# Why was it unexpected that Darth Vader would tell Luke he is his Father? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [August 1, 2020, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016 "2020-08-01T20:16:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/21 "2020-08-02T01:20:39Z")
Was it ever established that Vader even remembered his previous life as Anakin Skywalker? ETA - nevermind. Vader recognized Obi Wan when he met him on the Death Star, ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/22 "2020-08-02T01:23:51Z")
So we’re putting spoilers right in the thread title now? Sheesh! ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/23 "2020-08-02T01:45:26Z")
For a 40 year old movie? ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/24 "2020-08-02T01:50:54Z")
Some of us are still working our way through the series. I’m only up to the holiday special. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/25 "2020-08-02T02:11:29Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Ya’ll are reaching. “Hiding” him with Skywalker relatives on the same world where Vader grew up, with Obi-Wan just down the road still under the same freakin’ last name by which Vader knew him when both were Jedi knights, was _stoopid_ with two O’s. There’s no way around it. ‘The Force told me to do it this way.’ Could that help get around it? Be it Yoda or Obi-Wan: upon clearing one’s mind and meditating tall buildings in a single bound, would he calmly say something philosophical before offering up a shrug and going with the flow? ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/26 "2020-08-02T02:17:05Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > Some of us are still working our way through the series. I’m only up to the holiday special. Bwahahahahahaha! That’s an hour of your life you’ll never get back. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/27 "2020-08-02T02:36:09Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > And yet, Vader never did go searching for him, so it’s a moot point. But the empire was scouring the galaxy for former Jedi to exterminate as part of the Great Jedi Purge. You’d think old Ben Kenobi would be an obvious tell to those imperial inquisitors. Unless “Kenobi” was as common as “Smith” in the Empire 😉 . Imperial Inquisitor #1: “Hey do you think any of these old Jedi might be trying to hide out under their real names? They seem like a pretty unimaginative bunch. Howabout that Obi-Wan Kenobi guy that cut off Lord Vader’s legs? Think we should do a database search? Or even just send a flyer to the planetary governors and local constabularies? ‘Be on the lookout’ and all that? Twenty million quatloo award for information leading to extermination maybe?” II #2: “What!? Not even the Jedi were that stupid. And we don’t have the discretionary funds for rewards! Death Stars don’t just build themselves you know. Besides there must be 80 million Kenobis in the gamma quadrant alone. Where would we even start?” II #1 "Yeah, I guess you’re right." ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/28 "2020-08-02T02:38:17Z")
Ever stop and think how that all-powerful “Force” must have been pure BS, since Vader didn’t even recognize his own children until the second movie? ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/29 "2020-08-02T02:43:40Z")
Vader didn’t know he had any living children. As far as the galaxy’s-most-adept-force-user not being able to detect them, well, that’s a different story… ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/30 "2020-08-02T02:46:55Z")
I can’t speak for Yoda, but I read the first book when it was published, and it was obvious that “Darth Vader” = “Dark Father,” so I certainly didn’t find it unexpected. ---
**Author:** ![erysichthon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d07c76/32.png) [@erysichthon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erysichthon)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/31 "2020-08-02T02:50:34Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Oh, I agree with that. It’s clear that Lucas had no idea that Luke was Vader’s son when he filmed “Star Wars” (no number needed). Maybe so, but I like how Alec Guinness gets a shifty, evasive expression when Luke asks “How did my father die?” Obi-Wan looks like he’s thinking, “Oh, shit, I wish he hadn’t asked me that. Well, I hope he buys this bullshit story I’m about to feed him.” It may not have been planned that way, but it works. Personally, if I had been Vader, I would have told Luke IMMEDIATELY. No lengthy lightsaber duel, and no cutting Luke’s hand off and cornering him over a bottomless pit. The moment he showed up in Cloud City, I’d say, “I’m your father. Let’s go have a beer and talk about it. I have a proposition that may interest you—how does ruling the galaxy as father and son sound?” Then, if Luke says no, freeze him and ship him off to the Emperor. That wouldn’t have made for a very exciting third act, though. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/32 "2020-08-02T03:49:00Z")
> [@erysichthon](#): > > Personally, if I had been Vader, I would have told Luke IMMEDIATELY. No lengthy lightsaber duel, and no cutting Luke’s hand off and cornering him over a bottomless pit. The moment he showed up in Cloud City, I’d say, “I’m your father. Let’s go have a beer and talk about it. I have a proposition that may interest you—how does ruling the galaxy as father and son sound?” Then, if Luke says no, freeze him and ship him off to the Emperor. That wouldn’t have made for a very exciting third act, though. Apparently when they were filming, there were only three people who knew about the big reveal—George Lucas, James Earl Jones, and Mark Hamill. While they were filming, the line was “Obi Wan killed your father.” It wasn’t changed to the voiceover “I am your father” until later and it was a big sworn secret. Maybe a couple other crew members knew. This is according to Mark Hamill. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/33 "2020-08-02T05:22:03Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > For a 40 year old movie? I like to point out when people say “you can’t spoil a X-year-old movie/TV show” that, just as the [XKCD comic](https://xkcd.com/1053/) noted, there are always younger people coming up in the pipeline who have not yet experienced the thing in question. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/34 "2020-08-02T05:26:11Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > a’ll are reaching. “Hiding” him with Skywalker relatives on the same world where Vader grew up, with Obi-Wan just down the road still under the same freakin’ last name by which Vader knew him when both were Jedi knights, was _stoopid_ with two O’s. Everything about the prequel trilogy was stupid. There’s simply no getting around it; those stories didn’t even make sense within themselves. All three movies are full of logical idiocies and plot holes you could fit the Death Star into. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/35 "2020-08-02T05:29:37Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > So we’re putting spoilers right in the thread title now? Sheesh! > [@cochrane](#): > > For a 40 year old movie? > [@SlackerInc](#): > > I like to point out when people say “you can’t spoil a X-year-old movie/TV show” that, just as the [XKCD comic](https://xkcd.com/1053/) noted, there are always younger people coming up in the pipeline who have not yet experienced the thing in question. It was a joke. Maybe there’s an XKCD comic for that… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/36 "2020-08-02T13:03:28Z")
> [@erysichthon](#): > > Maybe so, but I like how Alec Guinness gets a shifty, evasive expression when Luke asks “How did my father die?” Obi-Wan looks like he’s thinking, “Oh, shit, I wish he hadn’t asked me that. Well, I hope he buys this bullshit story I’m about to feed him.” It may not have been planned that way, but it works. Similarly, when Han gives the “twelve parsecs” line, Obi-Wan has an eye-roll that seems to say "Yeah, right, and next you’re going to send us out for a bucket of turboprop wash, right? ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/37 "2020-08-02T13:30:57Z")
Similarly, in the [“What a piece of junk!”…“I made a lot of special modifications myself”](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mrx24jofi0w) exchange, Obi-Wan is giving a massive eye-roll when Han delivers that last line. (Which, full disclosure, I had never even noticed in over 40 years; I only now see it because someone pointed it out in the comments section for that YouTube video.) ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/38 "2020-08-02T13:51:20Z")
> [@Biffster](#): > > Hold on there; Yoda only ever said that Luke must confront Vader. He never told Luke he had to kill him. Luke is a teenager - he’s going hear “Confront” as “Fight” - and he already wanted to kill Vader for several reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Galactus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galactus/32/3581_2.png) [@Galactus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Galactus)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/39 "2020-08-02T15:40:20Z")
If Obi-wan was going to stay on the same planet as Luke why didn’t he just raise him himself and train him the whole time? ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2020, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016/40 "2020-08-02T16:33:22Z")
Diapers? Is even the Force powerful enough to battle the evil that an infant excretes daily? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-it-unexpected-that-darth-vader-would-tell-luke-he-is-his-father/917016.md?page=3)