# Why was the telemarketing thread moved to the Pit? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [October 18, 2012, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122 "2012-10-18T13:39:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2012, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/41 "2012-10-18T20:35:36Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I can get my admin fix by zapping spammers. The Bodoni Blast? ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2012, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/42 "2012-10-18T21:36:33Z")
I’m sure if the OP, or any other tele-whateverer wanted to make an “Ask the…” thread in MPSIMS, it would be fine as long as they didn’t post incendiary stuff in their OP. Seriously… you just don’t start an “Ask the…” thread with a whole litany of complaints and a haughty attitude that screams “argument.” ---
**Author:** ![Krav\_Manga](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/krav_manga/32/3153_2.png) [@Krav\_Manga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Krav_Manga)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/43 "2012-10-19T08:07:39Z")
Let’s face it, **Lynn** is like a pretty flower, that smells bad. But if you find this flower along the side of the road while you are on your way back from delivering pizza, you might be able to pick a few and make some serious bank. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/44 "2012-10-19T11:38:21Z")
> [@Krav\_Manga](#): > > Let’s face it, **Lynn** is like a pretty flower, that smells bad. But if you find this flower along the side of the road while you are on your way back from delivering pizza, you might be able to pick a few and make some serious bank. Translation, please? ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/45 "2012-10-19T11:52:12Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > However, I don’t hate transsexuals, black persons or even white persons _nearly_ as much as I dislike telemarketers The biggest assholes in the Family Research Council, the Ku Klux Klan, and the Nation of Islam don’t hate transsexuals, black persons or even white persons as much as I dislike telemarketers. ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/46 "2012-10-19T16:11:15Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > I’m sure if the OP, or any other tele-whateverer wanted to make an “Ask the…” thread in MPSIMS, it would be fine as long as they didn’t post incendiary stuff in their OP. > > Seriously… you just don’t start an “Ask the…” thread with a whole litany of complaints and a haughty attitude that screams “argument.” Seriously, please quote the incendiary part of the OP. The pet peeve stuff may have been a tad naive and tone deaf to how the general public feels about telemarketers but the OP’s remarks were in no way disparaging or mocking. The OP was actually a bit helpful because many people probably do think that surveys/polls are covered by the do not call list and the OP even gave useful advice on how to get them to stop calling you. Yeah, it’s annoying to be called at all, I get it, and I deal with it. It is also far from the biggest annoyance in my life. I also get that this was pretty low hanging fruit for a SD style pile on and I can envision Lynn salivating at the chance to move it to the Pit where everyone could tear apart the OP. Hope he wasn’t seasoned with pepper. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/47 "2012-10-19T16:16:38Z")
> [@Krav\_Manga](#): > > Let’s face it, **Lynn** is like a pretty flower, that smells bad. But if you find this flower along the side of the road while you are on your way back from delivering pizza, you might be able to pick a few and make some serious bank. > [@Crotalus](#): > > Translation, please? Taken from another thread regarding **Diamonds02**. It was funny the first time. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/48 "2012-10-19T16:37:00Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I could foresee that if I left the thread in MPSIMS, that someone (and it wasn’t gonna be me) would have to start issuing Notes and/or Warnings to a bunch of posters. Thank god. We wouldn’t want to have the mods, who volunteered for the job, to you know do the job they wanted so much to do. Thanks again for saving us from ourselves. I look forward to you guys keeping this vigil going and that the next time I can’t control myself and absolutely must break the rules you’ll swoop in and save me. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/49 "2012-10-19T17:19:22Z")
There’s that deft use of sarcasm again. So subtle you might miss it. ---
**Author:** ![Ostrya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/35a633/32.png) [@Ostrya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ostrya)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/50 "2012-10-19T17:58:07Z")
Thanks **The wind of my soul** for taking the time to look into, and also outline for the rest of us the misrepresentation of the quotes attributed to Flyer by Marley. Marley, while picking through those quotes looking for evidence to present to everyone that Flyer is a confrontational poster, did you not notice or realize that the out-of-context snippets you were gathering were unfair and misleading? I haven’t taken the phrase “circling the wagons” seriously in the past but it looks like you’re stooping pretty low in this instance to justify what Lynn Bodoni did. As outlined by **The wind of my soul** , your presentation of those snippets was bogus and dishonest. