# Why The Long Gap Between Ascension And Coronation of the British Monarch **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 3, 2018, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079 "2018-08-03T23:38:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/21 "2018-08-06T01:48:07Z")
It wasn’t just PR. It’s a constitutional requirement that a new President take the oath of office “Before he enter on the Execution of his office”: Article II, Section 2, Clause 8. And then Johnson gave his first presidential order: “Let’s get this bird in the air.” ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/22 "2018-08-06T02:31:33Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > It wasn’t just PR. > > It’s a constitutional requirement that a new President take the oath of office “Before he enter on the Execution of his office”: Article II, Section 2, Clause 8. > > And then Johnson gave his first presidential order: “Let’s get this bird in the air.” Yes, this was I thought, and was getting at with the Reagan example. I mean, hypothetically, what if a doctor’s deceased document was in error and he recovers enough that all the other “disability” objections can be dismissed? Which is a stupid hypothetical, and would be a constitutional crisis, but it illustrates what I believe the US always has: either a President or a constitutionally authorized pro-tem (the real “I’m in charge” person) for the Presidency, but no-one else who is not sworn in. Not sure by whom, by law, though. ETA: Fascinating, and sad of course, fact about his first executive act. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/23 "2018-08-06T03:23:00Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > The coronation is a big formal event, for which world leaders travel to London. So I imagine the delay is to allow time to schedule and plan such an event. (Also, presumably people want to mourn the deceased monarch for a while.) It’s also a hell of a big _commercial_ event, with everyone from hotels, restaurants, cab drivers, tour guides, etc. all making a huge amount of money from the tourists who come to see it. So it takes time for the event to be ‘pushed’, so that the appropriate number of tourists can plan to attend. ---
**Author:** ![yendis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ed8c4c/32.png) [@yendis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yendis)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/24 "2018-08-06T12:20:44Z")
> [@APB](#): > > But the principle that a British monarch becomes King or Queen the moment their predecessor dies is well established (‘The King never dies’). Just about the only thing that they can do after the coronation that, if only by tradition, they don’t do before is wear their crown when opening Parliament. Even when they ‘touched for the King’s Evil’, English monarchs were happy to do so before their coronation, whereas French Kings thought that it only worked if they had first been anointed. Which immediately make me think of this: > [@](#): > > “The only thing known to go faster than ordinary light is monarchy, according to the philosopher Ly Tin Wheedle. He reasoned like this: you can’t have more than one king, and tradition demands that there is no gap between kings, so when a king dies the succession must therefore pass to the heir instantaneously. Presumably, he said, there must be some elementary particles – kingons, or possibly queons – that do this job, but of course succession sometimes fails if, in mid-flight, they strike an anti-particle, or republicon. His ambitious plans to use his discovery to send messages, involving the careful torturing of a small king in order to modulate the signal, were never fully expanded because, at that point, the bar closed.” > > ― Terry Pratchett, Mort ---
**Author:** ![Teuton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/teuton/32/3864_2.png) [@Teuton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Teuton)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/25 "2018-08-06T15:40:07Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > It’s in Shakespeare, I’m almost sure. It’s not, is it? I can’t find anything like it in any searches of the text. Both “The king is dead” (a few times - Shakespeare is hard on kings) and “Long Live The King!” (Hamlet) appear, but not together. ---
**Author:** ![Schnitte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/schnitte/32/9033_2.png) [@Schnitte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Schnitte)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/26 "2018-08-06T19:27:01Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > In that particular respect, the presidency is exactly like the monarchy. There is never any time that the US is without a President. The VP becomes President instantly upon the death of his successor. LBJ was sworn in the way he was for PR reasons, nothing more. In that sense, the assumption of the presidency by the VP upon the predecessor’s death is perfectly analogous to the ordinary course of inaugurating a newly elected President. In the latter case, the newly elected President automatically assumes office at noon of January 20 of the year after the election (XX Amendment, Section 1). That applies ipso facto, just by virtue of the passage of time, but the new President is still constitutionally obliged to take the oath of office before assuming the presidential duties. In the case of the death of President, the VP automatically becomes President ipso facto at the moment of the predecessor’s death, but again has to take the oath of office as a constitutional obligation. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2018, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/27 "2018-08-06T20:08:22Z")
> [@yendis](#): > > Which immediately make me think of this: Yeah, it’s an immediate enough reaction to make me wonder if there’s a particle called the geekon. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2018, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/28 "2018-08-07T16:37:12Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by \*\*PatrickLondon \*\* > View Post On the other hand, of course, we do manage to arrange it so that if a general election on a Thursday ejects a government, the new government is usually substantially in place and ready to get down to business on the Monday morning. Is that how it work in the UK? I know if a new party wins in Canada, They usually schedule a transition date for about a week or so after the election. This allows the replacement ministers, etc. to be selected and ready. > [@](#): > > … If memory serves, formal mourning would last nine months anyway, … Nine months? Does this harken back to the days when kings often could die still having a wife of childbearing age? * * * In my mother’s collection of “stuff” I inherited is a booklet listing the parade from the coronation of ERII. The booklet must be 20 or 30 pages, and lists the order of important people and military bands for a grand parade through London. Obviously not something to throw together in a month or two. It looks like thousands of people just participating in the parade. Of course, it helped to still own a huge empire at the time. There was a special a few months ago on TV about the coronation. Among other things, they built a trolley rail down the middle of Westminster Abbey to roll in all the material needed, to build wooden seating rising up on both sides of the main Aisle, not to mention all the ceremonial furniture needing to be installed. Then the team arranging the coronation went through every aspect, including who gets to sit where, who are the participants, order of ceremonies, dry run with stand-ins to see how things worked… To avoid silly issues like apparently when the archbishop when to do the actual crowning, he’d marked the crown to indicate which way was front. You can see him turning it one way then another before putting it on. (luckily he got it right). that’s just one of thousands of important details, which will be especially important next time, in this day of video replay. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/29 "2018-08-07T18:31:03Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Is that how it work in the UK? I know if a new party wins in Canada, They usually schedule a transition date for about a week or so after the election. This allows the replacement ministers, etc. to be selected . Yes, as soon as it’s clear that a party, or coalition, can form a majority, then all eyes are on the outgoing PM being driven to Buckingham Palace to offer their resignation followed swiftly by the incoming PM going to to be asked by the Queen to form a government. If one party has a clear majority by the time the votes have been counted on Friday morning, then that’s when it happens. The new PM then spends a frantic couple of days appointing Ministers, starting with the main Offices of State. The outgoing PM leaves Number Ten, removal lorries and all, the same day. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2018, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/30 "2018-08-07T18:48:40Z")
I’ve seen it referred to as “moving van democracy.” 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2018, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/31 "2018-08-07T18:58:18Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > The outgoing PM leaves Number Ten, removal lorries and all, the same day. Gordon Brown walking away from Downing Street with Sarah and his young family was a bit of a ☹ moment. It’s quite a ruthless process really [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/WvGd6s_JI8E/hqdefault.jpg "Emotional Gordon Brown: "Thank you & goodbye"") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvGd6s_JI8E&t=209) ---
**Author:** ![APB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@APB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/APB)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2018, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/32 "2018-08-07T21:11:08Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > If memory serves, formal mourning would last nine months anyway… > [@md2000](#): > > Nine months? Does this harken back to the days when kings often could die still having a wife of childbearing age? The days of prolonged court mourning are long gone. The full court morning for George VI in 1952 lasted for less than four months and there was no period of half mourning after that. The mourning for Queen Mary the following year was even shorter, specifically so that it would not overlap with the coronation. More to the point, the Royal Family has since abandoned the practice, even for the likes of the Queen Mother. Basically they now just wear mourning until the funeral. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2018, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/33 "2018-08-09T18:35:15Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > It wasn’t just PR. > > It’s a constitutional requirement that a new President take the oath of office “Before he enter on the Execution of his office”: Article II, Section 2, Clause 8… Section 1, actually. The 25th Amendment also provides in its Section 1, “In case of the removal of the President from office or of his death or resignation, the Vice President shall become President.” So presumably (at least since 1967, when it was ratified), succession is instantaneous. But he (someday she) cannot undertake any official act before swearing the oath. > [@APB](#): > > …The mourning for Queen Mary the following year was even shorter, specifically so that it would not overlap with the coronation… Queen Mary had been in ill health and specifically asked Queen Elizabeth II, her granddaughter, not to delay the coronation if she died at an inopportune time. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2018, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/34 "2018-08-10T03:26:59Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Section 1, actually. Quite so. I shouldn’t try to research legal points on my iPhone in line at 5 Guys! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2018, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079/35 "2018-08-10T04:22:53Z")
Those burgers can certainly be distracting. They say Scalia wrote some of his best dissents standing in line there, though! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-long-gap-between-ascension-and-coronation-of-the-british-monarch/819079.md?page=1)