Cute. But I’m afraid I’m not responsible for whatever hijack is going on. I originally posted my belief that much of the anger floating about today is indeed a result of the ‘culture war’ going on in this country, and I listed several ways in which I felt liberal ideology has harmed society and set the wheels in motion for the conflict that exists today. Among the things I listed as harmful was the left’s embracing of [gangsta] rap music. You and Guinastasia are the ones who chose to focus on my comments about rap music and make them the central issue. My participation since that time has been limited to responding to things you and other posters have said to me.
Up to what? Drug dealing? Drive-by shootings? Cop-killing? Murder? Misogyny?
Nobody died or had to bury young family members or went to prison for decades because of half-tones, jazz or the tango.
Or because of gangsta rap either. You have yet to prove that this is the case. (And for the record, I don’t even LIKE gangsta rap in the first place!)
Ah, but of course. The other old fogeys were idiots, but *this *generation of old fogeys knows what it’s talking about, a grand first in human history. Because you guys are that special.
BTW, if you had bothered to look into the links I provided earlier, you would know jazz songs about drugs and crime were quite common. Curse that Duke Ellington, leading honest young men astray !
And let’s not forget the old “sex, drugs and rock and roll!!!”
And didn’t most jazz musicians play in brothels?
Oh, and a quote from Wiki:
Key word: reflects
More?
Promoting-not causing.
In other words, our unfed creator, gangsta rap is NOT causing anything-it is merely ABOUT the criminal life-which already existed.
(Damned time limits!)
Yeah, that’s the time-worn excuse given by Hollywood to deny the negative influence of it movies. The fact of the matter is that gangsta rap, like Hollywood movies, both reflects and promotes what it portrays.
What on earth do you think the purpose and result of ‘promoting’ is?
THEN OFFER PROOF, GODDAMMIT!!!
(gah, now I think I see why there is all this anger!)
Promote means to advertise. It does not mean to CAUSE. Where the hell do you think these ideas came from in the first place!!! Jesus!!!
I posted about the economic disparity and why that might be a cause of anger. I said that I doubted you could blame that on liberals. And now we’re talking about rap music. Mission accomplished, chief!
I already addressed this upthread.
Guin, Guin, Guin.
You know, despite the fact that you come after me on a regular basis and that we wrangle frequently, I actually think you have a good heart and are a good person. I don’t agree with you politically, but unlike many of my more liberal brethren I don’t hold that against you. So, it kind of pains me to say this but you are embarrassing yourself and you don’t even know it. First of all, are you saying that gangsta rap ‘advertises’ thug life style? If so, I’m happy to say I agree with you wholeheartedly. If not, just what do you think the purpose of advertising (or promotion) is? Is the purpose of cigarette advertising not to ‘cause’ people to smoke the advertised brand? Is the promotion of a healthy lifestyle not intended to ‘cause’ people to adopt that healthy lifestyle? Why are gay rights promoted, if not to ‘cause’ acceptance of gay rights? Why, when cool people in movies dress a certain way or drink certain drinks or use certain products, does it not ‘cause’ a significant number of people to begin to dress similarly, to drink the same drinks or use those same things? Why do you think so many companies pay big bucks to get placement of their products in movies?
Advertising and promotion are essentially the same thing and the effect of both is to cause people to react in a certain way, whether that reaction is to buy the advertised product or to adopt the promoted POV or to emulate the promoted lifestyle.
And now, I got chit to do.
Why would he need proof ? He already stated, and I quote : “I’m not going to waste my time hunting for data that anybody with a lick of sense already knows to be the case to begin with”. So, in other words, if you disagree with him, you don’t know what you’re talking about. And his bias doesn’t need grounding in trivial crap like facts or a basic grasp of history. His gut knows !
Well, spouting nonsense until the other side throws its collective arms up in disgust and ignores whatever you say from then on is one way to win a debate, I suppose.
I’ll conclude with this pertinent, yet intemporal observation : you just don’t get it, Dad, do you ?
Good point. Whatever.
(I will note, that I was not the one saying it was promoting the thug lifestyle – just that there are those who claim it is. Since I don’t even listen to gangsta rap, I couldn’t say.)
Now, if you’ll excuse me, I gotta go snort up a noseful – Eric Clapton just told me to.
You might be amused to know that while Clapton contends that “Cocaine” is actually an anti-drug song, most people fail to realize that. So, in order to make it clear that he is not…ahem…‘promoting’ cocaine use, he has taken in recent years to singing “that dirty cocaine” so as to underline the anti-drug message of the song.
Are you even aware how many of the classic jazz musicians were addicted to and/or died from heroin?
Don’t you see all this arguing and bickering is playing right into the OPs hands?!:eek:
Well, I certainly don’t want these dirty hippieson my lawn or on a college campus.
Another early 18th-Century country heard from…
FYI, Woodstock Nation never got off the ground. That’s why Abbie Hoffman offed himself. Put away the hash pipe and get off my lawn.
:rolleyes:
It should come as no surprise to you that I consider both your and Starving Artist’s prevailing philosophies (which I am aware are not identical) to be the epitome of tinfoil hat looney-tunes. That does not make me a hippy. I have never smoked marijuana in any form. I have never had long hair. I cringe at the fashion sense (if you want to call it that) of the flower children. Frankly, I don’t credit the Flower Child philosophy with much of anything, other than pretty good music.
My modern, liberal, diversity-approving philosophy doesn’t stem from the hippies. It stems from the fact that I would probably kill myself if I found myself transported back in time to the socially-rigid days that you so adore. If I didn’t find myself killed by others due to who I am.
Does it surprise you that people who would have been jailed or killed for who they are back then despise your particular worship of those days? And find your yearning for their return to be disgusting and vile? It really shouldn’t.
sigh I already outlined the contours of this conflict in my last post on this thread. The right in this country is drifting into fascism (though please understand, I don’t mean the kind with concentration camps necessarily). It’s characterized by corporate collusion with government, anti-intellectualism (y’all are going nuts trying to get SA to respond with an appeal to Logos, and I already told y’all the right only appeals to Ethos and Pathos), pro-war attitudes, sexism, flag-waving nationalism, and some enemy ‘other’ (in this case it’s either ‘liberals’-a classic target- or ‘idiots’ who are such fools they get a real job instead of pushing pencils in an office) who are to blame for everything and deserve to be reduced to wage-slavery or oppressed in some other way (like having to ask for ‘permission’ to do anything). There’s a few more, I really just want to take credit for having ‘called’ this one in advance 
Rush Limbagh promotes drug use with his actual drug-addicted behavior. He promotes torture and the Iraq war, which boils down to government-approved murder for corporate profit. Corporate culture’s cornerstone is ‘sex sells’. Are you sure you aren’t mixing up your targets?
Gangsta rap is art that happens to be the polar opposite of kitsch, which I also went into in my first post and which is likely the real reason the right zeroes in on it. Limbaugh really wants us to kill as many Middle-Easterners as possible. Musicians mostly just want to piss off your mom, because that makes them look cool to girls their age. People may not understand this in my particular terms, but most people ‘get’ this.