# Why would English Golfer have Visa Problems to get to USA for the US Open **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 15, 2011, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589 "2011-06-15T18:13:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/21 "2011-06-16T16:04:40Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > How does this kind of thing affect UK/Irish citizens who regularly travel back and forth from the United States on business? Or touring European rock bands? Do Coldplay and U2 regularly get grief from U.S. officials when coming to America to perform? > > Was this difficult for Robert Rock because he wasn’t a regular “commuter” to the U.S.? Are visas easier/quicker if you’ve got a solid history of Europe-to-U.S. travel? P visas are work visas, and every time you come to the U.S. to perform/compete professionally, you need a new one. Yes, that includes Coldplay and U2, who presumably know enough to plan ahead at this point, which makes the whole process much easier (and cheaper). Of course, it’s much less work (and therefore cheaper) to simply update a previous P visa petition than to create a new one from scratch. First the petition has to be filed with USCIS, and once it’s approved (which can take 15 days or longer even if you pay an extra fee to expedite it), then and only then can you apply for a visa. It’s a process, and it takes time. There’s a huge gray area regarding what constitutes “work” vs. a business visit for meetings, etc. The former requires a work visa appropriate for the type of work; the latter may not - you could just come on the visa waiver. Eva Luna, Immigration Paralegal ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/22 "2011-06-16T18:56:53Z")
Robert Rock hired a cab for $1000 for a cab from Newark to Bethesda, MD. Got to the Hotel at 3:30 am. Got to the course at 11 am. Has started his round Par-Par. There is a potential MasterCard Priceless commercial brewing. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/23 "2011-06-16T20:29:53Z")
At this rate, this guy is going to need to win the Open just to break even on the week. ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/24 "2011-06-16T23:35:54Z")
I am getting some 2nd and 3rd hand information from a friend in the media that US Golf Association had a rep from the US Embassy to help with SNAFUs at the qualifying site. Apparently Rock thought he had all his paperwork in order. Anyways he had a very incredible round today, he shot 1 under par and is currently T10th. Inserting obligatory quote: > [@](#): > > Can you smell what the Rock has cooking? ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/25 "2011-06-17T01:22:04Z")
Well, apparently there was something slightly nefarious in Robert Rock’s past. There was an issue with [Drinking while a college student](http://www.golfweek.com/news/2011/jun/16/visa-issues-put-rock-hard-place-open/) at Georgia State University in Atlanta at age 18. Not sure if it is just underaged drinking or there is DUI implication ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/26 "2011-06-17T01:33:20Z")
This sentence states that only needed a visa because of his past: [Quote=linked article] Rock needed a visa due to drinking incident he had when he was in the U.S. as a 18-year-old at Georgia State University. [/quote] That can’t be true, though, can it? I can see where a criminal charge in the U.S. would make it more _difficult_ to get a visa, but that’s not what it says. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/27 "2011-06-17T02:21:37Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > This sentence states that only needed a visa because of his past: That can’t be true, though, can it? I can see where a criminal charge in the U.S. would make it more _difficult_ to get a visa, but that’s not what it says. If he has a conviction on his record, even a minor one, he may well need a special [waiver](http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/ineligibilities/ineligibilities_1364.html)to get a visa. Those take longer to be adjudicated than visas do. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/28 "2011-06-17T02:42:07Z")
> [@Eva\_Luna](#): > > If he has a conviction on his record, even a minor one, he may well need a special [waiver](http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/ineligibilities/ineligibilities_1364.html)to get a visa. Those take longer to be adjudicated than visas do. Also, people from Visa Waiver-eligible countries still need visas for brief business/personal trips that would otherwise be covered under the Visa Waiver Program [if they have criminal convictions:](http://travel.state.gov/visa/temp/without/without_1990.html#national) “A visa must be requested if the traveler…Has a criminal record or other condition making them ineligible for a visa.” ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/29 "2011-06-17T03:35:40Z")
I missed some words (stupid laptop) in that post, Should have been “He had trouble getting a visa…” ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/30 "2011-06-17T09:01:04Z")
