Legal drinking age here in is 18 aswell but I don’t know anybody who observed this law.
As for drink driving in my experience it seems there is more of a problem with older people that younger ones. The people who are confident in their driving and drinking ability are the ones to be careful off. Also there seems to be much less tolerance of it in the younger people I know. They ( in general ) have been brought up to know that it is a moronic thing to try.
I don’t have a problem with underage drinking, I not talking about 4 years olds here but I’ve been regulary drinking since about 15years old and it hasn’t done me any harm. Except for my alcaholic tendencies that is
Just previewed and S.Norman is our resident viking from planet Denmark. All these kids buying drink and I don’t have any :rolleyes:
I’ll try and answer that, being fellow Euro Trash and all.
A six year old could buy a bottle of booze for his father, in Denmark, apparently. This is not the case for Europe at large, however, and I do believe Spiny is talking about how it USED to be.
In the Netherlands, selling alcohol to people under 16 is illegal. However, people are rarely asked for an ID when they could be of a suspect age. We’re just not that anal about it over here. Let them get drunk - they’ll learn from it.
And in Europe, there’s NO driving under 18. Period. License laws vary per country: in the Netherlands, you can not drive a car (other than an official training car with instructor) untill you have your permit.
Personally, I find cars in the hands of minors far more dangerous than a little booze. Kids will get drunk anyway, and making it illegal will only BOOST that, if anything. However, underage kids driving illegally is pretty rare over here.
EvilGhandi: As yojimbo says, I’m from Denmark. We’re rather liberal on that sort of thing.
And until a few years year ago, anyone having the money could buy liquor legally. Perhaps the clerk would turn away a six-year old, but there would’ve been nothing illegal in the transaction. (I wouldn’t say “permitted by law” - it just wasn’t outlawed). There were/are some other technicalities - stores can’t legally sell alcohol late in the evening or on Sundays - but still, those were the rules.
As the rules are now, a 15-year old can buy alcohol at a store, an 18-year old at a bar. Personally, I’ve been drinking since I was 16, not counting wine at meals since my parents, bless their hearts, tried to teach me the basics when I was even younger. And like Yojimbo, I don’t think it did me any noticeable harm.
And, nope, you can’t get a driver’s license until you’re 18. (It’s not restricted driving - it’s no driving except for mopeds). And we have seatbelt laws, helmet laws (I seem to remember you dislike these ?), murderous fines for speeding and strict DUI laws (0,05). But as Yojimbo says, drunk drivers are considered complete idiots.
So I guess over here we’re seeing driving as the thing that demands responsibility & accountability, while drinking is the sort of thing you should be able to handle on your own.
Just a different outlook.
It appears we are indeed from different planets. And after all this time I just assumed the only planet was Hawaii. Just kidding of course, but really are drinking laws THAT different?
Yes, they are that different - from the US laws, at least. But seriously: what do you find so bad about the European laws as explained by Spiny, yojimbo and myself?
I find it much easier to see fault in the American counterparts. Accountability and responsibility being the key words - just like Spiny said.
EvilGhandi, I can’t provide you with a cite in English, but I just checked - the law against people under 15 purchasing alcohol went into effect July 1st 1998. Before that, a kid of six could buy a bottle of wine for his parents, no prob.
BTW, the cite claims to see a positive effect - the kids actually start drinking later. And while I’m all for the idea of letting people learn from their own mistakes, noone wants 13-year olds getting plastered.
I can assure you I understand the OP, Ghandi. For a second there, I thought we were discussing the differences between European and American alcohol laws.
I suppose I was completely mistaken there :rolleyes:
Coldy., I know we were But I am feeling froggy today. Please excuse me but it is my 40th b day. I just didn’t know when to quit or where to divide my argument. Fuck it. It was a little fun. Im off to alt.oth.com
Homer, I don’t disagree with you. I wasn’t necessarily defending the drinking age, just explaining the reasoning the Feds used in requiring the states to lower it. Personally, I think that America’s attitude towards alcohol often borders on the hysterical, which only increases the problems it causes.
Still, it’s not unreasonable to state that being able to do activity X at age N doesn’t mean you should be able to do all other activities at age N as well, if there’s no logical relationship between them.
I think the opinion on the correct drinking age will differ considerably depending on the age of the person asked.
The young ones will tell you oh-so-passionately that they should be allowed to legally drink, buy, transport, whatever, and will even give you some stats to back up their position.
Older folks (my God, I include myself and I’m only 33!) will be more in favor of raising age limits for things like drinking, driving, etc.
It’s not that we had it and now you can’t, ha ha ha. I remember being 18, and the thought of being able to walk into a bar or liquor store and buy/consume at that age is truly frightening. 21 was plenty young enough to still have fun. Although truth be told, I had been drinking since I was about 12 and never had a problem getting it, so the point may be moot.
Now, raising the driving age to 18 gets my vote, no doubt about it…
I could drink legally when I was eighteen. In Connecticut at the end of the 1970s.
When they made the changes that phil referred to in his first post I was in my twenties already, so I didn’t give a fuck. Matter of fact, I probably thought it was a pretty good idea to get all you peach-fuzzed 18-year-olds out of the bars.
I have to disagree with this. My prior service experience tells me that those servicepeople under the age of 21 may not consume alcoholic beverages in the United States. Usually, being caught will result in Non-Judicial punishment. Many a friend of mine was busted for that same offense.
However, when stationed overseas, drink all you want.
I believe that the rule of thumb is that the on-base drinking age is equivalent to the drinking age established in the local community.
The idea of a legal drinking age is is kind of too broad. I know of 18 year olds who have the mental capacity and responsibility to handle the privledges of alcohol consumption, just like I know some 25 year olds who should never be allowed near a bottle. An individual’s maturity does not have a birthday…
Of course, this would be impossible to legislate and enforce so it is wishful thinking. For the OP, I would recommend moving here to Canada where the age is lower, albeit the beer is more expensive, and there is no selective service (if you against being in the military).
Legal drinking age in Quebec is 18…in the part of the province where I`m from (Eastern Townships) one of the biggest problems we have is American 18 year-olds driving across the border to get hammered, then try to go back home. The number of accidents on the highways going into Vermont is insane. Not only were these people not used to drinking, but Canadian beer is notoriously more concentrated alcohol-wise, so people would drink much more than they normally could handle (5 beers is 5 beers kinda mentality). True, Quebeckers got in their fair share of accidents, but it seems the American crashes just made the news more often.
Also, now that Im in Ontario, Ive noticed that the frosh were ridiculously bad at handling their alcohol since for most this is their first year where there are legal (19), and away from parents who might chew them out for drinking. I can`t really back any of this up with facts, but it seems to me that the only result of having a higher age limit on drinking is people go through the stupid, incredibly-non-responsible phase that much later.
So I say let 18 year olds drink. They gotta learn, and sooner is better than later.
I totally think this should be in another forum…oh well:-)
