# Why the prejudice against atheists? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 28, 2003, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093 "2003-10-28T20:10:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/61 "2003-10-30T23:59:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Evil Captor \* > I believe that in Muslim countries it’s actually dangerous to profess atheism … the Koran IIRC says specifically that other believers might be OK, but atheists are not to be tolerated. We don’t see Islam as being that inimical because they aren’t that powerful in the U.S., but I think things are pretty rough for atheists in the Middle East, Pakistan, etc. Your perception is wrong. in Al Qur’an are many statements to warn for polytheism. But on the other hand there is described that “God chooses who He wants”. So if you look carefully at that statement, then for a Muslim the right attitude when meeting an atheist would be to accept that God wants him to be atheist. That can be “for the time being” or whatever. Muslims always say “God knows best”. As for being atheist in a Muslim country: if you mean by that the countries with a Muslim majority and Islam as the State religion, then there are variations on that. Some countries have an almost 100% Muslim population, so the chance of finding an atheist there is for that reason very limited. Others have a certain % of “other then Muslim” citizens among which probably an amount of atheists. But as long as they don’t go around telling people to forsaken their belief I don’t think they face that many problems. While reading the reactions here, I’m a bit stunned. I didn’t know atheists faced that much opposition in the USA. I thought it would be unlikely… More the opposite situation. Salaam. A ---
**Author:** ![Soup\_du\_jour](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@Soup\_du\_jour](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soup_du_jour)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/62 "2003-10-31T00:46:02Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by GodlessSkeptic_ > **Karl Marx never said “religion is the oppiate of the masses”.This is something of an urban legend.Do a google search for Karl Marx + misquoted and you should be able to find a good deal of info on this.** I took your advice and found [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Marx+misquoted](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Marx+misquoted) I clicked through on a few links and found nothing in the first three pages. Conversely, I did find this gem. From [http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/religion/blrel\_marx\_opium.htm](http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/religion/blrel_marx_opium.htm) > [@](#): > > Religious distress is at the same time the expression of real distress and the protest against real distress. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. \*\*It is the opium of the people. \*\* > > The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions. This is a quote from Mr Marx’s critique of Hegel’s _Philosophy of Law_, or so sayeth the folks at [about.com](http://about.com) Sorry to say, but I completely disagree with you. > [@](#): > > From GodlessSkeptic > \*\*I do not know that it matters one iota whether christians, as a whole, become the shining beacons of humility adn happiness that you propose.It will not do anything to convince thinking atheists(or thinking jews adn muslims for that matter) that your proposition is anymore rational. > People who are predisposed to believe things based upon how attractive the ideas are or the people presenting them will be the ONLY kinds of people you will atract to your religion/worldview. > Those of us who doubt the existence of God for purely rational reasons will remain ever doubtful until such time as the claim sounds plausible. \*\*And yet people vote for George Bush because they think he’s a better guy than Al Gore, even though the niceness of a president has little to do with the effectiveness of his policies. The fact of the matter is that many people take the actions of the person into account when deciding on their views. Credibility counts. Even if they both know nothing about economics, people will take financial advice from Ghandi more readily than from Hitler. Surely you can concede this. ---
**Author:** ![GodlessSkeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@GodlessSkeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GodlessSkeptic)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/63 "2003-10-31T03:49:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Soup\_du\_jour \* > \*\*I took your advice and found [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Marx+misquoted](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Marx+misquoted) > > I clicked through on a few links and found nothing in the first three pages. > > Conversely, I did find this gem. > From [http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/religion/blrel\_marx\_opium.htm](http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/religion/blrel_marx_opium.htm) > This is a quote from Mr Marx’s critique of Hegel’s _Philosophy of Law_, or so sayeth the folks at [about.com](http://about.com) \*\* ANd you will note that nowhere does it say “religion is the opiate of the masses”.Read the passage carefully. > [@](#): > > \*\* > > Sorry to say, but I completely disagree with you. > > \*\*And yet people vote for George Bush because they think he’s a better guy than Al Gore, even though the niceness of a president has little to do with the effectiveness of his policies. > > The fact of the matter is that many people take the actions of the person into account when deciding on their views. Credibility counts. Even if they both know nothing about economics, people will take financial advice from Ghandi more readily than from Hitler. Surely you can concede this. \*\* False analogy.You are taking two people who we KNOW exist and comparing how people vote(or