His options were:
instruct the security guard to look after the little girl for the time required, if that was going to be an issue.
tell management of the problem, and tell them that they weren’t going to get any of his business until restroom changes of the kind described above were made.
backing this up by leaving.
At college bars it is not uncommon to see women wandering in and out of the lineless mens room. In most cases, since our stalls dont always have doors (mostly built for peeing), you will see one of their guy friends standing in the stall acting like a door.
Gender neutral bathrooms for the transgendered completely confuse me. Our school’s GLBT organization pushed hard for more gender neutral bathrooms and they are slowly popping up around campus.
I do think that family bathrooms were the greatest thing ever invented because I take care of my nieces a lot and it just makes my life easier. These bathrooms are small and personal so I know exactly where everyone is and what is going on. I remember how long my cousin and I used to spend in the bathroom playing with the faucets and paper towel dispensers when we were in elementary school. Kids like to get lost in bathrooms if they are unsupervised.
This was a private (1 toilet & sink) unisex restroom and they wouldn’t let him take his own daughter in with him? :dubious: Why?! 
I appreciate those options MrMoto. Seriously, I do. I do think it was lack of planning on the fathers side, however, he’s the one that thought it was a bright idea to take his daughter to a place where it is illegal to bring weapons because it is a place of nuisance, where people gamble and drink. So if ya ask me, it wasn’t his first logical mistake.
However, in the big scheme of things, we as a society haven’t quite figured out that daughters have fathers and daughters, sometimes, need to pee. For that matter, I also make a point of when I am shopping and need to use the bathroom, if I am told “we don’t have one, the shop next door does.” that I will gladly go shop at the shop next door.
In my next house, I’m gonna have a separate bathroom for the boys and girls, since it is such a huge issue outside of our home that we be segregated, it must be important enough to enforce in our home. (that and I won’t have to wonder why there is a sawz-all blade on the counter that evidently, MUST stay there for years)
FTR: I’d rather a transgendered whomever come in to the bathroom, use it neatly, flush appropriately, wash thoroughly and exit quickly, than some of the stuff I’ve seen women do. (Not that men are any better, per se, but we do have extra things to torture others with)
Ok so we all agree that family restrooms are awesome, and nobody is squicked out by the idea of gender-neutral bathrooms.
But the question remains - what does this have to do with transgendered people?
So like, it wasn’t families or parents or handicapped people asking for this restroom (although all are welcome!) it was one of the gay student groups on campus that wanted it.
I was kind of more looking for answers as to why such a restroom would be important to transgendered and transsexual people.
I think there are two purposes:
[ul]
[li]First, as mentioned already, it allows non-trans people to not be uncomfortable about a physically man/woman using the ‘wrong’ stalls, and closely related;[/li][li]It allows trans people to not have to worry about choosing the wrong rest room. If it’s a M to F trans person, for example, she’s pretty likely to run into rudeness or awkwardness regardless of which restroom she chooses, and removing a gender designation on restrooms means that no one is going to accuse her of using the ‘wrong’ restroom for nefarious reasons.[/li][/ul]
The differences between sex and gender and all that is a huge can of worms that really isn’t agreed upon by most people on a gut level (and may never be). So, segregation by gender is always going to provide for awkward and possibly hostile situations.
I don’t know if this is universal, but I worked in a couple of places where I occasionally had to clean the restrooms and the ladies room was ALWAYS messier than the mens room.
The men’s room usually had puddles of piss around the urinals because men don’t aim very well, especially after a few beers.
The ladies room usually had a bigger mess of paper towels and used lady-type-sanitary objects on the floor. The toilets were often unflushed and the smell was a lot worse.
We’ve heard the same thing from every person who has had the distinction of cleaning up after both genders. I think at this point, it is an inarguable point.
I always use the ladies’ room and have never had any problem with the other women. I blend in. So as far as this transsexual woman is concerned, my half of the binary suits my needs.
But not everyone fits into the binary.
