Actually, that is exactly what you did. You said it was funny - and accurate.
Apparently you are getting away with it, as Syntropy is with his trolling remark, so you will have to try a little harder.
Regards,
Shodan
In what way is it a copout? I was not discussing **TubaDiva **or her PM. I neither condemned nor defended her or what she said. The question was why she didn’t get warned/admonished/whatever for her PM, and I said we don’t police anybody’s PMs.
This is not a standalone message board. It is owned and operated by a newspaper chain. When I became a mod, I was asked to be very careful about copyright issues, and err on the side of caution. As far as I know (not being a lawyer myself), the copyright status of private letters and emails is still questionable, and the rules do say not to post copyrighted material, and I have tried to be consistent about telling people not to post any private correspondence without the author’s permission.
From that same rule thread:
All of that said, I may not be up-to-date on this. Let me check with the admins and make sure I’m correct before continuing to discuss it.
I’m trying to be polite and helpful, wring. Mind returning the favor?
Her. Really, this is not the first time I have said so. Please try for at least one factually accurate post.
InvisibleWombat; I understand the prohibition against copyrighted material, but do PM’s fall under that category? In addition, someone upthread (dogbutler I think) posted they have a quote from correspondence in their sig; should they remove it? Is it only prohibitive when that quote paints the corresponding party in a poor light?
Mate, this is painfully stupid as a reason to justify banning someone. At best - at best - it is an argument for a warning.
I appreciate that you’re attempting to answer.
“bullshit” was specifically addressed by Fenris as an ‘ok’ word to use in this forum. It was not meant as a personal attack, and I’m rather dumbfounded that you perceived it as such.
In your explanation here - please consider that when a mod specifically posts “This is a rule” and then has to shift around and explain that it’s their own interpretation, taken to the extreme of another rule, it does indeed look like rules and explanations therein are rather arbitrary - can you not see that?
:dubious:
Copyright? Really? That’s a pretty weird reason to argue posting a PM is against the rules.
This is a good question, and I don’t know the answer.
You sending an abusive PM to a mod or admin might be construed as breaking the prime rule (“don’t be a jerk”), but I don’t know. I’ve gotten some pretty nasty PMs and have never taken action on one.
If you received a PM you considered abusive from a mod, I would recommend forwarding it to an admin. If you got one from an admin, I’d suggest forwarding it to Ed Zotti. I have no idea what to do if you get one from Ed ;).
The problem, of course, is the definition of “abusive.”
From the same post you cited:
That’s for works of which the copyright status is not at all questionable.
Indeed. Copyright is a stunningly stupid excuse.
Please look at what I said in context. I made it VERY clear that I was not a part of the decision to ban Seven. I was very specifically answering a question as to whether it was okay to quote PMs.
I’m trying to be polite and answer some questions in the thread. I didn’t perceive your response as a personal attack, but there’s no question it was rude.
I confess. I’ve been a moderator here for over a year, and I really don’t have that much cause to reread the rules. I thought it was specifically written there, but it appears that it isn’t. I was wrong.
Still, I have been enforcing it the whole time I’ve been a mod and nobody has ever argued with me about it before. Perhaps because disclosing the contents of correspondence that people consider private is considered a serious breach of etiquette, no matter what your feeling on legality or ethics are.
Why weird, Giraffe? It is a copyright issue, isn’t it?
So now the justification is the PMs fall under the copyright rule? :dubious:
If that is the case (and that is a huge if):
-
How many other posters have been insta-banned for posting copyrighted material? I seem to recall that they get told to knock it off.
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Short bits of songs, poems, etc. have always been allowed under fair use. Why would taking one line out of a longer PM be any different?
Seriously? That’s the best you can come up with?
So, to sum up: Seven violated no explicitly written/posted rule, was banned by a capricious Mod, and now the Mods in general are furiously backpedaling to make it seem like this banning is somehow legitimate.
Gotcha. Thanks for clarifying.
I have to say I’m pretty surprised* that an admin has not made a statement in this thread. It was my understanding that only admins could actually ban someone, so why hasn’t the person responsible for the banning come forward to explain their reasoning? Managers should not sit back and let their staff fight their battles for them.
*Ok, you got me, I’m not surprised at all.
Not exactly channeling the Dean ourself, are we?
Yours was the implication that this place was being run like a fiefdom. If so, I see no signs of deforestation. The truth is, of course, that the vast majority of the members have no unpleasant interactions with the staff at all. The rules are hardly oppressive.
You want a cite for an opinion? You are wise not to hold your breath.
What? What? I mean…what the fuck are you talking about here, dude?
It’s against federal law (apparently) to share a PM on the board; however, it’s perfectly legal to forward a PM to a third party with the hopes that somebody, somewhere will do something about it. Unless, of course, the abusive PM is from an administrator, in which case, there’s literally no recourse because if you post it publically, you’ll be violating federal law (apparently) and, at the minimum, you will be banned. But all of that is a moot point, I guess, since you just implied that what Tuba said to Seven was not abusive. I assume that’s because, by definition, SDMB admins cannot violate the number 1 SDMB rule (don’t be a jerk).
“bullshit” is rude? Huh. I’ll admit it’s not my “the pastor’s here” language, but fuck (not to be confused with “buttfuck”), I thought this was specifically an adult board. Hell, ‘bullshit’ doesn’t even get you a PG 13 rating, does it?
Nothing is ever going to be explained to everyone’s satisfaction. We’ve been down this road before. Seven’s banning is a joke, this whole damn place has become a joke, and the punchline is not going to change.
- Again, per John Corrado, Mod, he disagreed 100% with you.
This is the only time I’m aware of that the issue was ever addressed.
In addition, Cecil in one of his first few books said that while you couldn’t publish someone’s letters for profit, the letters were yours to do with as you wanted. (Cite when I get back home and can check the actual paperbacks)
And finally, one sentence is certaintly fair-use.
So 3 strikes, you’re wrong. Sorry.
Do you always get permission from the original sender before you forward an e-mail?
I’d say the more pressing concern is that it seems any other mods would have to essentially go by one word against another. If a mod sends me an abusive pm, the only evidence I have to present in an email to another mod is my word that it occurred. It’s our reputation against the mod’s. And i’d have to think that a complaint of that kind would be treated quite differently depending on who the complainer is, and who the mod complained to is.
Too, what concerns me would be relative modly authority. If Tuba, or Ed, have the “final say” about moderating actions, as you say that leaves them pretty much able to get off scott-free if they did decide to pm something unpleasant.
Beyond that, if there is any action of that sort, by not allowing it to be addressed on the boards it means that a record can’t be brought up. If a poster (or mod) is banned after a or many nasty messages (assuming some rule is brought up to address them), then to the regular board members it will appear unexplained and sudden, and you’ll get another outcry. Plus there can be no non-mod record, but that’s an old complaint of mine that i’ll leave for the sake of not being a broken record. 