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers To be continued:eek:
14 Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace Lame:dubious:
15 Shrek 2 Happy 😃
16 Jurassic Park Happy (but cautionary)😃
17 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire To be continued:eek:
18 Spider-Man 3 Sad:(
19 Ice Age: Dawn of the Dinosaurs Happy 😃
20 Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets To be continued:eek:
21 The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring Sad / To be continued:(
22 Finding Nemo Happy:D
23 Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith NOOOOOOOOO!:mad:
24 Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen Happy:D
25 Inception Ambiguous:confused:
26 Spider-Man Happy:D
27 Independence Day Happy:D
28 Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides (Didn’t See)
29 Shrek the Third (Didn’t See)
30 Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban To be continued:eek:
31 E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial Bittersweet:)
32 Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull Happy:D
33 The Lion King Happy:D
34 Spider-Man 2 Tortured Superhero Ending:cool:
35 Star Wars Happy:D
36 2012 Happy:D
37 The Da Vinci Code Happy:D
38 Shrek Forever After (Didn’t See)
39 The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe Happy:D
40 The Matrix Reloaded To be continued:eek:
41 Up Bittersweet:)
42 The Twilight Saga: New Moon (Didn’t See)
43 Transformers Happy:D
44 The Twilight Saga: Eclipse To be continued:eek:
45 Forrest Gump Bittersweet:)
46 The Sixth Sense WHHHHAAAATT!!??:eek:
47 Ice Age: The Meltdown (Didn’t See)
48 Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Black Pearl Happy:D
49 Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones To be continued:eek:
50 Kung Fu Panda Happy:D
Certainly a lot of happy endings for mostly Disney and mindless action movie fare.
Some sad endings.
A lot of open ended clifhanger endings with the franchises.
A couple “and that is why I am cursed with awesomeness” superhero endings.
A lot of the bittersweet “we saved the world but at what horrible cost” endings.
And a few I couldn’t categorize.
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### Author:  [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/48 "2011-06-08T19:28:51Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#):
>
> But with Army of Darkness, the studio was right. The apocalypse ending is dumb. And the new ending gave us “Hail to the king, baby” and “Yo, she-bitch!”
And the way he delivers “Lady, I’m afraid I’m going to have to ask you to leave the store” is just priceless.
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### Author:  [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/49 "2011-06-08T21:15:31Z")
[QUOTE=Alessan]
American audiences don’t always demand happy endings - they’re often perfectly satisfied with bittersweet endings, too. Just look at some of the most popular movies ever: … the Godfather.
[/QUOTE]
**The Godfather** does not have a bittersweet ending. It and **Godfather II** are about the steady erosion of Michael’s soul as he takes control of the “family.”
> [@msmith537](#):
>
> 5 Toy Story 3 (Didn’t See)
> …
>
> 29 Shrek the Third (Didn’t See)
5 **Toy Story** Bittersweet 🙂
…
29 **Shrek the Third** Happy 😃
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### Author:  [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/50 "2011-06-08T21:21:48Z")
> [@NDP](#):
>
> **The Godfather** does not have a bittersweet ending. It and **Godfather II** are about the steady erosion of Michael’s soul as he takes control of the “family.”
I’d say that Part 1, in and of itself, can be seen as having a bittersweet ending. Yes, we see Michael begin to lose his soul, but we’re also rooting for him to take out his enemies. It’s only after Part 2 that it comes across as the beginning of a full-blown tragedy.
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### Author:  [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/51 "2011-06-08T21:51:01Z")
> [@Enderw24](#):
>
> The reason Shakespeare’s tragedies were so popular was because the tragedies happened to the elite and ruling class and the plays were shown to the general public. It’s like reading the Enquirer or watching Real Housewives.
> “oh boo hoo. Some stupid Danish prick’s life is sooooo terrible. All he can do is whinge about his life of luxury. You want tragedy? It’s me determining if next year’s rain will get me the crops I need to feed my family or whether they die of influenza, not whether my mom’s boinking my uncle. Man, I hope they kill every one of these stupid SOBs in this play.”
I’m not sure I agree with this. Take _Henry V_, for example: while not a tragedy in itself, all of the lower class characters get treated pretty shabbily, and most of them are dead before the end.