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/51 "2012-10-19T18:07:02Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Yes, **Flyer** was plenty confrontational about the subject. And that’s an issue of the content of the thread, not the “popularity” of the poster. I disagree. I read those quotes in the thread in context. They did not come off as confrontational. **Flyer** was explaining in a reasonable manner the attitudes and policies of the telemarketing and survey companies. He was responding to comments made to him about why he doesn’t feel bad about his job. Up until the move, there wasn’t anything hostile or confrontational from **Flyer**. (I haven’t read the rest of the thread since the move.) There was an attitude that the company’s policy of continuing to call is reasonable even when the recipient has expressed a desire for the calls to stop, but that was not done in an insulting or harsh manner. People being irritated at telemarketer’s and the survey company policies does not feel like grounds to me for an automatic move. If people can’t obey the rules, they are the ones who should be sanctioned, not the OP of a perfectly reasonable thread conducted in a calm and rational manner. > [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I moved the thread to the Pit because I have awesome precog powers. I could foresee that if I left the thread in MPSIMS, that someone (and it wasn’t gonna be me) would have to start issuing Notes and/or Warnings to a bunch of posters. Then either the thread would have been closed and a new thread started in the Pit, or the original thread would have been moved into the Pit. The only difference would be how many posters got noted or warned. You took the title away because you didn’t want to be bothered by general run of the mill moderating. This was a lot more controversial a case than a spammer, and you were directly involved in the conversation, and have a known dislike for the profession. You should have refrained. > [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Thank god. We wouldn’t want to have the mods, who volunteered for the job, to you know do the job they wanted so much to do. Sorry, **Drunky Smurf** , but we’ve just been calling her out for moderating a thread in which she was participating. The appropriate attitude in this case would definitely have been to refrain. Can’t simultaneously slam her for taking action and whine at her that she doesn’t take enough action. And there’s no rule that says that all the moderators and admins have to be 100% fully engaged and doing every action. They divide up the duties behind the scenes based upon who has what time, access, and inclination. If management agrees that Lynn doesn’t have an assigned forum to moderate and is fine with her hanging back and disposing of the occassional spammer when she catches them, or weighing in when she feels like it but not policing very heavily or consistently\*, then there’s nothing to complain about. * * * - I mean consistently in frequency, I’m not talking about quality. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/52 "2012-10-19T18:12:28Z")
> [@the lone cashew](#): > > Marley, while picking through those quotes looking for evidence to present to everyone that Flyer is a confrontational poster, did you not notice or realize that the out-of-context snippets you were gathering were unfair and misleading? I don’t think they were unfair and misleading, and I don’t want to get into a debate about what kind of person **Flyer** is. My comment was that the read was likely Pit-bound and that the attitude of the OP was one of the reasons I thought it was going in that direction. > [@](#): > > I haven’t taken the phrase “circling the wagons” seriously in the past but it looks like you’re stooping pretty low in this instance to justify what Lynn Bodoni did. I said the thread could’ve stayed in MPSIMS and nothing would’ve been lost by waiting and that there was an appearance of a conflict of interest because **Lynn Bodoni** was critical of the OP and also moved the thread to the Pit. What exactly do you feel I am justifying? ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/53 "2012-10-19T18:24:09Z")
I noticed that Lynn Bodoni now has “Administrator” back under her name again. Is that related to this hoopla? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/54 "2012-10-19T18:25:42Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > Is that related to this hoopla? It’s related to people pointing out that her title wasn’t displaying, yes. The same goes for **TubaDiva**. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/55 "2012-10-19T18:30:49Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Sorry, **Drunky Smurf** , but we’ve just been calling her out for moderating a thread in which she was participating. The appropriate attitude in this case would definitely have been to refrain. Can’t simultaneously slam her for taking action and whine at her that she doesn’t take enough action. I think you’re taking Drunky Smurf’s post much too seriously. Re-read what they wrote and look for the sarcasm. Shouldn’t be too hard to find, they were laying it on pretty thick. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/56 "2012-10-19T19:47:12Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > I think you’re taking Drunky Smurf’s post much too seriously. Re-read what they wrote and look for the sarcasm. Shouldn’t be too hard to find, they were laying it on pretty thick. But, but…the turnip said it was _subtle_. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2012, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/57 "2012-10-19T20:11:56Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > I think you’re taking Drunky Smurf’s post much too seriously. Re-read what they wrote and look for the sarcasm. Shouldn’t be too hard to find, they were laying it on pretty thick. What I read was > [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Thank god. We wouldn’t want to have the mods, who volunteered for the job, to you know do the job they wanted so much to do. Which, when read with sarcasm, indicates that Drunky Smurf is took offence with Lynn’s comment > [@](#): > > …that someone (and it wasn’t gonna be me) would have to start issuing Notes and/or Warnings to a bunch of posters. That was the part of the post I was addressing. He apparently is unhappy she said she wouldn’t have been doing the moderating job that we’re not paying her to do. I see now he also said > [@](#): > > Thanks again for saving us from ourselves. > > I look forward to you guys keeping this vigil going and that the next time I can’t control myself and absolutely must break the rules you’ll swoop in and save me. I see how that is the opposite stance, that he doesn’t want the mods swooping in and doing more moderating. But that just leaves me confused, because he’s simultaneously complaining that Lynn should be moderating more and that she should be moderating less. So that just takes my response and changes it from “you’re advocating the opposite of what others of us are saying” to “you yourself are advocating contradictory positions”. ---
**Author:** ![Ostrya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/35a633/32.png) [@Ostrya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ostrya)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2012, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/58 "2012-10-20T06:07:30Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I don’t think they were unfair and misleading, and I don’t want to get into a debate about what kind of person **Flyer** is. We disagree. As others have pointed out, when taken out of context the quotes you chose were indeed misleading. You were using them to point out that Flyer was taking a combative stance. What you said was “Yes, Flyer was plenty confrontational about the subject. And that’s an issue of the content of the thread, not the “popularity” of the poster.” And then you posted the out-of-context-and-therefore-misleading quotes. They made your point pretty well and I for one was impressed - at least until fellow poster **The wind of my soul** took the trouble to follow up and totally pwned you. Let’s face it, she investigated, and you got busted. > [@](#): > > My comment was that the read was likely Pit-bound and that the attitude of the OP was one of the reasons I thought it was going in that direction. We disagree that the thread had any business being moved to the Pit. You keep saying “it could have gone either way” and I am saying that that is bs, it had no business “going either way”, that is it should have stayed, period. Does it not matter to you that the OP content was reasonable and appropriate for the forum? That it was presented reasonably? Does it not matter to you that the author of the thread chose to put the thread where it was? And not the Pit? I think this kind of thing is a shitty thing to do to the op of an appropriate thread. It’s a notch below disrespectful. It’s not just the tone of the thread that is altered by the move, but from viewpoint of the thread starter, often the very point of the topic becomes meaningless. What might have been intended by the op instead becomes a challenge to protect themselves against a stick poking mob of rabid marauders (many of whom lash out with homemade shanks, and other primitive, sometimes rusty weapons.) No longer does the thread have the same potential to be a learning experience, the potential ignorance fighting thread as before. Its primary existence in the Pit is to serve those that want a hacken-sack to kick, the drama of a hoboken new jersey turnpike pile-on. Marley, if you were the starter of a reasonable thread for the forum, presented it in a reasonable way, wouldn’t you think it was unfair to then have your thread moved to the Pit - for the sole reason that people could then be allowed to fling manure at you _and_ your topic? > [@](#): > > I said the thread could’ve stayed in MPSIMS and nothing would’ve been lost by waiting and that there was an appearance of a conflict of interest because **Lynn Bodoni** was critical of the OP and also moved the thread to the Pit. What exactly do you feel I am justifying? Again, we disagree. I have nothing more to add that has not already been said several times already. Read Irishman’s post #51, for example. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2012, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/59 "2012-10-20T06:27:06Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > I think so. That’s what it’s for. > > However, I don’t hate transsexuals, black persons or even white persons _nearly_ as much as I dislike telemarketers. And I dislike telemarketers regardless of color or sexual orientation. He wasn’t a telemarketer and never said he was a telemarketer. He wasn’t trying to sell anything. He was a poll-taker. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2012, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122/60 "2012-10-20T06:49:17Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > My comment was that the read was likely Pit-bound and that the attitude of the OP was one of the reasons I thought it was going in that direction. The thread is currently spirited, but mostly MPSIMS/IMHO commentary - only occasional death-wishes. I think it mostly could have been controlled. And here is the big news-flash: Many people who work at tele-survey/telemarketing companies actually don’t think of themselves as the scum of the Earth! Yes, it’s remarkable. When they describe themselves in positive terms and their detractors in negative terms - they might possibly be giving their opinion rather than trolling. Or you could call it an “attitude”, I suppose. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-the-telemarketing-thread-moved-to-the-pit/638122.md?page=4)