not) for them to whether or not God exists at all.If the claim for God’s existence is not rationally warranted then no amount of appreciable character will change that in the mind of the skeptic.My point stands. ---
**Author:** ![Urban\_Ranger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Urban\_Ranger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urban_Ranger)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/64 "2003-10-31T04:36:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JThunder \* > One can believe that true morality can only be rooted in a deity’s existence, and yet be motivated by a sense of justice rather than fear. What are you talking about? Your sense of justice is closely tied to your morality. ---
**Author:** ![Soup\_du\_jour](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@Soup\_du\_jour](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soup_du_jour)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/65 "2003-10-31T04:51:09Z")
**GodlessSkeptic** , no false analogy is there. Perhaps I haven’t made myself clear. I’m placing Ghandi and Hitler (or Bush and Gore) not as God, but in the place of people who believe in God (or not-God.) The “Sound Financial Advice” is God. Here is my analogy. 1. Someone believes that Bush is a trustworthy person, and therefore may be more likely to believe that his economic theories are valid. 2. Someone believes that (random Christian) is a trustworthy person, and therefore may be more likely to believe that (random Christian’s) religious theories are valid. > [@](#): > > ANd you will note that nowhere does it say “religion is the opiate of the masses”.Read the passage carefully. Aren’t we splitting hairs here? > [@](#): > > Religious distress is at the same time the expression of real distress and the protest against real distress. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. **It is the opium of the people.** I concede that Mr Marx does not say the exact words “Religion is the opiate of the masses.” He does, however, say that “[Religion]…is the opiate of the people.” Unless there is a large different between “people” and “masses” in that context, and unless my grammar skillz are so out of tune that the word “It” in the final sentence doesn’t refer to “Religion,” and unless “opium” is substantially different from “opiate,” than yes, Marx _does_ say that religion is the opiate of the masses. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/66 "2003-10-31T14:41:30Z")
**Alan Owes Bess** , you should spend a week with me on the subway. The so-called Christians (considering the hatred they spew, I don’t believe they’re really Christian, but it is what they consider themselves) shouting how we’re all going to hell unless we find they’re narrow definition of Jesus Christ, and shouting down any who oppose them, are a weekly ‘treat’. And never tell one of them you’re an atheist. Might as well gut a baby and feed on its entrails right there. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/67 "2003-10-31T14:50:40Z")
**Alan Owes Bess** , you should spend a week with me on the subway. The so-called Christians (considering the hatred they spew, I don’t believe they’re really Christian, but it is what they consider themselves) shouting how we’re all going to hell unless we find they’re narrow definition of Jesus Christ, and shouting down any who oppose them, are a weekly ‘treat’. And never tell one of them you’re an atheist. Might as well gut a baby and feed on its entrails right there. ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/68 "2003-10-31T17:14:57Z")
OMG (whoops), that happens to me all the time, only last Sunday it happened on the bus, which is worse because the ranter is stuck with you and can’t move from car to car, and buses are so widely spaced it’s not like you can just get out and wait for the next one. Besides, you waste two bucks, even w/ a Metrocard. I happened to be on my way to church in Manhattan. I also happened to have with me a huge bag of food I was giving to the food pantry. Neither mattered to Idiot Shouting Evangelist. Based on their dress, the ladies across the aisle from me were going to a church in the South Bronx or Harlem (sure enough, they got off at 125th), and I don’t think real sinners would be on buses in the northern Bronx at 8:30 on a Sunday morning. I tried to argue with the guy, shout him down, showed him my church envelope and the food, and asked him how he knew that all of us were going to hell, and got a blank look and no answer. He obviously couldn’t even comprehend my question and walked off the bus (before my stop, dammit). I realize now a bit what atheists must feel. Horrible. The guy was impervious to reason and assumed all sorts of things about everyone on the bus because we weren’t ‘his type of Christian’, not that he told us what that was. And BTW, all the shouting public transporation evangelists I see are black and Latino, and I wonder how hard it must be to be an atheist of color. Probably as hard as being gay. ---
**Author:** ![Rashak\_Mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rashak\_Mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rashak_Mani)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/69 "2003-10-31T17:50:19Z")
Tell me about it Mehabitel… I hate sermons… if I liked them I would go to church… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Unwashed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_great_unwashed/32/4791_2.png) [@The\_Great\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/70 "2003-10-31T18:26:42Z")
I’ve noticed that I get a strikingly similar reaction from theists (upon discovering that I am an atheist) as I get from meat-eaters (on discovering that I’m a vegetarian). Just remarkin’. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093/71 "2003-10-31T20:12:46Z")
You’re a vegetarian?! Ewww!! How can you not eat meat?! Are smilies really necessary here? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-the-prejudice-against-atheists/210093.md?page=3)