There are gender-ambiguous people somewhere in the middle, or gender-neutral, or genderqueer people – and they wouldn’t be comfortable in either the men’s or the women’s room. So it’s nice that they get their own accommodations. I’ve been in that situation too, and I always relied on the gender-neutral restrooms. Starbucks is especially good in that regard, because they always provide gender-neutral and you can’t walk a few steps in any direction without tripping over one, they’re everywhere.
I too am baffled at describing these arrangements as “transgender,” because what they really are is gender neutral. Some transgender people, those with an ambiguous presentation, may benefit from them, but as Mr. Moto and others have pointed out, what about dads with girls? Just as legit a reason, and certainly there are far more of these than trans people. To call it “gender neutral” would be more accurate and fairer to everyone.
Once I went to an event at a Unitarian church in DC–a wonderful place–they sincerely mean well! As soon as I walked in, a nice church lady came up to me and said they had transgender restrooms. Just being helpful. I said, “Thank you. I use the ladies’ room.” She was fine with that but looked surprised. Just because the label “transgender” had been given it (sounds more trendy? I don’t know), the assumption was that I would prefer it. It depends on the individual. I simply identify as a woman. On the other hand, some trans people identify as a “third gender.” It can get kind of complicated. I appreciate all the progressive Americans who have led the way toward equality for trans people, and the effort they make in understanding our complicated reality.
I’ve been known to use the men’s room in crowded venues. When ya gotta go, ya gotta go!
I suppose I’ll have to get used to gender-neutral restrooms, but at this point I’m not crazy about the idea. I know the rest of the world is way more comfortable with it than I am, but hey…I was raised here. It’s on my list of Things To Get Used To.
The way it seems to be going most places I’ve seen is the standard large men’s and ladies’ rooms in places like movie theaters, plus a smaller “family restroom”. This is separate, is lockable, and has all of the standard amenities plus a changing table.
Now, that bathroom would be perfect as well for someone of ambiguous gender, as it is private.
If I remember my college years correctly (and I admit I destroyed quite a few brain cells during that time), pretty much all of the bathrooms on campus ended up being used by people of both sexes, even if they weren’t officially designated as such. So I have a feeling that on a college campus, this is really pretty much a non-issue, but hey, if it makes the transgender students happy, why not?
Because this occurred on a college campus, I would guess that it has a lot to do with breaking down binaries rather than any particular concern with plumbing. Many feminist/queer theorists would argue that categorization in general is not good. The goal would not be to add a category of transgender bathrooms, but rather to decategorize all bathrooms. This sort of action might be an attempt to get people to question their assumptions about how “natural” gender really is. This thread could be seen as evidence that it has worked, at least to some extent.
So what’s the protocol for using transgender or family bathrooms? I’m a normal, XY gene pair carrying male. Is it proper to treat these both as gender neutral then? I accidentally used the family restroom at a restaurant the other day (first WC I saw), and then on the way out I saw the separate mens’ and ladies’. I felt rather self-conscious for having not chosen the “correct” WC.
How is that incorrect? That bathroom is for the convenience of people who need it. The only time I’d criticize you for using it is if you cut ahead of a family who was waiting to do so.
It is the same as the handicapped stall - nothing says I can’t use it, and I don’t need a grab bar or anything.
I think when universities designate transgender bathrooms, they are trying to imply a sense of openness and inclusivity. I think this impression (look how PC we are) is as important to them as the bathroom itself. I don’t have a problem with it. Our university dorm was co-ed, with co-ed bathrooms, and not many people cared.
I don’t know why women wait for hours outside the bathroom either, but quite a few women will use the mens. I have on occasion used the womens but only if it is a small place which basically has two small, identical, lockable one person in the bathroom type rooms – in which case the idea of gender based washrooms is almost silly.
The genders there are merely semiotic, not actually functional or performative. I agree with you, it’s easy to read the merely semiotic which has no practical basis as almost silly.