People are surprised that it is difficult getting a US Visa? It is rather more difficult to get a US Visa than it is to apply for clemacy from Genghis Khan. And certainly more stressful. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/31 "2011-06-17T14:06:57Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > People are surprised that it is difficult getting a US Visa? To be honest: kinda surprised, yeah. Lots of people from all over travel to the U.S. all the time. Is it specifically work visas that are tough to get? I can understand it being situationally difficult, but really can’t understand that the default would be “difficult”. Also, I assumed there were at least two tiers of processing: one for the _hoi polloi_, and another for people like Bono, Russell Crowe, Richard Branson, Prince Charles, etc. I also wonder how it works for diplomats and such. I mean, everytime I see Australian Keith Urban at a charity event in the States … he had to get a one-time special visa for that? He probably lives in the U.S. now, though … might not be the best example. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/32 "2011-06-17T14:12:23Z")
LATE EDIT: I skipped over the posts about the drinking-underage conviction, and \*\*Eva Luna’s \*\*clarifications. So Rock’s situation isn’t typical, and it’s not quite impossible to get a work visa quickly, especially with folks in high places helping out. Situation normal 😃 ---
**Author:** ![wmfellows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c2a13f/32.png) [@wmfellows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wmfellows)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/33 "2011-06-17T14:26:26Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > To be honest: kinda surprised, yeah. Lots of people from all over travel to the U.S. all the time. Is it specifically work visas that are tough to get? I can understand it being situationally difficult, but really can’t understand that the default would be “difficult”. No, US visas generally have become staggeringly fucking difficult, so much so we for our corporate purposes avoid sending people to the US for meetings if it’s not clear they can fly on that waiver program. Real pain. > [@](#): > > Also, I assumed there were at least two tiers of processing: one for the _hoi polloi_, and another for people like Bono, Russell Crowe, Richard Branson, Prince Charles, etc. I also wonder how it works for diplomats and such. I have heard that this is not the case. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/34 "2011-06-17T14:40:54Z")
> [@wmfellows](#): > > I have heard that this is not the case. I posted in haste – I should have specified _unofficially_. When you’re dealing with fallible human beings, no protocol is ever followed 100% of the time. Harsh penalties or not. … How do state visits work? When the Obamas receive a visiting head of state … what kind of hoops did that head of state and – especially – his/her staff have to jump through? Or is that covered under a separate set of rules, since it’s diplomacy? Another way to approach this is _reductio ad absurdum_: how does getting a work visa into the U.S. compare to, say, getting one for North Korea? There’s a difference between byzantine and impossible. I realize I’m being snotty here, but people do travel to the U.S. all time. It’s not like it’s bizarre to see travelers from another country. There have been people from all over the world at most of my jobs. I guess appearance belies reality. I do realize we have direct expert testimony in this thread with the prsence of **Eva Luna** , and I do appreciate her contributions here. I am beginning to understand, but I am flummoxed – [nonGQeditorial comment] the U.S. shouldn’t be running this scared. Not of a guy like Robert Rock, anyway. [/nonGQeditorial comment] ---
**Author:** ![wmfellows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c2a13f/32.png) [@wmfellows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wmfellows)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/35 "2011-06-17T14:58:56Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Another way to approach this is _reductio ad absurdum_: how does getting a work visa into the U.S. compare to, say, getting one for North Korea? There’s a difference between byzantine and impossible. We’ve found it harder than the 3rd world places you or someone else mentioned. Although that is subjective anecdote. > [@](#): > > I realize I’m being snotty here, but people do travel to the U.S. all time. It’s not like it’s bizarre to see travelers from another country. That says not very much in my opinion, USA is a big destination, volume effects. And of course visa waivers, that is people who don’t need visas for short term trips. ---
**Author:** ![Neptunian\_Slug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce7236/32.png) [@Neptunian\_Slug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neptunian_Slug)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/36 "2011-06-17T15:15:14Z")
DUIs can also be a bitch getting into Canada. I think there is a 10-year waiting period after a conviction to enter, unless you go through some waiver process after five years. So I am sure this sort of thing isn’t uncommon in some countries. Once they put a flag on your record for anything, it’s probably too much of a pain in the ass to bother applying. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/37 "2011-06-17T15:26:12Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > How do state visits work? When the Obamas receive a visiting head of state … what kind of hoops did that head of state and – especially – his/her staff have to jump through? Or is that covered under a separate set of rules, since it’s diplomacy? heads of state, diplomats, and foreign government officials all require visas to visit the United States on official business. They will have either official or diplomatic passports which are distinct from their own personal passports that they may use for vacation or whatnot. Same thing with US government officials – they will travel on passports that are not the same as personal passports. Official visas are required to travel to countries that participate in the visa waiver program – for example, if a US official wants to visit Japan, he must get a visa from the Japanese government. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/38 "2011-06-17T15:26:24Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > … I do realize we have direct expert testimony in this thread with the prsence of **Eva Luna** , and I do appreciate her contributions here. I am beginning to understand, but I am flummoxed – [nonGQeditorial comment] the U.S. shouldn’t be running this scared. Not of a guy like Robert Rock, anyway. [/nonGQeditorial comment] I also have had experience of the system, from a different perspective than that of Eva Luna. Back before 9/11 I applied for and got a job in the U.S., and my employer was responsible for arranging my work visa. They used specialist immigration lawyers to do it, and it took nearly a year to get the visa, even though it was a kind of visa that doesn’t have any annual quota. So, even then before intensified security, the process was slow and difficult even for specialists in the field. My other story illustrates how the process is so byzantine that even the bureaucrats administering it have trouble. A couple of years after I got my work visa, I won the Green Card Lottery, so I could change from a temporary status to being a permanent resident. While you are going from the visa to a green card, you are in “adjustment of status”, and normally cannot leave the U.S. However, I needed to go to conferences in Australia and Canada while I was in adjustment of status, so I obtained an “advance parole” to allow me to leave the U.S. and re-enter the country. Re-entering from Australia at LAX wasn’t a problem – they’ve probably seen advance paroles often enough there – but re-entering from Canada by road at Buffalo I was held up for about an hour. From where I was told to wait, I could see into the back office, and saw several immigration officials consulting for a long time over my documentation. This was, of course, at one of the busiest entry points into the United States: it seems that no one on the evening shift had come across this kind of issue before. If the bureaucrats don’t understand the system, what hope have ordinary people? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/39 "2011-06-17T15:48:23Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Another way to approach this is _reductio ad absurdum_: how does getting a work visa into the U.S. compare to, say, getting one for North Korea? There’s a difference between byzantine and impossible. > > I realize I’m being snotty here, but people do travel to the U.S. all time. It’s not like it’s bizarre to see travelers from another country. There have been people from all over the world at most of my jobs. I guess appearance belies reality. I do realize we have direct expert testimony in this thread with the prsence of **Eva Luna** , and I do appreciate her contributions here. I am beginning to understand, but I am flummoxed – [nonGQeditorial comment] the U.S. shouldn’t be running this scared. Not of a guy like Robert Rock, anyway. [/nonGQeditorial comment] Getting a US Visa is without question the most difficult of all the major countries. It is so much that many corporate entities avoid US travel unless absolotly necessary, indeed video conferencing and Telepresence are now being employed (despite the inconvenience of time difference) where for other markets they are business trips. Furthermore its not just the visa, it is the whole immigration process, you are treated like a criminal till about the time you reach the taxi to the airport. You can jump on a plane to get to London if needed, no problem. Not so NYC. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2011, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589/40 "2011-06-17T15:59:20Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Getting a US Visa is without question the most difficult of all the major countries. It is so much that many corporate entities avoid US travel unless absolotly necessary, indeed video conferencing and Telepresence are now being employed (despite the inconvenience of time difference) where for other markets they are business trips. > > Furthermore its not just the visa, it is the whole immigration process, you are treated like a criminal till about the time you reach the taxi to the airport. > > You can jump on a plane to get to London if needed, no problem. Not so NYC. To be fair, I spoke to a Mexican client yesterday who was telling me it’s now a huge PITA for Mexicans to apply for Canadian visitor visas (his brother had just done it); some Mexicans started applying for asylum in Canada, and so instead of jumping on the plane, Mexicans now have to apply for Canadian visas using some horrendous, long form. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-would-english-golfer-have-visa-problems-to-get-to-usa-for-the-us-open/585589.md?page=3)