# Why was this record not only thrown out, but its holder banned for life? (Atari game speed run) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 4, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170 "2018-02-04T17:23:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/1 "2018-02-04T17:23:09Z")
> **[Longest-standing video game record declared ‘impossible,’ thrown out after 35...](https://www.polygon.com/2018/1/29/16944736/atari-dragster-game-world-record-banned)** > > Record-holder banned from leaderboards going forward I am puzzled by the extreme nature of the action Twin Galaxies took. Throwing out the record I completely understand. But nothing in the article seems to give any indication there was actual cheating involved–from the article it seems most reasonable to think the recorded time was simply mistaken. Why was the record holder completely banned from all of Twin Galaxies’ leaderboards as a result of this record being shown false? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/2 "2018-02-04T17:26:14Z")
It’s right there in the article. > [@](#): > > **Yet Rogers never provided recorded or other proof of his 5.51 time in Dragster, a sticking point in the years that followed.** His personal website offered a simple explanation of how he achieved his unbeatable time, while maintaining that Activision’s certification of his time — highlighted in one of the company’s newsletters — was enough to cement his place on the gaming leaderboards. > > Yet when Twin Galaxies introduced a new process for disputing scores in July 2017, Rogers’ time in Dragster was one of the first to be challenged. In August 2017, several community members submitted Rogers’ 5.51-second Dragster finish for review. A thread on the Twin Galaxies’ forum about how Rodgers’ Dragster time was technically impossible ran for nearly 300 pages and included almost 3,000 posts. Its most notable skeptic, who goes by the handle Omnigamer,\*\* wrote that they failed to reproduce Rogers’ time in a tool-assisted run, leading them to analyze the game’s code and conclude that no one could complete the racing game that fast without some serious cheating.\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Shine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr_shine/32/464_2.png) [@Mr\_Shine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Shine)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2018, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/3 "2018-02-04T17:34:14Z")
I saw a youtube video recently, which I’m not going to hunt for to cite, but it showed that Rogers has a very dodgy history; inputting scores himself into the database, tapes mysteriously disappearing, and scores that are flat out impossible, (Dragster, another game where you’re flying a plane and you only lose speed by making vertical movements, yet taking all the obstacles away still you can’t reach the speed he quoted, several games where you only receive points in certain increments that would make his published scores impossible, and several scores too high, as you would reach a game ending “kill screen” before you could get high enough. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2018, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/4 "2018-02-04T17:49:22Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > It’s right there in the article. That doesn’t clarify it at all. It still seems reasonable to suppose the record was _mistaken_. Like, what’s the positive evidence he actually cheated? ETA: Note that Activision even said in 1982 the time was impossible, that it was .03 seconds faster than the computer-simulated maximum, and then he told them _something something_ and this convinced them. Which again makes it seem like a mistake rather than cheating. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2018, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/5 "2018-02-04T17:50:24Z")
> [@Mr\_Shine](#): > > I saw a youtube video recently, which I’m not going to hunt for to cite, but it showed that Rogers has a very dodgy history; inputting scores himself into the database, tapes mysteriously disappearing, and scores that are flat out impossible, (Dragster, another game where you’re flying a plane and you only lose speed by making vertical movements, yet taking all the obstacles away still you can’t reach the speed he quoted, several games where you only receive points in certain increments that would make his published scores impossible, and several scores too high, as you would reach a game ending “kill screen” before you could get high enough. This helps! ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2018, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/6 "2018-02-05T06:46:48Z")
> [@Mr\_Shine](#): > > I saw a youtube video recently, which I’m not going to hunt for to cite, but it showed that Rogers has a very dodgy history; inputting scores himself into the database, tapes mysteriously disappearing, and scores that are flat out impossible, (Dragster, another game where you’re flying a plane and you only lose speed by making vertical movements, yet taking all the obstacles away still you can’t reach the speed he quoted, several games where you only receive points in certain increments that would make his published scores impossible, and several scores too high, as you would reach a game ending “kill screen” before you could get high enough. I think this might be it: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8e-H4sEHB54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8e-H4sEHB54) ---
**Author:** ![Gus\_Gusterson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85f322/32.png) [@Gus\_Gusterson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gus_Gusterson)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2018, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/7 "2018-02-05T16:33:12Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > ETA: Note that Activision even said in 1982 the time was impossible, that it was .03 seconds faster than the computer-simulated maximum, and then he told them _something something_ and this convinced them. > > Which again makes it seem like a mistake rather than cheating. Todd Rogers himself told that story. There’s no reason to believe that it’s true. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2018, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-was-this-record-not-only-thrown-out-but-its-holder-banned-for-life-atari-game-speed-run/808170/8 "2018-02-05T17:47:38Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > [Longest-standing video game record declared ‘impossible,’ thrown out after 35 years (update) - Polygon](https://www.polygon.com/2018/1/29/16944736/atari-dragster-game-world-record-banned) > > I am puzzled by the extreme nature of the action Twin Galaxies took. Throwing out the record I completely understand. But nothing in the article seems to give any indication there was actual cheating involved–from the article it seems most reasonable to think the recorded time was simply mistaken. > > Why was the record holder completely banned from all of Twin Galaxies’ leaderboards as a result of this record being shown false? Rogers also claimed a 15 million score in Donkey Kong, a 1,698 in Wabbit, and a 32.67 in Barnstorming - all of which are impossible. These are not the only ones, either. The Dragster claim is part of a pattern of fraud and corruption, and should be understood in that context.