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### Author:  [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2011, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/52 "2011-06-08T21:59:53Z")
> [@msmith537](#):
>
> 26 Spider-Man Happy:D
I’d classify this one as bittersweet; IIRC, it wraps up right after Harry says something unsettling at the funeral, at which point Peter realizes that _“no matter what I do, no matter how hard I try, the ones I love will always be the ones who pay”_ – before walking away from a tearful Mary Jane (explaining he’s got nothing else to give) and then going back to narrating for us that what he’s got is a gift and a curse…
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### Author:  [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2011, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/53 "2011-06-09T05:07:08Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#):
>
> I’d classify this one as bittersweet; IIRC, it wraps up right after Harry says something unsettling at the funeral, at which point Peter realizes that _“no matter what I do, no matter how hard I try, the ones I love will always be the ones who pay”_ – before walking away from a tearful Mary Jane (explaining he’s got nothing else to give) and then going back to narrating for us that what he’s got is a gift and a curse…
By his terms, it would be “tortured superhero.”
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### Author:  [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/54 "2011-06-09T05:46:19Z")
I notice how the implication of “Americans want happy endings” is always that the Americans are wrong. Why not ask why there’s a European desire for sad endings? (Because it’s always an America vs Europe thing when these comparisons are made.) Why is a sad ending considered more sophisticated than a happy ending?
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### Author:  [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2011, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/55 "2011-06-09T07:57:25Z")
I think it is more an issue of overuse of happy endings than happy endings as such. There are plenty of non-US movies with happy endings, probably the majority. It’s just that it seems near-compulsory in US mainstream cinema, but merely optional elsewhere. Is this more sophisticated?
I would avoid that word, but I guess that at the lowest level - in simple numerical terms - a cinema tradition where a greater variety of endings are likely could be argued to be “more sophisticated”.
Also, a cinema tradition of escapism could be viewed as less sophisticated than one which could involve escapism but could just as easily involve realism.
Another thing is that the simplicity of the US popular cinema tradition detracts from the enjoyment for some. To many, the tension that might exist in many movies is defused by the knowledge that if it’s Hollywood, the guy _will_ get the girl (or vice versa) and the hero \*will \*win.
Finally I suppose that movies that stay true to directors’ visions (rather than having a happy ending forcibly inserted by market forces) can result in some films having less jarring endings, which could be regarded as better (viz a film like Blade Runner which in its initial release was a dark film depicting a dystopia, which had this obviously tacked on sweetness and light ending). In other words, in some cases, it’s not that the film is better because it is sad as such, but because it is at least consistent.
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### Author:  [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2011, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/56 "2011-06-09T08:13:09Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#):
>
> I notice how the implication of “Americans want happy endings” is always that the Americans are wrong. Why not ask why there’s a European desire for sad endings? (Because it’s always an America vs Europe thing when these comparisons are made.) Why is a sad ending considered more sophisticated than a happy ending?
I’m not sure the opposite of a happy ending is a sad ending. What I mean is, there’s a difference between a \*\*sad \*\*ending and an \*\*unhappy \*\*ending. Sad endings have long been a tradition in American cinema, from \*Casablanca \*to _Titanic_. Unhappy endings are much rarer, and I suspect, much less popular everywhere in the world.
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### Author:  [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2011, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-american-desire-for-happy-endings/584725/57 "2011-06-09T13:02:06Z")
> [@Alessan](#):
>
> I’m not sure the opposite of a happy ending is a sad ending. What I mean is, there’s a difference between a \*\*sad \*\*ending and an \*\*unhappy \*\*ending. Sad endings have long been a tradition in American cinema, from \*Casablanca \*to _Titanic_. Unhappy endings are much rarer, and I suspect, much less popular everywhere in the world.
Agreed. In addition, Americans are perfectly happy to let evil win if it’s the right sort of evil. Supernatural evil wins occasionally and that’s okay with filmgoers.Likewise if the evil is charismatic, amusing, or some sort of twisted form of justice. Anti-heros aren’t the good guy, but we often cheer for the guy racking up the body count. Someone upthread mentioned Nihilism, and I think that nails it perfectly. Many Americans, myself included just don’t see the point of those types of films.
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